Out Of Control Chaeto

[Donya]

Because my 12 gallon has MH lighting on it, my macro grows like mad. That was kind of what I wanted, but the problem is the Chaeto is taking over and I can never get it all out without damaging the other macro and risking it dying from being chopped up. The macro is supporting quite a population of marco-munchers, including lots of echinoderms and some big snails, and even with that I'm still taking $30 tade worth of Chaeto to the LFS every couple weeks. Although it's great for getting supplise, it's a very laborious task sitting and untangling all that stuff from the tank...picking off criters, avoiding bristleworms and whatnot. The Chaeto is just outgrowing and strangling my other macro species, even at low light levels (tried taking the MH off and it just beat back the non-Chaeto). I'm not really sure what to do about this situation, since I wanted a macro-dominated tank, I just would like to find something that can compete with the chaeto such that it isn't able to form dense mats, but at the same time something that will grow fast enough that it can be nibbled by animals without dying off. I had thought Caulerpa species could do that, but so far they're not doing such a great job. Are there any good competator species or other plants that might do the job?

So far out-competed algaes include:
- grape Caulerpa, eaten like candy by my snails
- Valonia, starved of light by the Caeto mats
- possibly Sargassum...although I'm not sure because it got choked out pretty fast and the wilted remains were gobbled up
- feather Caulerpa, C. taxifolia (this one being knocked out shocked me!)

Survivors:
- a couple types of razor Caulerpa (C. serrulata and some other one)
- another type of feather Caulerpa (C. sertularioides)
- ribbon(?) Caulerpa (C. prolifera...it may be on the decline at this point)

Alternatively, I'm wondering if there is some small animal that will at least hack away at the macro further down where I can't get to it so easily. The lower-down areas near the rock are consistently where the Chaeto gets a foothold each time to bounce back. I was wondering about a mythrax crab. Do those guys show selection in what they chop up though? If so it could potentially backfire, but so far I havn't found an answer to whether herbivorous crabs will avoid Chaeto or eat it along with the rest. Also, how safe are those sorts of crabs with anemones and soft corals like mushrooms?

I suppose if there is no good solution I'll just continue to untangle Chaeto every so often...but it really is a pain at least none of my herbivores are in danger of starvation lol

 

[@ombomb]

Out of interest, which snails are eating the grape caulerpa?

I have some I've been trying to wipe out, but it's being a bit of a pain.

 

[Mr Miagi]

A weird answer, but do you have hermits in the tank? I know my hermits were the only things that went for my macro (apart from the hairy crabs), including my cheato. Little buggers.... For that, they got the ride to the FOWLR!

 

[Donya]

A weird answer, but do you have hermits in the tank?

I had a couple of redtip hermits (Clibanarius ransoni) in there for a while that ignored it. Currently I only have one dwarf zebra hermit in the tank, but neither species has ever touched my macro when they could find other food. I havn't added more hermits to the tank because the LFS has been experiencing a hermit shortage for a while. What type of hermits do you have that ate macro? I'd like to give that a shot...

Out of interest, which snails are eating the grape caulerpa?

My Turbo was probably the biggest eater of the grape Caulerpa, although I had a conch for a while that squished a lot of it by accident. The Turbo eating it was definitely what wiped it out in that tank though.

 

[@ombomb]

I clearly have picky turbos then as they don't seem to go anywhere near it.

It does look nice, it just grows too fast for my liking.

 

[Donya]

I clearly have picky turbos then as they don't seem to go anywhere near it.

Do you know what species of Turbo you have? Not all will eat macro, but my T. fluctuosas spend a lof ot their time snacking on it unless I distract them with nori or some other food. Another factor in my Turbos eating Caulerpa specifically is the light intensity that it's grown under...they avoid feather and razor Caulerpa that's been grown under the full force of the MH lighting, and prefer the growth that occurs further down where it's somewhat shaddowed. My guess currently is that it has to do with light intensity affecting the production of the bad tasting chemicals that Caulerpa is supposed to have. The grape Caulerpa didn't last long enough to undergo that experiment though.

 

[Donya]

Well, I thought I had found a solution and it has backfired in classic fashion. I ultimately had to rule out hermits since the LFS only gets in zebras and redtips, and neither eat my macro, so I'm outa luck for hermits to eat the Chaeto. I found out what the LFS was doing with all that stuff I bring in and why they want so much of it...seems a good amount of it becomes lettuce sea slug and sea hare food. They offered to trade Chaetro for either, so I thought ok, done a lot of reading on those guys, know the sea hares bad for ink but lettuce ones won't nuke/destroy/etc., no issue of running out of food, why not...one lettuce slug. Well, there's no issue of running out of food alright, but as soon as it found my razor Caulerpa it had a party and hasn't looked back. This isn't completely bad since the razor Caulerpa has become the next most dominant species in there and is also making a pest of itself in places by out-competing my softer, broad-leaf species. But, I now have a fat, greener lettuce slug and even more Chaeto LOL so much for ecological ballance. It nibbles at the Chaeto a bit, but not nearly as much as it sucks on the nice big razor Caulerpa stems. I guess Chaeto is second pick to that one type of Caulerpa, which they don't have at the LFS...so naturally everything over there eats the Chaeto and not other Caulerpa species looks like I'll just keep harvesting the Chaeto (which is easier to pull out now that the Caulpera is less prominant at the surface...one small benefit) and let the lettuce sea slug have a field day with the rest, since it all out-grows the rate that its eaten.

 

[SkiFletch]

Yeah, my lettuce nudi (when I had it) had the following preference: Culerpa > Hair algae > chaeto. Also, make sure any powerheads are covered with inlet foam

 

[Donya]

What was the species of Caulerpa it went for? Mine doesn't like the big feather Caulerpa. But, that species also has some awful smelling chemical in it when its squished. At the LFS they were all over the Chaeto and ignoring everything else. I had thought that the noxious stuff in Caulerpa was pretty much present in all species, but I guess not...oh well, live and learn.

I keep all my powerheads covered with thick sponge just on principal after having seen freshwater snails have some awful accidents involving filters/pumps/etc. I figure although marine snails are less likely to have that happen, better not to take the chance

 

[SkiFletch]

Grape Culerpa, not sure on the species name

 

[Donya]

Ah...grape Caulerpa is mega yummy munchies to everything in my tanks except my goby lol.

Well, further backfiring...all the macro is bouncing back faster as it's being eaten away. So, if anything, adding herbivores has actually increased the growth rate, thereby not changing the situation. The limiting growth factor must be something scarce in the tank, like phosphates. Pretty amazing really, considering just how much stuff is eating away at it and that I'm still taking it in to the LFS regularly. I may wind up giving up yet again on trying to beat back the Chaeto and just accept that the tank is a macro farm that has to be harvested periodically lol.

 

[Donya]

Well, the solution was apparently....a sea bunny. After extensive discussions with the this LFS guru who may know my tank better than I do by this point, I shall now become a monk and devote my life to the worship of these opisthobranchs, even though they remind me of sillyputty that has gottn hairy after falling behind the couch. Chaeto is down to a manageable level, Caulerpa is up, and water circulation is a lot better as a result. Still gotta harvest some Chaeto off the surface occasionally but it's been mostly cleared out of the "understory" of the Caulerpa forest, which is where it was really making a mess and doing damage to the other macro. I may yet be able to save my few scragly bits of broadleaf Caulerpa.

(edited some awful typos...sorry lol mental note not to post when I'm so tired)

 

[sianeds]

I have been reading this thread with interest but I have no clue about the algaes you'tr talking about.

Any chance of some pics??

 

[@ombomb]

Grape Caulerpa

Feather Caulerpa

Chaeto

 

[sianeds]

thankyou