Planted tank, filter or no filter that is the question.

[Utar]

I haven't read the whole thread. The filter is an important part of your system as it moves water around the tank and allows gas exchange. Without a filter and no movement your tank will become like a stagnant pond. Every aquarium needs water movement. An air stone is a great way to increase the surface area of your tank, but does little else.

Thanks for the reply, yes I was thinking the same think. In nature a large lake or pond will do what some refer to as roll over, now I am not completely sure what that means, so I guess it is the bad water being exchanged for good water from top to bottom. In an aquarium a filter like my canister filter serves several proposes, movement, bad water out good water in, cleaning, BB, and gas exchanges at the surface. I can't say whether my canister is doing all I expect it to do, except that my tank is doing great and I am reluctant to change anything. If one keeps their filter good and clean it will perform as it should. In my cansister I have two trays one for sponges and the other for filter floss. When I clean my canister filter I clean the sponges in tank water. I throw out the filter floss and replace it with new filter floss. I do this at least once a month.

I have mentioned in a few threads about quarantining new fish with no mature media, just plants. What I should have added is that I did put a small filter in the tank, filled with filter wool/floss. This served two purposes - it moved the water round the tank, as @itiwhetu said, and the filter wool trapped any particles in the water. If the tank had been set up long enough, some bacteria would have grown but as a quarantine tank it was only set up for a short period.

In most part I am in totally agreement with you about not using bio-media because with a properly planted tank the plants should take the load. But a person and this is the most important part of that equation, should stay well under stocked for a tank setup for plants only taking the load. I believe most people don't do this, and it is kinda bad, but it what it is. I am guilty of that too, especially with plecos....lol...

 

[seangee]

I can't say whether my canister is doing all I expect it to do, except that my tank is doing great

In that case don't mess with it

 

[mcordelia]

someone called for an article about silent cycles, so I made an attempt here: https://www.fishforums.net/threads/what-is-a-planted-silent-cycle.467698/

please provide feedback and corrections so we can make the article better!

 

[Essjay]

In most part I am in totally agreement with you about not using bio-media because with a properly planted tank the plants should take the load. But a person and this is the most important part of that equation, should stay well under stocked for a tank setup for plants only taking the load.

My quarantine tank held 12 kuhli loaches in 25 litres/6 gallons - it was overstocked.

It depends on how the tank is planted. A few java ferns and anubias won't be able to support more than a very light stocking. But a suitably stocked planted tank will support a more heavily stocked tank. Adding fish a few at a time allows the plants to grow and keep up with increased fish numbers. And bacteria will grow alongside the plants, just less of them than a tank without live plants.


I will admit that I am a recent convert to planted tanks. When I first had fish (back in 1996) I had only plastic plants. These were gradually replaced with silk plants as I preferred the look. Every real plant I tried to grow died so I assumed I couldn't grow them. About 10 years ago I was convinced by all the photos of planted tanks to try again, so I got some java fern which I attached to a fake log - and it not only survived, it got bigger! So next I tried anubias, and that survived too. Then I got really adventurous and got some hornwort, and that grew really well. Then a disaster - I decided to add some rocks to the tank and bought a couple from a fish store. Next morning the tank was so cloudy I couldn't see through it and the hornwort had dropped all its leaves. It took several back to back water changes to remove all the leaves. The fish, java fern and anubias were all fine though. I left the rock in a bucket of water and it turned the water cloudy, so it was the rock not the disintegrating hornwort which cause the cloudiness. (The rock did good service for a few years with an air plant attached). That experience put me off live plants again, but then I decided to try again. This time I researched plants which could be grown attached to decor, and discovered Bolbitis so that was the next plant. I also tried hornwort again with no problems this time, other than it growing and growing. And I discovered Salvinia - but that died off in a heatwave about 6 years ago.
Fast forward to now - I discovered bucephalandras which are grown attached to decor - which is now all wood not plastic. I did have water sprite floating on my main tank but it turned into a tangled mess so early last year I replaced it with frogbit. But the hornwort had to go as it grew so well it was strangling the other plants. And a couple of months ago I bought some crypts which surprisingly did not melt, though the new foliage is a bit different from the original.
Early last year I bought some pearl gouramis and took some media from my main tank to set up the QT. I tested it with ammonia only to find no drop in ammonia. I ended up doing a 6 week fishless cycle before the QT was ready for fish. So despite having only slow growing plants plus fast growing floating plants, my mature media had virtually no bacteria After reading about other members' silent cycles, when I got the kuhlis a few months later, I didn't bother with mature media, just plants - and they worked perfectly. Much better than the mature media I had used for the gouramis.


Edited because I just realised I typed a wrong word

 

[seangee]

It depends on how the tank is planted. A few java ferns and anubias won't be able to support more than a very light stocking. But a suitably stocked tank will support a more heavily stocked tank. Adding fish a few at a time allows the plants to grow and keep up with increased fish numbers. And bacteria will grow alongside the plants, just less of them than a tank without live plants.

I am not suggesting you overstock your tanks...
But there is a reason that so many people comment on the phenomonal growth of the frogbit in my community tank

 

[Utar]

@Essjay good read, thanks for your reply. I have had to experiment with different plants to figure out what works best for me. I once bought all the plants shown in this image at one time for a person on the internet. The plants all arrived in great shape but everyone wilted away and never grew.

I tried several different ferns like Java fern but they didn't survive, I did have luck with anubias but it grew way to slow. Then I tried Amazon Swords and bingo, these plants not only survived but thrived and over took the tank. I also found temple plants and hornwart work good for me. You can see all three of these plants in the picture of my aquarium posted on this thread. But that picture is form three months ago and now one entire end of my 55 gallon tank has been overtaken by Amazon swords and temple plants.

Like I said before, I am going to slowly stage down the media in my canister filter. I have two trays full of bio-home ultimate media (This stuff is expensive and thinking I failed for the hype when the reality is no better then any other bio-media, oh well.) I will empty one of the trays of the media leaving the other for now and replace it with filter floss to help keep the water clean.

 

[Essjay]

In my opinion, tanks do need a filter. It may not contain many bacteria if there are a lot of live plants in the tank, but as other members have said, a filter is needed to move the water around. And in my opinion there should be media for bacteria to grow in even where there are plants. A belt and braces approach, if you like.
Bacteria do grow in a tank with plants. If the plant load is not enough for the fish load, the bacteria will remove the ammonia that the plants can't deal with. It's not either/or, tanks can have both. My media may have very few bacteria but there will also be bacteria in the substrate, on the tank walls, on the wood and on the plants in my tank. This tank has been running since January 2014 (and the filter, decor, substrate etc came from a smaller tank) so it had plenty time to grow bacteria everywhere as I gradually got more plants.

With a light plant stocking, the ammonia from the first few batches of fish will be removed by the plants. But a few bacteria will also grow. As more fish are added, more bacteria will grow and the two together, plants and bacteria, will keep the fish safe.

As long as we understand that silent cycles are slow and steady, there should not be a problem. Planting a tank then adding a whole tankful of fish immediately after is likely to end up as a fish-in cycle with its daily water changes.

 

[Fishiemang]

You guys and this cycle stuff....hehe.

Look. When you do a fish-in cycle, you don't toss a dozen fish in the tank. You get one or 2 SMALL fish. Depending on the tank volume, you decide what small is. You do not need to do daily water changes! This is important. What bacteria are.floating around in the water looking for a home are going to be removed. Not to mention, the stuff they eat will also be removed. How do you ever expect bacteria to thrive if you starve them? Keeping your levels at zero will cause your tank to never cycle. A little ammonia ain't gonna hurt the fish, provided you followed the first rule....SMALL FISH.

As for plants, plant the tank, toss in your small fishie, and watch it swim. After a month, you can add another small fish. The plants need food too, so don't go changing out all that water all the time.

As for a filter, you should have this. Unless you want a crappy mosquito pond in your house. It not only mechanically removes detritus, it aerates the water. Stagnant water will deplete oxygen at a rate depending on how many critters you have consuming it. You need to replace it. A simple filter will do the trick. Yes, you should run a filter. Even in a planted tank. You need the benefits that reach far beyond just "filtering" the water.

 

[jams]

? Nice Looking Tank.

Keep "Everything" as is.

The argument can be made either way, based on the replies you've gotten.
I for one would not forgo filtration, so many benefits.
Just remember, "Every tank is as different as a fingerprint".

Good Luck !

 

[LordHappy]

Happy day...that is a beautiful tank. As I've written about a few times, I have two small tanks using the Walstad method. The first tank became know as the Bedroom Pond Feature after four weeks, and then the plants kicked into high gear, the amano shrimp went to work and the oto knocked out the rest. Almost a year old, it has barely any algae and no smell. I change one gallon a month, or roughly 25%. The second tank is now two months old, has a little algae, and I have done two-gallon water change since starting it. The parameters for both tanks are perfect and stable for what our tap water produces.

Later this spring I will be converting a 50 gallon tank to this method, and starting it from the ground up after re-homing the inhabitants. My solution to the bacteria starter kit was to fill some mesh bags with gravel that soaked in the other tanks, and then to use those bags for banking and making the slopes. Other than that, no filters, no pumps.

For your existing tank, I would not get rid of the filter. I think you have a working environment and lord knows things go all wahoonie-shaped easily enough without monkeying around with it.

 

[Utar]

Thanks for your replies.

Like I said before, I learn more about fish keeping here on threads like TFF then any other place on the web and thanks for the complements on my aquarium, I am proud of it.

The 55 gallon shown here is my most successful aquarium in the past 5 years of fish keeping and I don't intend on changing much about it. That old saying, "If it ain't broke don't fix it."

This is my first tank where I went all natural, no plastic, no fake ornaments just natural wood, live plants, and rocks. You know I do believe this also contributed greatly to the success of this tank. IMHO, all natural like this helps the inhabitants to feel like they are in a more natural environment, helping to keep down stress. Plenty of plants to hide in and nibble on. Plenty of wood for the plecos.

I have only lost one fish so far and it was one of my tetras which I believe was due to being bullied by the Angels. I plan on moving the tetras soon.

 

[eatyourpeas]

I haven't read the whole thread. The filter is an important part of your system as it moves water around the tank and allows gas exchange. Without a filter and no movement your tank will become like a stagnant pond. Every aquarium needs water movement. An air stone is a great way to increase the surface area of your tank, but does little else.

I have been discovering that some plants are much happier with water movement, like Anubias and Cryptocoryne. I am seeing incredible growth just by changing the flow of the spray bar output. It is like they just woke up!