Quartine Tanks Stocking

[cowgirluntamed]

Ok, before I get to my questions on what will be my three quarantine tanks, I just want to get this off my chest a bit. (sorry if it is a bit lengthy!)
 
Last tested(20 gallon tank), my water parameters were
PH-8.2 (has always been this so nice and stable, I'm lucky there)
KH-12
GH-14
 
The KH and GH fluctuate a tiny bit but not bad. I consider my water moderately hard.
 
However, I love tetras and am interested in rasboras and cories. I've looked into some harder water fish before and I just don't care for the look of them. Most cichlids I just don't like..they get pretty big and you can't really do plants. I'm trying to do a good planted tank and am starting to figure out what will actually grow in my tanks with some of my lights. Each tank I currently have is different. I've finally found water lettuce, which I THINK is going to be a great plant, though it's still a bit early in the running. I have a new water sprite that I'm still waiting on it to settle to see how well it does.
 
Anyway, I want a big tank with lots of little fish. That is my goal. The most important thing to me in this hobby is to enjoy the fish that you keep, right? Otherwise, why keep fish at all? I am in the process of rebuilding a 55 gallon tank for this purpose(and also restocking the 20 gallon as well). So I can enjoy the fish I love seeing. I AM trying to stay with the more adaptable of the species though(and if I have some of these wrong, please let me know). I'm trying to stick with the best temperature for the entire group of fish and I want to do the plants(need more experimenting to know what grows, but it's a process!) and I want the stocking and temperament so everybody is nice and happy with nice stable water. The parameters I can't do anything about but I can do everything else possible.
 
I currently have tetras in my 20 gallon tank(black neon tetras and glowlight tetras) that to me, seem to be doing very well. They are 2 years old or so and still seem to be going strong and have great colors and occasionally even breeding behavior. I have male guppies in my 10 that I've had more issues with than the tetras by far. So to me...I am successful at keeping the tetras in my water so far. No major issues with them except introduced things from adding more fish from petsmart tanks without quarantining first. I know there are a lot of people that won't agree with me about keeping these types of fish that I will list in my water. I will move one day, and who knows what water I will have then, hopefully something better to keep these nice fish in. But for now, I find stable is really great. I've looked into ways to dilute the water but it will just be too expensive at this time to do that, so I'll take stable water right now. Now, back to my questions!
 
 
Ok, my current fish are going to go into the 55 when it is up and ready. These fish include:
(from the ten gallon)
2 male guppies
(from the 20 gallon)
3 glowlight tetras
7 black neon tetras
 
Now, I will be ordering a couple of bristlenoses from a breeder off of aquabid. I asked them the size they get to and they said 4 inches. One will go in the 55 and one will go in the 20. I will be getting these two first while my big tank is being set up and cycled. They will be in a 10 gallon quarantine which I will be purchasing shortly(the fish won't be ready for a month) and getting it set up to hopefully grow some water lettuce in before they come.
 
This means...once my big tank is done, and the current fish are moved(including the two bristlenoses), I will have a 20 gallon, and two 10 gallon tanks for quarantining so I can buy a bunch of fish at once to quarantine. My questions relate to HOW to stock these tanks. And to make a note...only the 20 will be going back to a display tank once the quarantining is complete. One 10 gallon will be reserved for well, quarantine/hospital duties, and the other is going to go to my betta, Aiden, who is right now in a nice 5 gallon planted tank and doing amazing. I just want more space for him! Lol. I can use the same stuff that I have on his tank right now for the 10 so upgrading it wasn't a problem, but I figured I can get a bit more use if I use it for quarantining first!
 
I am wanting to purchase my fish online from petsolutions. They have(last I looked) $20 overnight shipping with a two week guarantee. I've also seen decent reviews of them. And they have great prices(I checked my list against them including shipping price with prices from the same fish at petsmart...and I can get a better deal at petsolutions!). Now for the list of fish....
 
 
15 neon tetras(to go into the 20 gallon display at the end of all this with the one bristlenose that will already be in there)(arrival size appx .5 -1 inch)
15 harlequin rasboras(arrival size appx .75-1.5 inches)
15 von rio orange flame tetras (arrival size appx .5-1 inch)
12 glowlight tetras(to make my current 3 go to 15) (arrival size appx 1-1.5 inches)
10 peppered cories (arrival size appx small .75-1.25 inches, Medium 1.5-2 inches--only one thing to buy..so not sure what size these would truly come)
 
I believe I've read and had people say to me that the neons need a bit more mature tank. And since the 20 would be their home afterwards anyway...it would make sense to put them in the 20 at the beginning. I just worry about catching any other fish that I would put in there with them without netting them. I almost thought of putting the neons in one of the 10s...but I'm going to completely clean out the guppy tank as I just don't trust adding new fish to it with what I've been through with the guppies.
 
I also think I am going to do a small layer of sand substrate as well, and I will provide hiding spaces and plastic plants in those two tanks(the guppy has 3 anubias plants that will stay and a couple of nerite snails too) but probably won't have any other plants. The water lettuce doesn't want to take off. I'm hoping the newer 10 gallon that I'm going to get will grow some water lettuce. I'm going to use a clip on light with a daylight led bulb and a sponge filter(going to try this even before I get the bristlenoses). 
 
So....who to put in which quarantine tank? Will be there for at least 4-6 weeks. If plants won't grow..I will be testing water a lot and doing multiple water changes if needed. I will also be using tetra safe start (full bottle is for 20 gallons but I'd use the full thing in a 10 for this many). I'd probably even put a bottle in the 20 to be on the safe side if I added a lot of fish at once anyway.
 
So, any tips on who to put where...water change schedule(how much how often)...and anything else you may do for quarantining I'd greatly appreciate!! Also...I really don't know how these fish will be packed..if they will be in a "species only" bag separate from the others or if some will be mixed. I plan on emailing them to ask about that. Also..my current 10 gallon has an aquaclear 20 filter(2 sponges plus the ceramic media that came with it), my 20 has a nice SunSun 302b canister filter, the other 10 will have a sponge filter(rated up to 30 gals I think? I'd have to recheck), and my big tank has a bigger SunSun canister filter. That one will be cycled before adding any fish whatsoever and then once it's done and my current fish moved...I will then be ordering the rest of the fish for quarantining. I figured adding the others slowly to the tank(like one bunch at a time..) would be best once the quarantining is done.
 
Also..one more question...what would the best temperature be for all of these fish? I currently have tanks set at 77 but I can change that if needed. I think the neons need it slightly cooler? 75? Would the others benefit from this as well? I am trying to do everything else I can do correctly, except for the water parameters which I can't change. Please keep this in mind. I just want to be a happy fish keeper with happy fish! Thanks again for any help and for the understanding of my predicament!

 

[Akasha72]

if you want to soften your water a little wait for Autumn then take yourself for a walk somewhere away from roads/pollution and collect some oak leaves and some alder cones. You'll need to collect the leaves from the ground as it's important that they have fallen from the tree (and therefore free from sap) but the cones you'll probably have to take from the tree - so long as they are brown and shrivelled they are dead. 
 
Your question about temperature - I'd aim for 24-25. The peppered cory likes it cool, I've found that tetra's tend not to be too fussy, same with harlequins. 24-25 should be a happy medium for all.
 
As to what to go in the Q tank ... the answer to that is - anything new. If you want to keep it cycled you could see if you can cram the media into the filter of your main tank. That way, when you need it, you can just remove it, add it to the Q tank filter and your good to go  

 

[cowgirluntamed]

I actually have some Indian almond leaves that I purchased. I havent tried using them yet. Though I think from another post somewhere on here...might have been someone else's pos, not sure, but you had suggested this already though with my kh or gh...i can't ever remember which is the buffering one...Byron had said the leaves wouldn't really change anything for me since its too high. It will just keep everything stable. So...i may just be stuck with my water.

I do plan on keeping the media in the canister filters that are running. But what I meant on my question is which of these new fish do I put in which quarantine? How do I separate them? I would get them all at once. Hopefully only one ten gallon won't have the live plants to help. The other I'm hoping can grow the water lettuce and/or water sprite in. I want to make sure the fish are the least stressed possible.

Like...the 20 gallon can have the neons(probably the best option since they will just stay in it) but it can handle another group more than likely as well just for quarantine. If I can get the new 10 gallon the grow plants I think it could handle two groups. And then the other just one...it only seems to like to grow anubias....lol. I wouldn't want to stress it out. Should I do like just the cories in that one? Then the other two groups in the other ten as long as plants grow? (Also...i know you're in the UK, but what do I feed cories?? I've never had them before.)

And thanks for the temperature advice!

 

[Akasha72]

can you give me the tank measurements as the volume doesn't really help. My Q tank is 18"x10"x10" and I put 12 baby harlequins in there and they were fine. They were in there until they grew to a size bigger than my angels mouth - so almost fully grown. It would have been fine to add say 10 new baby cories aswell as they occupy different areas of the tank.
 
It may be, once we know the tank measurements, that it will be better to order these fish in two batches 2-3 weeks apart.
 
In terms of the plants leaves I suggested. You won't know if they will alter the pH until you try. When I added them to my tank I wasn't prepared for them to drop my pH as far as they did (they caused a pH crash) and no one warned me this might happen. My water is incredibly soft already and the oak leaves and alder cones dropped my pH from 6.5 to 4. I have heard of people who use things like peat in their filters to lower the pH for wild caught angelfish ... this often means dropping it gradually from above pH 7 down to pH 4 and there are many angel breeders who use this method to prepare their tank for a wild caught specimen to good effect. My advice would be to try it and see if it works. If it doesn't you've not lost anything but I suspect it'll drop ... possibly not by a massive amount but I'd still expect to see it drop 

 

[cowgirluntamed]

20 gallon is 24 in long, 12 in wide, around 17 1/2 in high. This has the majority of floating plants in it that I'm hoping will be much more by the time I'm even ready for fish.

The two 10 gallons are 20 in long, 10 1/4 in wide, and 12 1/2 in high.

One of them I'm hoping will be able to grow the floating plants as well. I will have it set up soon so I can experiment before I even get the bristlenoses.

As for the leaves, I'm not saying I won't try them, I do want to add them to the tanks. I just don't have much hope it will do anything. If it does, then my next concern would really be the stability of the tank and it not going up and down due to the leaves decaying and such. And the hardness of my source water which I can't do anything about out of the tap.

 

[Akasha72]

okay ... so a 2ft tank should hold the cories and the neons and harley's comfortably for 2-3 weeks. Any possibly illnesses should show signs in that time. If nothing appears I'd then get them moved into the main community tank then. If you want to get the other tetra's at the same time they should be fine in one the 20" long for a couple of weeks. Alternately you could split the shipment over two ... entirely up to you.
 
The leaves. How about drawing some water into a bucket (perhaps something with a lid so no dirt can get in there) adding an airstone and chucking in a couple of leaves. Test the pH to start with then test daily for a week and see what happens.
 
If you are worrying about the difference between tank and tap - don't. My tank is running at pH 5 at the moment but my tap is about 7.5ish. I've done a 70 litre water change today which will have raised my pH very slightly but it will gradually fall again over the next week. I've been doing this now for over 5 years. No one has got sick, nor died in that time (other than through natural circumstances) It's really not that much of a big deal. My fish don't even seem to notice ... beyond enjoying playing in the flow as I add new water one jug at a time

 

[cowgirluntamed]

You don't think ten cories would be too much for a bristlenose to handle in the 2ft tank though? I wouldn't want to stress it out. I'm not exactly sure how big these fish will come. So some of that I suppose I have to decide when they get here. Not to mention if they are in a species specific bag or if there will be more than one species. Guess I should go email them to see if they know...lol.

Thanks for the tip on the water. I actually want to get the Python water changer thing. I hate hauling buckets which is probably why I'm bad at changing the water now. I need better buckets too...did a change for my betta and went to pick up the bucket(maybe with around 7 liters of water) and the dumb handle broke...good thing it was still close to the floor!! But my big tank is going to be taller than these other ones and I don't think I could lift a bucket that high.

 

[Akasha72]

my BN lives under my wood where he's hollowed out a cave ... he shares his 'cave' with all my cories. They all go in there and chill with him so I reckon he'd be fine. Plus if they are all really young when they arrive the small tank won't matter. They are only in there to check they've not got any health problems ... it's short term ... or have I mis-understood that?

 

[cowgirluntamed]

Nope, you haven't misunderstood. Hopefully no longer than four weeks. Just to make sure everybody is nice and healthy. I did email and ask about how they ship them. I didn't get a great answer...lol.

"Hello,
I do believe that they put the same type of fish in the same bags together. I am not 100% sure on this but I am pretty sure on this.
Thanks."


So.....same type so more than one species??? Or did he just mean same species?? I don't know if I should even reply....lol! I guess if they mix them I'd just have to deal with what I have and put them together that way. Lol.

 

[Akasha72]

I guess your gonna have to wait and see there. I read the reply twice and I'm not certain what they mean by that not very helpful 

 

[cowgirluntamed]

Well, it will still be awhile before I order the fish. So I'm gonna see how well my floating plants do in my 20 and my other 10 whenever I get it. If they grow really well I'll order all at once. If not, then I may have to do two orders as I don't want to stress out the fish with water quality issues from being overstocked. And it also depends on the size of the fish too. So I guess I'll just wait and see for now. Thanks for all the tips!!

 

[Akasha72]

no problem. Always happy to help

 

[PepperjacksMama]

I hope you don't mind my saying a few things.
Last I checked my pH was around 7.4, not quite 8.2, but still high for all my soft water fish. But I don't have major problems.

As to the big tank lots of little fish, working on the same thing myself. Tetras, I have Black Neons, nice, but not being replaced. Neons sorely underrated. Glowlights, love em. So fun to watch. Harleys, much like Akasha feels, a must have.

For plants, try the easy low light varieties. Amazon Swords, Anubius, Crypts, Java Fern. If your Water Sprite catches on like mine it will explode.

As for the 20 gallon high, personally I just don't like them long term. Hard to scape, hard to clean, at least for me.(I have three of them.) But like I said that's just me.

I agree with Akasha, on the temperature. The Neons and Peppereds will appreciate a slightly cooler tank.

As for the Betta, don't break down the five right away. Sometimes Bettas don't do well in a larger tank, but sometimes they thrive. Just have to see.

Shrimp pellets are the staple diet for my Corys. With frozen bloodworms or brine shrimp once a week as a treat. Although mine have gone nuts over Cichlid pellets. And the occasional algae waifer.
Just remember, Corys, much like fishkeeping are addictive.

 

[cowgirluntamed]

Thanks pepperjack! I think the neons will be great in my 20. It is a bit of a hard tank to scape but I'm getting there. Haven't tried any swords yet but I may on the big one. I do want to try the pygmy chain sword though for a carpeting plant. Anubias plants love my tanks and I love them! Crypt wendtii seems to enjoy it to. Great in my betta tank. I need more in my 20 lol. I do believe the crypt retrospiralis will do good but it seems like a slow grower. Oh well. I may try some regular jungle val in the big tank and see how it works. Java fern for some reason did not like my tanks. Not sure why. I did want the fast growing stuff but the easiest I saw was the water sprite and water lettuce. Water lettuce has taken off and doing great so far. The water sprite I think will do pretty well too. Seems to be at the moment anyway!

I'll keep that in mind about the betta. Thanks for the tipII actually forgot about that but I hope he will enjoy it.

I have some hikari shrimp pellets I believe on hand as I tried some ghost shrimp in the betta tank but they didn't make it. I hadn't ordered the food when I got them so didn't know if they died from no food or from the betta...lol.

So would you go for 75 or 76 for the tank temperature then?

Thanks for the tips!

 

[PepperjacksMama]

Pygmy chain sword is nice. Had it in 55 and carpeted somewhat, but stayed small. It also did get shaded by an Amazon Sword. It is carpeting nicely in a 29, with some dwarf sag. Another easy plant. Have not tried the Vals yet, but plan to. Spiralis is a little slow to catch on, but it grows tall.
My Neons and Blacks are in a 20 high. Along with two Cardinals, rescues. Hate to go in a shop and see one specimen of a shoaling/schooling species. That is also how that tank ended up with a Sterbai and Agassazi Cory. And due to a falling out with her mate, a female Angel.
Kind a small tank for an Angel, but just picked up a second hand 36 gallon bow front for everybody.

I have had problems with Java Fern before, growing like a house afire, then it puked out and died. Don't know why.

As for the shrimp pellets, mine go for Wardley or Aqueon. Tried Omega One, but they want the cheap stuff. Cabbage heads.

As for temperature I would go as low as 74. While it may not be ideal according to the experts, I run my tanks between 74 and 76.

Anyway this isn't "expert" advice, and if you haven't run across them yet, you will. Just observation from my tanks. And as Wayne says "Learn your system, not the hobby."

A couple of more observations, if the 20 is going to be a Neon home why not get them last, after all your other quarantining is done? As for the 'mature tank', I still don't know what that means. I have put Neons in new tanks more than once. One death out of 14 fish ain't bad for something so overbred.

Don't turn your nose up at all Cichlids, some of the dwarfs are great. I have a Bolivian Ram. Cute as a button, loads of personality. And has no problem telling breeding Angels to back off.
Akasha has mare experience with some of the smaller Cichlids, perhaps she could persuade you.