Bloo
~ I learn something new ~ ~~~~ every day ~~~~
Elisabeth83 said:
Try a chemist - you might have some luck there
Please I need help and I need it now!
- Thread starter Elisabeth83
- Start date
Try a chemist - you might have some luck there
jollysue
Fish Connoisseur
I've been poking around all night. The recommended food for bettas appears to be freeze dried bloodworms as the stable. Everything else is treat or an attempt to balance out. DrsFosterandSmith recommends freeze dried bloodworms as tne staple and tetra color flakes and shrimp flakes as the add ons.
Thought you'd like to know you don't have to starve the poor things. Interestingly, freeze dried blood worms were the first thing I gave them and they ate them right up. It would be easy to soak them with the garlic.
I think that chemical wuv recommended is a plumbing cleaner (maybe like porcelain), so a plumbing supply might know what you're talking about if you call.
OK I have to go, so google potassium permanganate. It's interesting.
No 
really it is. talks about using it to control infestations of little red worms, etc.
Thought you'd like to know you don't have to starve the poor things. Interestingly, freeze dried blood worms were the first thing I gave them and they ate them right up. It would be easy to soak them with the garlic.
I think that chemical wuv recommended is a plumbing cleaner (maybe like porcelain), so a plumbing supply might know what you're talking about if you call.
OK I have to go, so google potassium permanganate. It's interesting.
No really it is. talks about using it to control infestations of little red worms, etc.
OP
OP
Elisabeth83
Fish Herder
Well things arn't getting better using the Sterazin 
The one female with the worms seems to have more as well as some odd whitish growths. They arn't fuzzy, they arn't ich I have no clue what they are.
I haven't found the garlic stuff yet..I am going to go to another place today. I don't know what to do. Their fins look awful some are loosing their ventral fins now as well
Besides the worms, loss of fins, weird whitish markings some still have these weird black patches on them. They arn't spots they are bigger patches. I've seen 3 now that have them. One you saw in the picture has a weird huge one across her face.
There is only 1 betta in perfect health
Fins are beautiful, no black marks, no white marks no nothing.
What should I do? I feel like I am loosing the battle here. I'm seriously starting to consider euthanizing them all but the healthy girl. I've been dealing with this stuff for over a month now and things just keep getting worse. I don't know where to turn..what to do...what to try
All and Any help would be appriciated!
The one female with the worms seems to have more as well as some odd whitish growths. They arn't fuzzy, they arn't ich I have no clue what they are.I haven't found the garlic stuff yet..I am going to go to another place today. I don't know what to do. Their fins look awful some are loosing their ventral fins now as well
Besides the worms, loss of fins, weird whitish markings some still have these weird black patches on them. They arn't spots they are bigger patches. I've seen 3 now that have them. One you saw in the picture has a weird huge one across her face.
There is only 1 betta in perfect health
Fins are beautiful, no black marks, no white marks no nothing. What should I do? I feel like I am loosing the battle here. I'm seriously starting to consider euthanizing them all but the healthy girl. I've been dealing with this stuff for over a month now and things just keep getting worse. I don't know where to turn..what to do...what to try
All and Any help would be appriciated!
jollysue
Fish Connoisseur
Hi Elisabeth
I've been wondering how you are. Ben's asking after you too.
In my panic, I would do what you are doing--everything I can think of.
Just remember there are some things you can't control
Two things I would do that I don't think you have--maybe three. Take a picture at the least (maybe even a specimen) to the most knowledgeable hobbiest at my lfs
Call my online supplier who also delivers live fish (mine is DrsFosterandSmith) and ask to talk to their tech.
Chose a medicine brand to work with and call their tech. They have a much more technical knowledge, and the online supplier deals with thousands of fish that they don't get paid for unless the fish live. On the last two you may find you are getting free vet. advice. My neons kept dying until I got tech advice and started using the appropriate med.
I'm inclined to think you will get the best directives from the medicine tech. Like I said I have done this with Mardel because they have a good rep, a broad selection, their meds don;t require removal of the filter media or kill the media bacteria, and I had a beginers selection of their meds in stock on advice from Drs FosterandSmith "just in case". They may cost more, but sometimes that's ok.
Write down the questions you want to ask; get a regiment, including water changes.
Keep in touch
I've been wondering how you are. Ben's asking after you too.
In my panic, I would do what you are doing--everything I can think of.
Just remember there are some things you can't control
Two things I would do that I don't think you have--maybe three. Take a picture at the least (maybe even a specimen) to the most knowledgeable hobbiest at my lfs
Call my online supplier who also delivers live fish (mine is DrsFosterandSmith) and ask to talk to their tech.
Chose a medicine brand to work with and call their tech. They have a much more technical knowledge, and the online supplier deals with thousands of fish that they don't get paid for unless the fish live. On the last two you may find you are getting free vet. advice. My neons kept dying until I got tech advice and started using the appropriate med.
I'm inclined to think you will get the best directives from the medicine tech. Like I said I have done this with Mardel because they have a good rep, a broad selection, their meds don;t require removal of the filter media or kill the media bacteria, and I had a beginers selection of their meds in stock on advice from Drs FosterandSmith "just in case". They may cost more, but sometimes that's ok.
Write down the questions you want to ask; get a regiment, including water changes.
Keep in touch
OP
OP
Elisabeth83
Fish Herder
Hi Sue, Well I guess I will continue with the sterazin. I'm supposed to treat for 11 days. So that's on days 1,3,6,8 and 10. I'm on day 5 so I've given 2 treatments. I guess there is still hope with the further 3 treatments it'll maybe cure it.
I contacted waterlife and this is what they said:
"Hi Elizabeth,
Many thanks for the email. I hope you are well.
Do the worms move around the body? If they are stationary it may not be a parasitic planarian worm (Paragon would be a better for this). If it is however, an explosion of this type of creature usually co-incides with a break down in aquarium hygiene - over feeding, failing filtration, overstocking etc. I would suggest testing water quality parameters (pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, temp etc.) and making any necessary changes if necessary a partial water change.
However it is difficult to see very well from the photo what you are dealing with and therefore recommending treatment is also hard.
Another alternative may be the start of a fungal infection for which Protozin may be used but as I said I cannot be sure.
Without an accurate diagnosis it is difficult to know how to proceed. All I can suggest is either obtaining a more accurate diagnosis or working through a process of elimination.
Sorry I cannot be of more help on this occasion.
K. Regards,
Alex.
All the information is given to the best of our abilities and knowledge. However we cannot be held responsible for any losses or damages caused by misinterpretation or misunderstanding or caused by misdiagnosis or misuse of Waterlife products."
I sent him the picture of Bloozoo2's female but I guess he has bad eyesite or something and can't tell from the picture what the problem is
I went today to a natural health store and bought some garlic liquid capsules. Should I use them at the same time as I am using the Sterazin?
With the medication I am using I am supposed to use it for 11 days but what about water changes?? I think I should do one today or maybe tomorrow right before the 3rd dose?? Seems 11 days is long not to do a waterchange especially if the fish are sick? You'd think by the 3rd dose all the medication would be out of the water anyways seeing as it'll be 3 days since the last dose?
Ok I hope I don't sound silly but who is Ben?
)
I contacted waterlife and this is what they said:
"Hi Elizabeth,
Many thanks for the email. I hope you are well.
Do the worms move around the body? If they are stationary it may not be a parasitic planarian worm (Paragon would be a better for this). If it is however, an explosion of this type of creature usually co-incides with a break down in aquarium hygiene - over feeding, failing filtration, overstocking etc. I would suggest testing water quality parameters (pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, temp etc.) and making any necessary changes if necessary a partial water change.
However it is difficult to see very well from the photo what you are dealing with and therefore recommending treatment is also hard.
Another alternative may be the start of a fungal infection for which Protozin may be used but as I said I cannot be sure.
Without an accurate diagnosis it is difficult to know how to proceed. All I can suggest is either obtaining a more accurate diagnosis or working through a process of elimination.
Sorry I cannot be of more help on this occasion.
K. Regards,
Alex.
All the information is given to the best of our abilities and knowledge. However we cannot be held responsible for any losses or damages caused by misinterpretation or misunderstanding or caused by misdiagnosis or misuse of Waterlife products."
I sent him the picture of Bloozoo2's female but I guess he has bad eyesite or something and can't tell from the picture what the problem is
I went today to a natural health store and bought some garlic liquid capsules. Should I use them at the same time as I am using the Sterazin?
With the medication I am using I am supposed to use it for 11 days but what about water changes?? I think I should do one today or maybe tomorrow right before the 3rd dose?? Seems 11 days is long not to do a waterchange especially if the fish are sick? You'd think by the 3rd dose all the medication would be out of the water anyways seeing as it'll be 3 days since the last dose?
Ok I hope I don't sound silly but who is Ben?
)
Do the water change for sure. I would also use the garlic capsules. Just pop one open and squeeze in half of the contents for a starter.
Actually, pop one open now and see how strong it smells, also read the back and make sure it's pure garlic oil.
I'm sorry to hear the sterazin isn't giving you quicker results.
Actually, pop one open now and see how strong it smells, also read the back and make sure it's pure garlic oil.
I'm sorry to hear the sterazin isn't giving you quicker results.
Here is the med they suggested elizabeth.
http/www.waterlife.co.uk/waterlife/paragon.htm
http
/www.waterlife.co.uk/waterlife/paragon.htm
OP
OP
Elisabeth83
Fish Herder
Should I do the water change tonight or do it tomorrow right before the next dose? Also should I put in the garlic tonight or wait until tomorrow when I do the water change?? It's been 2 days since I did my last dose of the sterazin the medication would probably be gone anyways? I remember I asked the people at Waterlife why are the days all spread out weird in the treatment and he said it's kind of a shot gun effect so you have a good chance you catch the worms/flukes at the right time.
The garlic capsules smell really strong but I'm not sure how they are supposed to smell?
The lady at the store said they were pure garlic extract in an oil capsule. They don't sell just liquid stuff it only comes in capsules. It says on the bottle that it has an high concentration of Allicin?
The web address of the garlic capsules is www.skip.se I'm having troubles actually getting to the page though. Maybe there there is more info on the garlic capsules.
I guess I will finish with the sterazin seeing as some people have said to me that it's worse to jump around with medications that it causes more stress on the fish and that might kill them more than the actual problem Lets just hope by day 11 this crap is all sorted out.
The girls are fine in spite of all their problems. I thought about it today that it would be easier to euthanize them if they acted sick or were dieing but they act like they normally do. Eating, swimming just one has those weird white worms and the rest have awful looking fins
Maybe the sterazin is having an effect on them just not really visible yet? I don't know
edit: just some info on the capsules:
Cold pressed garlic oil 360 mg per capsule
Allisin/Allicin 270 mg per capsule
The garlic capsules smell really strong but I'm not sure how they are supposed to smell?
The lady at the store said they were pure garlic extract in an oil capsule. They don't sell just liquid stuff it only comes in capsules. It says on the bottle that it has an high concentration of Allicin?
The web address of the garlic capsules is www.skip.se I'm having troubles actually getting to the page though. Maybe there there is more info on the garlic capsules.
I guess I will finish with the sterazin seeing as some people have said to me that it's worse to jump around with medications that it causes more stress on the fish and that might kill them more than the actual problem
Lets just hope by day 11 this crap is all sorted out. The girls are fine in spite of all their problems. I thought about it today that it would be easier to euthanize them if they acted sick or were dieing but they act like they normally do. Eating, swimming just one has those weird white worms and the rest have awful looking fins
Maybe the sterazin is having an effect on them just not really visible yet? I don't know
edit: just some info on the capsules:
Cold pressed garlic oil 360 mg per capsule
Allisin/Allicin 270 mg per capsule
OP
OP
Elisabeth83
Fish Herder
Wilder said:Here is the med they suggested elizabeth.
http
[snapback]899865[/snapback]
Ok it seems that stuff is the same stuff as JBL ektol fluid? A general disinfectant right?
jollysue
Fish Connoisseur
Ben is my mistake ) I was tired. I meant Joe aka Lucky. Sorry ) 
Yeah they do need a diagnosis, if they feel they can't make one. Did you get anything useful from him? Best to give him your best guess and go from there. Call him in person if you need him again.
It's like working on a car, they use a process of elimination. Unless it's a computerized car and so far no computerized fish.
All you can do is plug away at it. You might save one or even all. I can understand wondering if it's best to end their suffering. They are getting more help, though, than ones in the wild. As far as water conditions go--they always say that. I just think it's odd that it happens so often with new fish for me.
I do overstock sometimes. I do let water conditions go too far sometimes w/o meaning to. I am too embarrassed to tell you what my coldwater tank tested at once my quarantine tank got under control, and I started to take stock of what was going on with the rest of the fish. My poor goldies. I don't know how they survived. It took a over a week of 30%, 50%, and even 75% water changes once and twice a day and a ton of amaquel to get the thing in a safety zone. I have since ordered ammonia removing filter media for such emergencies. My common goldy is getting too big, He poos logs. But he has lost a couple of scales from the ammonia, and I am embarrassed to take him to the lfs to get him a new home in a pond. I'm bad
I would check with wuvmybetta about the garlic extract. Is it pure garlic extract? If so I would think 2 drops per 10 usg at feeding. I personally try to do additives at separate times from one another. I get concerned about dumping too much on them at once.
Test the water. If it tests good just change out 10% to put some fresh water in (or if there is evaporation, just add fresh water before a med addition. They won't like it but maybe an airstone someplace out of the way, and if they can tolerate it some aquarium salt. Meds can effect the oxygen levels.
That's all I can think of at the moment.
EDIT: Oh There's the gals you need carrying on the job while I dither away. 
) I was tired. I meant Joe aka Lucky. Sorry ) Yeah they do need a diagnosis, if they feel they can't make one. Did you get anything useful from him? Best to give him your best guess and go from there. Call him in person if you need him again.
It's like working on a car, they use a process of elimination. Unless it's a computerized car
and so far no computerized fish.All you can do is plug away at it. You might save one or even all. I can understand wondering if it's best to end their suffering. They are getting more help, though, than ones in the wild. As far as water conditions go--they always say that. I just think it's odd that it happens so often with new fish for me.
I do overstock sometimes. I do let water conditions go too far sometimes w/o meaning to. I am too embarrassed to tell you what my coldwater tank tested at once my quarantine tank got under control, and I started to take stock of what was going on with the rest of the fish. My poor goldies. I don't know how they survived. It took a over a week of 30%, 50%, and even 75% water changes once and twice a day and a ton of amaquel to get the thing in a safety zone. I have since ordered ammonia removing filter media for such emergencies. My common goldy is getting too big, He poos logs. But he has lost a couple of scales from the ammonia, and I am embarrassed to take him to the lfs to get him a new home in a pond. I'm bad
I would check with wuvmybetta about the garlic extract. Is it pure garlic extract? If so I would think 2 drops per 10 usg at feeding. I personally try to do additives at separate times from one another. I get concerned about dumping too much on them at once.
Test the water. If it tests good just change out 10% to put some fresh water in (or if there is evaporation, just add fresh water before a med addition. They won't like it but maybe an airstone someplace out of the way, and if they can tolerate it some aquarium salt. Meds can effect the oxygen levels.
That's all I can think of at the moment.
EDIT: Oh
There's the gals you need carrying on the job while I dither away.
Found this.
http/www.jbl.de/uk/aqua/uk_10038.html
http
/www.jbl.de/uk/aqua/uk_10038.html
OP
OP
Elisabeth83
Fish Herder
Wilder said:
Yeah that's what I was thinking of trying next if the Sterazin doesn't help. Maybe I should switch now instead of waiting? I have had great sucess with JBL products in the past.
I cant see in any of your posts if youve recently checked ammonia. Black markings could be melanophore migration which is where the pigment is healing from ammonia burns and turns black when it is healing.
Only use one med at a time and dont change half way through as you will need to see if it works.
Good luck.
Only use one med at a time and dont change half way through as you will need to see if it works.
Good luck.
OP
OP
Elisabeth83
Fish Herder
I thought you meant Joe LOL Yeah he's pm me a couple of times.
Well I can't really give them a diagnosis seeing as I have no clue what they have. I was hoping from the picture of Bloozoo2's female betta he'd be able to see all the little worms and know what the problem was. I emailed him again explaing what the worms look like that they are stationary etc. I even asked him if he could maybe ask others he works with or people he knows what they think the worms could be also showing them the picture.
I guess I'll just keep trying medications and maybe I'll find one that works. I just wish/hope that someone on here or the Waterlife people can help figure out what these worms are.
I've let things slip sometimes too. I get so focused on one tank that I forget about the rest like now with my female bettas..all my focus has been on them that my betta boys have been getting neglected in their water changes Goldfish are supposed to be really strong and supposed to be able to take really bad water conditions though right? Not saying it's good but chances are higher they can survive.
I'll go test the water...not sure what my readings will be with the medication in the water?
I think maybe the bubbles are turned off in the tank. Oops I better switch them on ASAP.
Yeah he's pm me a couple of times. Well I can't really give them a diagnosis seeing as I have no clue what they have. I was hoping from the picture of Bloozoo2's female betta he'd be able to see all the little worms and know what the problem was. I emailed him again explaing what the worms look like that they are stationary etc. I even asked him if he could maybe ask others he works with or people he knows what they think the worms could be also showing them the picture.
I guess I'll just keep trying medications and maybe I'll find one that works. I just wish/hope that someone on here or the Waterlife people can help figure out what these worms are.
I've let things slip sometimes too. I get so focused on one tank that I forget about the rest like now with my female bettas..all my focus has been on them that my betta boys have been getting neglected in their water changes
Goldfish are supposed to be really strong and supposed to be able to take really bad water conditions though right? Not saying it's good but chances are higher they can survive. I'll go test the water...not sure what my readings will be with the medication in the water?
I think maybe the bubbles are turned off in the tank. Oops I better switch them on ASAP.Similar threads
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