Peat In Filters

[AndyTaylor]

Could anyone explain the whole putting peat in your filter thing? I understand what it's supposed to accomplish but is it literally a quantity of moss peat placed directly into the filter or is there a product designed for the purpose.
Could a put a thin layer of peat as a substrate under 2 inches or more of gravel or is this asking for trouble.
I'll be starting my new tank setup soon and will be aiming for PH6, soft water conditions for south american type fishys. Bogwood and gravel with tons of plants and CO2 delivery system is the plan. I quite like the tannin stained water look so that's not the issue, it's more the controlability (sp?) factor.....I assume if the peat is in my filter then i can remove it if i like.....not so easy if it's my substrate, i'd be guessing.
Also how do you know how much peat to add, presumably more peat = more acidic, or does it work like that?

'tis great being a newbie......so many questions!

Thanks y'all

Andy

 

[newfishaddict]

Could anyone explain the whole putting peat in your filter thing? I understand what it's supposed to accomplish but is it literally a quantity of moss peat placed directly into the filter or is there a product designed for the purpose.
Could a put a thin layer of peat as a substrate under 2 inches or more of gravel or is this asking for trouble.
I'll be starting my new tank setup soon and will be aiming for PH6, soft water conditions for south american type fishys. Bogwood and gravel with tons of plants and CO2 delivery system is the plan. I quite like the tannin stained water look so that's not the issue, it's more the controlability (sp?) factor.....I assume if the peat is in my filter then i can remove it if i like.....not so easy if it's my substrate, i'd be guessing.
Also how do you know how much peat to add, presumably more peat = more acidic, or does it work like that?

'tis great being a newbie......so many questions!

Thanks y'all

Andy

The chemistry involved with aiming for a specific pH is a bit complicated. I do think that more peat = more acidic but not allways; you need to understand buffers and the buffering capacity of your water. I would make sure you have water with little buffering capacity, perhaps mineralized bottled water.

 

[AndyTaylor]

I'm finding it a stretch to pay for the new tank so i sure as heck am not going to fill it with 200L of bottled water!
I don't need PH6 dead on but I need to be able to keep it within the 6 to 6.5 range. I'm off to read up on buffering.....more questions will follow...

Andy

 

[modernhamlet]

Andy, you may get some more experience responses in the Planted Tanks forum.

My limited understanding is that a little peat goes a long way. For a heavily planted tank with acid loving roots, a fine dusting of peat below the main substrate is apparently helpful, but you have to be careful of adding too much, lest acid buildup kill off the roots.

A couple of other questions:
What are your tapwater pH, KH, and GH?
Are you going to be using CO2?

 

[SkiFletch]

A couple of other questions:
What are your tapwater pH, KH, and GH?
Are you going to be using CO2?

Those are mine too... They will greatly influence how much peat you'd need to keep your water in the ranges you describe. Buffering is a relatively easy concept to understand. Put very simply, the higher your KH and GH, the MORE buffering capacity you have, and therefore the MORE you will have to add things like CO2/peat to decrease your pH.

Also, what speific fish are you using that require such a low pH? Discus?

 

[AndyTaylor]

My tapwater is PH7...i've never tested it for KH/GH as I've only just realised how important it is. I'll be picking up a test kit @ the weekend. I actually had major problems finding a LFS that stocked these tests but i've ordered the Interpret KH/GH and Phosphate tests.
I intend to use CO2 pending advice to the contrary..... from what i've read on here it seems like the way to go to get that lush, planted tank i'm after?
I want to keep Rams, Angels and possibly some Tetra for size contrast. I'd love Discus but I think I need some more experience first.....maybe tank 3!
I didn't realise that 6 - 6.5 was very low, i thought it was the preferred PH for these fishys? am i wrong?

Sorry if i've posted in the wrong place, modernhamlet, please feel free to move this if required.

Thanks all

 

[modernhamlet]

My tapwater is PH7... intend to use CO2 pending advice to the contrary..... from what i've read on here it seems like the way to go to get that lush, planted tank i'm after?

Assuming you have adequate lighting (2+ watts per gallon), then yes, CO2 is the next big factor in getting good plant growth. And depending on your KH, adding CO2 may push your pH down towards where you're looking for, even without peat.

I want to keep Rams, Angels and possibly some Tetra for size contrast. I'd love Discus but I think I need some more experience first.....maybe tank 3! I didn't realise that 6 - 6.5 was very low, i thought it was the preferred PH for these fishys? am i wrong?

While many South Americans do come from acidic waters, all of those will do just fine at pH 7.

Sorry if i've posted in the wrong place, modernhamlet, please feel free to move this if required.

Not at all! I was just pointing you to where the experienced plant people spend a lot of time. Introduce yourself if you get the chance. They're nice folks...

 

[yvez9]

i agree with modernhamlet. Don't mess with the chemistry of the water. Just add co2 and that should do the trick. All the fish you mentionned will be fine at a ph of 7

 

[SkiFletch]

Yeah, I have to agree. If you go with higher lighting 2+ WPG and want a lush planted tank, CO2 is the way to go.

If I had to take a GUESS, with a pH of 7.0 I'd say your KH/GH are both around 8ppm which isn't high or low really. As a very general rule of thumb for tap water, the higher the pH the higher the KH. That theory really only applies to water out of a municipal tap because of where the water comes from and what treatments are done to it. For example, my tapwater has a pH of 8.0 and a KH/GH of around 18-20 each... I've kept angels and Neons in the past when I was much younger with those water conditions. About the only fish I wouldn't try keeping like that would be discus.

Remember this above all else when considering CO2/pH. Many fish can tolerate a wide range of pH, but what they cannot under almoast any circumstance tolerate is large fast swings in pH. Keep things stable and you'll have much happier fishies.

Good luck

 

[modernhamlet]

Yeah, I have to agree. If you go with higher lighting 2+ WPG and want a lush planted tank, CO2 is the way to go.

If I had to take a GUESS, with a pH of 7.0 I'd say your KH/GH are both around 8ppm which isn't high or low really. As a very general rule of thumb for tap water, the higher the pH the higher the KH. That theory really only applies to water out of a municipal tap because of where the water comes from and what treatments are done to it. For example, my tapwater has a pH of 8.0 and a KH/GH of around 18-20 each... I've kept angels and Neons in the past when I was much younger with those water conditions. About the only fish I wouldn't try keeping like that would be discus.

Remember this above all else when considering CO2/pH. Many fish can tolerate a wide range of pH, but what they cannot under almoast any circumstance tolerate is large fast swings in pH. Keep things stable and you'll have much happier fishies.

Good luck

Good points, skifletch.

Though as an exception to the rule, I give you my municiple water:

pH: 9.3
kH: 2
GH: 3

No kidding...

That said, the opposite is very often true: the lower the pH, the less likely it is to have a high KH.

 

[SkiFletch]

thats some interesting tapwater ya got there

 

[AndyTaylor]

Thanks Guys..... I think i'll stick with CO2 only for the moment. I reckon with the amount of bogwood i'm going to use i'll see a drop in pH anyway.
Got some good info on buffering here (http/faq.thekrib.com/begin-chem.html) so at least I understand whats happening now, i think...
For now i'll concentrate on getting the tank set up and cycled...
Thanks again,

Andy

 

[modernhamlet]

Thanks Guys..... I think i'll stick with CO2 only for the moment. I reckon with the amount of bogwood i'm going to use i'll see a drop in pH anyway.
Got some good info on buffering here (http/faq.thekrib.com/begin-chem.html) so at least I understand whats happening now, i think...
For now i'll concentrate on getting the tank set up and cycled...
Thanks again,

Andy

Let us know how things go. Sounds like you've got a great tank planned!

 

[AndyTaylor]

Thanks modernhamlet.......the plans are great but it remains to be seen if I can make it work. I'm picking up the tank, plants, substrate (if i can find some) gravel etc on saturday so I'll keep you posted. I may even do a planted tank diary....I'm off over to the Planted tank forum to introduce myself....I may be some time!

Thanks again for all the help,

Andy

 

[newfishaddict]

I'm finding it a stretch to pay for the new tank so i sure as heck am not going to fill it with 200L of bottled water!
I don't need PH6 dead on but I need to be able to keep it within the 6 to 6.5 range. I'm off to read up on buffering.....more questions will follow...

Andy

Hi Andy, I live in Canada and I have noticed where you live. I can get 10gallons of very pure mineralized water that has low GH AND KH for about 2$; that is probably not the case in Ireland.....I should add that the drift wood I use in my tanks has helped lower my pH 7.8 tap water with moderate to high KH and GH, to about pH 6.9 in one month......

Yeah, I have to agree. If you go with higher lighting 2+ WPG and want a lush planted tank, CO2 is the way to go.

If I had to take a GUESS, with a pH of 7.0 I'd say your KH/GH are both around 8ppm which isn't high or low really. As a very general rule of thumb for tap water, the higher the pH the higher the KH. That theory really only applies to water out of a municipal tap because of where the water comes from and what treatments are done to it. For example, my tapwater has a pH of 8.0 and a KH/GH of around 18-20 each... I've kept angels and Neons in the past when I was much younger with those water conditions. About the only fish I wouldn't try keeping like that would be discus.

Remember this above all else when considering CO2/pH. Many fish can tolerate a wide range of pH, but what they cannot under almoast any circumstance tolerate is large fast swings in pH. Keep things stable and you'll have much happier fishies.

Good luck

Good points, skifletch.

Though as an exception to the rule, I give you my municiple water:

pH: 9.3
kH: 2
GH: 3

No kidding...

That said, the opposite is very often true: the lower the pH, the less likely it is to have a high KH.

Wow, pH 9.3 tap water!? That is very rare....are you sure? Have you double checked your chemisty with the water supppliers official lab results? In Canada that pH would be illegal for tap water......