Planted Tank Help

[dmitch1987]

i have a tank set up with 2 dwarf Angels 1 Clown loach 11 neon tetras a small plec (not sure on type is very small round shape?) and one red tailed shark. Stupidly i rushed into the set up and didn't think i would need anything other than gravel! Stupid i know.

Tomorrow on my day off i intend to empty the tank am placing fish in a temp aquarium and will be stripping everything out gravel and plants and replacing it with a few inches of substrate and some new gravel will obviously be using 70%-90% of my old water and replanting most of my old plants again not sure on what i actually have as I'm not so huge on the plant names etc etc.

But Any Hints/Tips on substrates to use and some good plants to get coverage in a tetratec 60 L tank also anyone with some good site or even better some offcuts to help me along id be extremely grateful!

(side note) tank is downstairs and am doing this for my mother as she looks after children with mental and physical challenges and they love to watch the fish but at the moment most of the plants are dying and it looks a bit of a mess... again cheers for any help you can provide!

 

[Declan]

i have a tank set up with 2 dwarf Angels 1 Clown loach 11 neon tetras a small plec (not sure on type is very small round shape?) and one red tailed shark. Stupidly i rushed into the set up and didn't think i would need anything other than gravel! Stupid i know.

Tomorrow on my day off i intend to empty the tank am placing fish in a temp aquarium and will be stripping everything out gravel and plants and replacing it with a few inches of substrate and some new gravel will obviously be using 70%-90% of my old water and replanting most of my old plants again not sure on what i actually have as I'm not so huge on the plant names etc etc.

But Any Hints/Tips on substrates to use and some good plants to get coverage in a tetratec 60 L tank also anyone with some good site or even better some offcuts to help me along id be extremely grateful!

(side note) tank is downstairs and am doing this for my mother as she looks after children with mental and physical challenges and they love to watch the fish but at the moment most of the plants are dying and it looks a bit of a mess... again cheers for any help you can provide!

I think a lot of it depends on how much time you can dedicate to them!

Personally I just put a load of gravel down and then let the plants grow in that..

Some people have a layer of fertiliser and then another substrate to encourage the growth..

Others just add nutrients.

Do you have a Co2 Kit?

D.

[Edit: How big is the tank, as clown loaches especially can grow very large!]

 

[Phage]

Hi. Welcome to the planted world. I just joined myself, not too long ago.
First, 60L is 15.8gallons? What kind of lighting do you have? Lighting is important in determining what plants you can have. Crypts, anubias, java fern and java moss are some low light plants.
CO2 is also important if you have higher light. The higher the light, the more nutrients plants need. Do you use any fertilizer?

As for substrate, there are many types: aquasoil, fluorite, laterite are some. You can look here to get an idea of what other people use and grow http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showforum=103
Here is a site to help list some types of plants by lighting, planting position, location, etc http/www.plantgeek.net/plantguide.php
Here is a link to an aquascaping contest. You can get an idea of placement as well or just enjoy the view http/showcase.aquatic-gardeners.org/2008...e=view-showcase


And as for your fish… what is a dwarf angelfish exactly… Never heard of them. But angelfish need atleast 20gal for a pair and a minimum of 18” in height. Clown loaches can get quite large, about 14 inches, and that tank is way too small for it. As for the pleco, if it is a common plec then the tank is too small as well, they can get to a foot or more. Lastly, angelfish naturally prey on neons… I just noticed the red tail shark… they get big as well. I know you didn't come here to ask about the fish so I hate to bring it up you should think about taking some fish back and getting smaller fish.

 

[dmitch1987]

i have a tank set up with 2 dwarf Angels 1 Clown loach 11 neon tetras a small plec (not sure on type is very small round shape?) and one red tailed shark. Stupidly i rushed into the set up and didn't think i would need anything other than gravel! Stupid i know.

Tomorrow on my day off i intend to empty the tank am placing fish in a temp aquarium and will be stripping everything out gravel and plants and replacing it with a few inches of substrate and some new gravel will obviously be using 70%-90% of my old water and replanting most of my old plants again not sure on what i actually have as I'm not so huge on the plant names etc etc.

But Any Hints/Tips on substrates to use and some good plants to get coverage in a tetratec 60 L tank also anyone with some good site or even better some offcuts to help me along id be extremely grateful!

(side note) tank is downstairs and am doing this for my mother as she looks after children with mental and physical challenges and they love to watch the fish but at the moment most of the plants are dying and it looks a bit of a mess... again cheers for any help you can provide!

I think a lot of it depends on how much time you can dedicate to them!

Personally I just put a load of gravel down and then let the plants grow in that..

Some people have a layer of fertiliser and then another substrate to encourage the growth..

Others just add nutrients.

Do you have a Co2 Kit?

D.

[Edit: How big is the tank, as clown loaches especially can grow very large!]

I dont have a C02 kit as of yet! The tank it a 60L... had the loach for over a year and its still Tiny maybe 3" long

 

[Declan]

i have a tank set up with 2 dwarf Angels 1 Clown loach 11 neon tetras a small plec (not sure on type is very small round shape?) and one red tailed shark. Stupidly i rushed into the set up and didn't think i would need anything other than gravel! Stupid i know.

Tomorrow on my day off i intend to empty the tank am placing fish in a temp aquarium and will be stripping everything out gravel and plants and replacing it with a few inches of substrate and some new gravel will obviously be using 70%-90% of my old water and replanting most of my old plants again not sure on what i actually have as I'm not so huge on the plant names etc etc.

But Any Hints/Tips on substrates to use and some good plants to get coverage in a tetratec 60 L tank also anyone with some good site or even better some offcuts to help me along id be extremely grateful!

(side note) tank is downstairs and am doing this for my mother as she looks after children with mental and physical challenges and they love to watch the fish but at the moment most of the plants are dying and it looks a bit of a mess... again cheers for any help you can provide!

I think a lot of it depends on how much time you can dedicate to them!

Personally I just put a load of gravel down and then let the plants grow in that..

Some people have a layer of fertiliser and then another substrate to encourage the growth..

Others just add nutrients.

Do you have a Co2 Kit?

D.

[Edit: How big is the tank, as clown loaches especially can grow very large!]

I dont have a C02 kit as of yet! The tank it a 60L... had the loach for over a year and its still Tiny maybe 3" long

I would rehome that ASAP! That will outgrow the tank very soon!

D.

 

[dmitch1987]

Hi. Welcome to the planted world. I just joined myself, not too long ago.
First, 60L is 15.8gallons? What kind of lighting do you have? Lighting is important in determining what plants you can have. Crypts, anubias, java fern and java moss are some low light plants.
CO2 is also important if you have higher light. The higher the light, the more nutrients plants need. Do you use any fertilizer?

As for substrate, there are many types: aquasoil, fluorite, laterite are some. You can look here to get an idea of what other people use and grow [URL="http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showforum=103"]http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showforum=103[/URL]
Here is a site to help list some types of plants by lighting, planting position, location, etc [URL="http/www.plantgeek.net/plantguide.php"]http/www.plantgeek.net/plantguide.php[/URL]
Here is a link to an aquascaping contest. You can get an idea of placement as well or just enjoy the view [URL="http/showcase.aquatic-gardeners.org/2008...e=view-showcase"]http/showcase.aquatic-gardeners.org/2008...e=view-showcase[/URL]


And as for your fish… what is a dwarf angelfish exactly… Never heard of them. But angelfish need atleast 20gal for a pair and a minimum of 18” in height. Clown loaches can get quite large, about 14 inches, and that tank is way too small for it. As for the pleco, if it is a common plec then the tank is too small as well, they can get to a foot or more. Lastly, angelfish naturally prey on neons… I just noticed the red tail shark… they get big as well. I know you didn't come here to ask about the fish so I hate to bring it up you should think about taking some fish back and getting smaller fish.

Cheers for the reply... 60L i belive your right there are 3.9 ltrs to a us gallon... maths skills are poor to say the least!

I have a 15W White light.
At present i use bog standard liquid plant food.
The Dwarf Angel fish are exactly the same as standard angel fish but they grow to about half the size AS far as i know anyway!

The clown loach has not grown since i got him over 7 months ago and is still small 3-4" Max and maybe the plec isnt a plec its some kind of sucker very small about 0.5".... End of the day if i have any issues with over crowding which seems to be ok at the moment i know a few people with huge tanks always in need of new fish so it wont really be an issue!

Thank you for the reply!

any tips towards changing over the gravel to maybe sand?

i have a tank set up with 2 dwarf Angels 1 Clown loach 11 neon tetras a small plec (not sure on type is very small round shape?) and one red tailed shark. Stupidly i rushed into the set up and didn't think i would need anything other than gravel! Stupid i know.

Tomorrow on my day off i intend to empty the tank am placing fish in a temp aquarium and will be stripping everything out gravel and plants and replacing it with a few inches of substrate and some new gravel will obviously be using 70%-90% of my old water and replanting most of my old plants again not sure on what i actually have as I'm not so huge on the plant names etc etc.

But Any Hints/Tips on substrates to use and some good plants to get coverage in a tetratec 60 L tank also anyone with some good site or even better some offcuts to help me along id be extremely grateful!

(side note) tank is downstairs and am doing this for my mother as she looks after children with mental and physical challenges and they love to watch the fish but at the moment most of the plants are dying and it looks a bit of a mess... again cheers for any help you can provide!

I think a lot of it depends on how much time you can dedicate to them!

Personally I just put a load of gravel down and then let the plants grow in that..

Some people have a layer of fertiliser and then another substrate to encourage the growth..

Others just add nutrients.

Do you have a Co2 Kit?

D.

[Edit: How big is the tank, as clown loaches especially can grow very large!]

I dont have a C02 kit as of yet! The tank it a 60L... had the loach for over a year and its still Tiny maybe 3" long

I would rehome that ASAP! That will outgrow the tank very soon!

D.

will see how it goes the other half has a super sized tank (6ft by 1.5) so its not a huge problem!

Had a few livebearers in there a few months back and they just kept breading so gave her the Lot!

 

[Phage]

You might get more answers in the planted section. There are many knowledgeable people there that have helped me

There was a post on sand but I can't find a link. I think sand can be dangerous if dead matter collects underneath everything, and if stirred, it can let out bad gases. I think trumpet snails will turn over the substrate so you don't have to worry about that. Best messaging someone from the plant section to take a look here or making a post there

 

[waterdrop]

Agree with Phage, there's lots to learn re planted and we have good folks here on TFF. With a small tank like that it sounds like you are pretty good for low-light technique. A tank that small might do quite will via liquid carbon (easycarbo or flourish excel) as the carbon source, so the plants can make sugar and feed themselves (eating being somewhat important to life.)

Likewise in a small tank you might find that a "reduced EI" technique might be attempted for fertilization. This would be where you dose macronutrients (N,P,K) and micronutrients in pretty small amounts (probably significantly smaller than the high-light recommendations would have you do) on some daily pattern and then do a significant water change (eg. 50%) on the weekend, thus removing any excess nutrients before starting the buildup again the next week.

Liquid carbon is probably tied in "second place" with DIY carbon (yeast in soda bottles) as a less reliable method of plant carbon source for a planted tank. The DIY method can probably supply a higher amount of carbon than liquid method, but likely fluctuates the carbon level more than liquid method. Neither situation is ideal and thus pressurized CO2 always apparently trumps both as the method of choice if one can afford it and it is done well. Pressurized has a potentially high initial cost/effort outlay but from then on is much less effort and not expensive. DIY continues to need fussy attention forever and liquid carbon continues to have high cost forever. These are my impressions from a small amount of experience and reading here on TFF and other planted sources.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[Corleone]

About the dwarf angelfish: If it's a P. leopoldi instead of P. scalare (which 99% of the angelfish on the market are, and most of the rest are P. altum), it'll get about 3 inches. There isn't a dwarf scalare angelfish, however I've seen a great deal of stores sell young fish as dwarfs, but they still grow up into adult fish.

If it is a P. leopoldi, congratulations, I've never actually seen one except on special order lists, and for outrageous prices.

As for the plec, if it's that small, could be an oto - they only get about 1.5" at the outside. Could also be a baby, about half of the bristlenose plecs I see for sale are about that size.

Edit on CO2: If you have much surface movement, you may find liquid carbon is the only thing that will actually work, since surface movement tends to keep the water saturated with oxygen, but drives off CO2. I'm still primarily using Flourish Excell in place of my pressurized CO2 unit. Works well enough, but it does get expensive. Somebody else who uses it the other day had the bright idea of putting it at the top of his Christmas list.

 

[dmitch1987]

About the dwarf angelfish: If it's a P. leopoldi instead of P. scalare (which 99% of the angelfish on the market are, and most of the rest are P. altum), it'll get about 3 inches. There isn't a dwarf scalare angelfish, however I've seen a great deal of stores sell young fish as dwarfs, but they still grow up into adult fish.

If it is a P. leopoldi, congratulations, I've never actually seen one except on special order lists, and for outrageous prices.

As for the plec, if it's that small, could be an oto - they only get about 1.5" at the outside. Could also be a baby, about half of the bristlenose plecs I see for sale are about that size.

Edit on CO2: If you have much surface movement, you may find liquid carbon is the only thing that will actually work, since surface movement tends to keep the water saturated with oxygen, but drives off CO2. I'm still primarily using Flourish Excell in place of my pressurized CO2 unit. Works well enough, but it does get expensive. Somebody else who uses it the other day had the bright idea of putting it at the top of his Christmas list.

Im not sure to be honest.... looking at them they do see to be growing quite alot... guess you dont notice if you see them every day.

How much should i pay for a CO2 kit..... and again any tips on ANYTHING ie Filters if im using sand.... and if i get a co2 kit will i still need to buy a layer to go under my substrate for planting?... sorry im totally new to this! Cheers!

 

[Corleone]

I don't have anything under my substrate, with or without CO2. I use root tabs monthly and flourish excell daily. Read the directions carefully with root tabs - some brands I've seen have hopelessly complicated directions involving varied spacing and redosing schedules. Special plant substrates can be used, as far as I know these can be used as a substrate in themselves without anything over them.

For the angels: If it's a p. leopoldi, it'll look roughly like this (particularly note the nose):
<a href="http/www.aqua-fish.net/show.php?h=angelfish1" target="_blank">http/www.aqua-fish.net/show.php?h=angelfish1</a>

Fancy angelfish varieties like gold, black, koi, marbled, etc are all scalare. Leopoldi and altum don't vary as much as scalare because they aren't bred extensively to create fancy breeds. Unless you paid for the fish in pure souls or your own fingers, I'm guessing it's just a standard angelfish. It will need a tank at least 18 inches tall for long term keeping.

 

[dmitch1987]

I don't have anything under my substrate, with or without CO2. I use root tabs monthly and flourish excell daily. Read the directions carefully with root tabs - some brands I've seen have hopelessly complicated directions involving varied spacing and redosing schedules. Special plant substrates can be used, as far as I know these can be used as a substrate in themselves without anything over them.

For the angels: If it's a p. leopoldi, it'll look roughly like this (particularly note the nose):
<a href="http/www.aqua-fish.net/show.php?h=angelfish1" target="_blank">http/www.aqua-fish.net/show.php?h=angelfish1</a>

Fancy angelfish varieties like gold, black, koi, marbled, etc are all scalare. Leopoldi and altum don't vary as much as scalare because they aren't bred extensively to create fancy breeds. Unless you paid for the fish in pure souls or your own fingers, I'm guessing it's just a standard angelfish. It will need a tank at least 18 inches tall for long term keeping.

I THINK its that one.. well two of them.. only paid £25 for the pair.. id guess they are standard.. although they DO look like that.

In relation to the whole tabs and flourish this means i wont need the expensive co2 kits?.....Going to just change the substrate to the special plant stuff add some tabs and use excell then.. that would be ok id guess?

 

[dmitch1987]

im still putting this off lol... think i have to do it next time i get some time off... gunna get the substrate tomorrow and a few buckets!

 

[Corleone]

I THINK its that one.. well two of them.. only paid £25 for the pair.. id guess they are standard.. although they DO look like that.

In relation to the whole tabs and flourish this means i wont need the expensive co2 kits?.....Going to just change the substrate to the special plant stuff add some tabs and use excell then.. that would be ok id guess?

All three species basic wild form has the same striped form, which is why I pointed out the upturned snout - leopoldi are sometimes called long-nosed angelfish as well.

Congratulations, if they are, like I said - a nice rare find, I was looking for them for quite a while before I found out how much they go for here.