Other Tetra Types To Keep With Red Eye Tetra

Michael John

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Previously I’ve kept as variety of fish, usually just whatever I liked the look of and which my local fish shop advised were easy to keep and would get on.

I’ve recently bought ten Red Eye tetra. They’re not getting on with my Betta so are currently in a tank by themselves with some catfish. I’m moving the Red Eyes to a 35g/160l tank (currently empty).

I’d like to keep a variety of different tetras in the tank. I have a really good fish shop nearby with dozens of different tetras. Are there any tetras that can’t be kept with Red Eye Tetra?
 
Red eye tetras are fin nippers so avoid slow moving fish and fish with long fins.
 
Just to be certain, can you give us the scientific name of the "Red Eye" Tetra? I've seen three or four different species referred to by other members as "Red Eye."

Also please note, male bettas are not community fish and should never be in with other fish. This is for the sake of the betta and the other fish.
 
Just to be certain, can you give us the scientific name of the "Red Eye" Tetra? I've seen three or four different species referred to by other members as "Red Eye."

Also please note, male bettas are not community fish and should never be in with other fish. This is for the sake of the betta and the other fish.
No idea, they were just sold as “Red Eye Tetras”, on the “Bettas in community tanks” I’ve kept Bettas for years, I always keep them with a few bottom feeders and a shoal of small fish and had no issues, everything I’ve read says this is an absolutely fine way to do things, so long as you avoid certain species like guppies that they could mistake for other male bettas.
 
No idea, they were just sold as “Red Eye Tetras”, on the “Bettas in community tanks” I’ve kept Bettas for years, I always keep them with a few bottom feeders and a shoal of small fish and had no issues, everything I’ve read says this is an absolutely fine way to do things, so long as you avoid certain species like guppies that they could mistake for other male bettas.

I do not want to be arguing over this, again (a couple of similar threads recently), but this is only a part of the issue. This will explain the issues and why it is a serious risk to the fish (betta and the others).

Betta splendens seems to live solitary in its natural habitat which is still and sluggish waters, including rice paddies, swamps, roadside ditches, streams and ponds. Such an environment is not conducive to fish that require oxygenated waters so one can expect few if any non-anabantid species to live in such habitats. During the dry season, most bettas are able to bury themselves in the bottom of their dried up habitat. There, they can live in moist cavities until water once again fills the depression during a rainy period. The fish can survive even if thick, clay mud is all that is left of the water. They do not survive total drying out of the bottom (Vierke 1988). There are very few fish species, and none that are found in the same habitats, that can manage life in such conditions, which is further evidence that the B. splendens is most likely a solitary species.​
All anabantids are territorial; male bettas instinctively fight each other in defending their territory. Selective breeding over many years has produced fish with a heightened sense of territory defense, which explains the common name of Siamese Fighting Fish. Fish fights for money is a "sport," if you want to use the term for such animal cruelty. This means the bettas we see in stores have an even greater propensity to literally kill each other given the chance. For a fish that instinctively lives alone, and believes it must defend its territory to survive--both traits that are in the genetic blueprint (DNA) for this species--this aggressiveness is likely to extend to any fish that dares enter the betta's territory, which in most cases will be the tank space. And forcing the fish to "live" under such conditions is frankly inhumane.​
Individual fish within a species do not always adhere to the "norm" for the species; this is true of all animals, including humans. But with fish, responsible aquarists should research the fish's behaviours, traits, and requirements, and then aim to provide accordingly. "Expectations" are as I said above programmed into the species' DNA, and we are not going to change them just because we may want to have a betta in the tank with "x" fish species. Sometimes the betta seems to co-operate with our experiment, but in many of these situations it may not last for long, eventually if not immediately. Fish that do succumb are likely being severely stressed, unseen to the aquarist until it is too late.​
If the betta does not first attack the intruders, the intruders may go after the betta. It is a two-way street, and in either situation it is the betta that loses in the end. Severe stress causing increased aggression, or conversely severe withdrawal from being targeted by the other fish. And physical aggression is not the only concern; fish release pheromones and allomones, chemical communication signals that other fish read, and these can cause stress and promote aggression that will in time weaken the fish to the point of death. There is no reason to risk the fish in one's attempt to prove scientific understanding wrong.​
References:
Betta splendens profile on Seriously Fish.com​
Hargrove, M. (1999), The Betta: an Owner's Guide to a Happy Healthy Fish, Howell Book House.​
Kottelat, M. (2013) "The fishes of the inland waters of southeast Asia: a catalogue and core bibliography of the fishes known to occur in freshwaters, mangroves and estuaries," Raffles Bulletin of Zoology Supplement No. 27: 1-663.​
Tan, H. H. and P. K. L. Ng (2005), "The fighting fishes (Teleostei: Osphronemidae: genus Betta) of Singapore, Malaysia and Brunei," Raffles Bulletin of Zoology, Supplement No. 13, pp. 43-99.​
Tan, H. H. and P. K. L. Ng (2005), "The labyrinth fishes (Teleostei: Anabanatoidei, Channoidei) of Sumatra, Indonesia," Raffles Bulletin of Zoology, Supplement No. 13, pp. 115-138.​
Vierke, J. (1988), Bettas, Gouramis, and Other Anabantoids, T.F.H. Publication, Inc.​
 
can you post a picture of the red eye tetras, we can work out the species from that
I’m just at work at the minute but I’ve had a Google, it’s definitely Moenkhausia sanctaefilomenae, black band on the tail, silver, red eyes. Apparently it’s Redeye Tetra, not “Red Eye” which is where I’ve caused confusion. Apologies.
 
I do not want to be arguing over this, again (a couple of similar threads recently), but this is only a part of the issue. This will explain the issues and why it is a serious risk to the fish (betta and the others).

Betta splendens seems to live solitary in its natural habitat which is still and sluggish waters, including rice paddies, swamps, roadside ditches, streams and ponds. Such an environment is not conducive to fish that require oxygenated waters so one can expect few if any non-anabantid species to live in such habitats. During the dry season, most bettas are able to bury themselves in the bottom of their dried up habitat. There, they can live in moist cavities until water once again fills the depression during a rainy period. The fish can survive even if thick, clay mud is all that is left of the water. They do not survive total drying out of the bottom (Vierke 1988). There are very few fish species, and none that are found in the same habitats, that can manage life in such conditions, which is further evidence that the B. splendens is most likely a solitary species.​
All anabantids are territorial; male bettas instinctively fight each other in defending their territory. Selective breeding over many years has produced fish with a heightened sense of territory defense, which explains the common name of Siamese Fighting Fish. Fish fights for money is a "sport," if you want to use the term for such animal cruelty. This means the bettas we see in stores have an even greater propensity to literally kill each other given the chance. For a fish that instinctively lives alone, and believes it must defend its territory to survive--both traits that are in the genetic blueprint (DNA) for this species--this aggressiveness is likely to extend to any fish that dares enter the betta's territory, which in most cases will be the tank space. And forcing the fish to "live" under such conditions is frankly inhumane.​
Individual fish within a species do not always adhere to the "norm" for the species; this is true of all animals, including humans. But with fish, responsible aquarists should research the fish's behaviours, traits, and requirements, and then aim to provide accordingly. "Expectations" are as I said above programmed into the species' DNA, and we are not going to change them just because we may want to have a betta in the tank with "x" fish species. Sometimes the betta seems to co-operate with our experiment, but in many of these situations it may not last for long, eventually if not immediately. Fish that do succumb are likely being severely stressed, unseen to the aquarist until it is too late.​
If the betta does not first attack the intruders, the intruders may go after the betta. It is a two-way street, and in either situation it is the betta that loses in the end. Severe stress causing increased aggression, or conversely severe withdrawal from being targeted by the other fish. And physical aggression is not the only concern; fish release pheromones and allomones, chemical communication signals that other fish read, and these can cause stress and promote aggression that will in time weaken the fish to the point of death. There is no reason to risk the fish in one's attempt to prove scientific understanding wrong.​
References:
Betta splendens profile on Seriously Fish.com​
Hargrove, M. (1999), The Betta: an Owner's Guide to a Happy Healthy Fish, Howell Book House.​
Kottelat, M. (2013) "The fishes of the inland waters of southeast Asia: a catalogue and core bibliography of the fishes known to occur in freshwaters, mangroves and estuaries," Raffles Bulletin of Zoology Supplement No. 27: 1-663.​
Tan, H. H. and P. K. L. Ng (2005), "The fighting fishes (Teleostei: Osphronemidae: genus Betta) of Singapore, Malaysia and Brunei," Raffles Bulletin of Zoology, Supplement No. 13, pp. 43-99.​
Tan, H. H. and P. K. L. Ng (2005), "The labyrinth fishes (Teleostei: Anabanatoidei, Channoidei) of Sumatra, Indonesia," Raffles Bulletin of Zoology, Supplement No. 13, pp. 115-138.​
Vierke, J. (1988), Bettas, Gouramis, and Other Anabantoids, T.F.H. Publication, Inc.​
With all due respect, I can provide you with an equally long list of people who would disagree with your opinion, academic works, hobbyists, a wealth of online info (obviously with the required pinch of salt) and my own personal experience, so probably best we just agree to disagree on this one.
 
I’m just at work at the minute but I’ve had a Google, it’s definitely Moenkhausia sanctaefilomenae, black band on the tail, silver, red eyes. Apparently it’s Redeye Tetra, not “Red Eye” which is where I’ve caused confusion. Apologies.

The specific common name is/was not the confusion, it was the use of a common name. I have seen three different tetras called "red eye" (or redeye). Common names are really only "common" to those using them because thy know what fish they mean. Most stores have invoices for fish shipments, and the scientific name is often on those, and they won't mind letting you see it.
 
With all due respect, I can provide you with an equally long list of people who would disagree with your opinion, academic works, hobbyists, a wealth of online info (obviously with the required pinch of salt) and my own personal experience, so probably best we just agree to disagree on this one.

I'm sorry, it has nothing to do with who may disagree with me; and anyway, this is not my "opinion," it is factual information. If anyone chooses to ignore it (note, it is not "disagreeing with" but ignoring fact), fine. A lot, perhaps the majority, of info on the internet is inaccurate; we each need to identify those who have the knowledge to match the experience. I am here to try and help people have more success and healthy fish, because I care about them.
 
I'm sorry, it has nothing to do with who may disagree with me; and anyway, this is not my "opinion," it is factual information. If anyone chooses to ignore it (note, it is not "disagreeing with" but ignoring fact), fine. A lot, perhaps the majority, of info on the internet is inaccurate; we each need to identify those who have the knowledge to match the experience. I am here to try and help people have more success and healthy fish, because I care about them.
It’s not “fact”, if there’s significant volumes of study that disagree based on the same evidence. I’m not interested in getting in an argument with you. I’ll stick to advice from people with years of experience I can verify, as opposed to anonymous people on Internet forums in the future. Thanks for your time, have a good one 👍
 

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