No Aggravation Please!

[Paradise3]

The answers in bold are mine.
http/wiki.answers.com/Q/What_kind_of_fish_can_you_keep_in_a_fish_bowl&updated=1&waNoAnsSet=2

Alessa x.

 

[Jonty]

TBH what the guy is saying is ok, keeping water at 70-80, checking for ammonia and doing regualar water changes. Most people say 2.5gal minimum, not 5gal.

 

[JoshuaA]

Jonty the problem is...

I can keep my border collie in a cardboard box inside the oven with it turned on because it will fit, doesn't necessarily mean it's the best place for it.

Now in those conditions I am sure my dog will perish sooner rather than later where as it currently as ample amount of room.

Even placing fish in the minimum amount of space possible is somewhat cruel in my eyes and I think you should always over compensate however some people just don't see it like that and since there are no regulations you can't really do anything to prevent it...

Nice try Alessa but some people are too fixed on what they want to care about what they need.

Edit:

The main thing I see when someone gives advice like the poster before Alessa is... the person will pick up what they want to see "Ooooh a small bowl, that's great" they're not willing to go follow... "On that note the more room a fish has to swim the happier". This then leads most people to be rather minimal on the rest of their decisions and it applies for a lot of things in life.

I worked in a pet store for some time and I had a few disgusting customers come in, one whom had a budgie in a canary cage for 10 years and had never let it out. The size of the cage and with toys meant the bird couldn't even spread it's wings. However they insisted it was fine because the product was advertised as a budgie cage. This is the same case for the Betta.

Furthermore I doubt if someone plops a Betta in a 1.5gbowl, I would be even more disgusted if that was US rather than UK gallons then I HIGHLY doubt they would even bother feeding it properly. Sure you can do a 100% water change frequently in fact daily but after 2 weeks do you think the minimalistic mindset of a person would carry on?

And once again...

No regulations = you can do what you want, its only your conscience which can steer you away from decisions like this.

 

[BethK]

I've got ya back

 

[Paradise3]

But surely i give good advice and someone calls me an idiot isn't good?

Alessa x.

 

[JoshuaA]

You could give them a free 10g tank and they'd probably still call you an idiot. Edit: (Not calling you an idiot if this was read incorrectly and I think it was by some).

It was implying that some people insist on having a small tank no matter what even if they are presented with a fantastic deal for free.

People have their mind set on what they want/know and when someone tells them differently they don't response well. Just don't take it to heart.

 

[loraxchick]

this thread is on the verge of taking the wrong turn. minimal housing for a single betta is a highly debated topic. the "argument" goes round and round. the fact of the matter is that a smaller than 5 gal tank is a perfectly acceptable volume to keep a single betta, considering heating and filtration/strict waterchanges are met. to say 5 gal minimum is simply pushing a preference for keeping, and has no factual basis for healthier, more active fish. it is a matter of preference and what the keeper feels comfortable with. i will say that ive kept bettas in a wide range of tanks, from 1.5 gal to 10+ and have noticed no difference in health and vitality being a variable of tank size. just make sure the needs are met in way of good warm water and nutritious food. there has not been issues either with "not enough room" or looking like the fish is in a cardboard box. that analogy just is not accurate. but certainly there are MANY "housing options" that are on the market that i agree are too small. the line has to be drawn somewhere and i think it is becomming overinflated in regard to a minimum volume.
to say a "larger" tank is better is fine. to say it is necessity is not helpful or factual. everyone is entitled to opinion, but those of us who choose to house a betta in a smaller tank should not be chastised or attacked. it is not in keeping with what the forum is all about and all too often new members who have problems and keep in smaller volumes of water get chased away without receiving help and guidance they NEED. you can keep a healthy, active betta in these smaller conditions. just because one may chose not to and uses bigger tanks is another thing.
not tot start a large debate or similar outcome with this post, but just be clear that the 5 gal "rule" is opinion and there are plenty of options for smaller housing that will allow someone to successfully keep a healthy betta for its entire lifespan.
please refrain from name-calling and abuse based on the above post. we have a great community here and id like to see everyone be able to post without reservation or fear that they will be singled out. it should not be a contest on who's got the biggest best tank. it is all about keeping healthy beautiful fish! so please bear that in mind everyone.
all the best
cheers

 

[OldMan47]

I will go much farther than Loraxchick on this subject. Professional betta breeders, the ones who make a living selling top quality stock, almost always keep that stock in jars that are 1 gallon or smaller. They do not do anything to impact the health or growth of their fish, it is after all their livelihood. To be blunt here, Betta splendens does not require anything much larger than maybe a 2 litre jar but few hobbyists will keep them in such small quarters. They also do not require individual heaters in their jars nor filters. The commercial breeders usually take care of chemical contaminants by doing water changes frequently, not by using a biofilter and they heat the jars by keeping them in a warm location. There is an enormous difference between hobby fish keepers like us and people that actual cater to a fish's minimal needs for good health and growth. The differences are a matter of personal taste, not necessity.
With all that said, my present 4 year old veiltail is in a 45 gallon tank that houses my endler breeding colony and some bristlenose plecs.
As far as the response you get on a Wiki site, there are no posts on a typical Wiki site that can be considered facts. At best they are akin to a blog by a rank amateur and at worst people believe their content and do all kinds of silly things with fish or other subjects. Here at TFF, the MODs try to correct misconceptions and prevent outright misinformation being spread unchallenged. Most Wiki locations don't even have that degree of checking answers. If you want facts, avoid Wiki sites except for one use they do have. sometimes they will give you some good key words for further searches that may turn up a well written and properly edited site.

 

[Gill]

Very good responses, one of the reasons why i like Lora as a Mod in here.

 

[LaVidaBoring]

I've been having an e-mail chat with one of the big betta breeders/importers from aquabid, who has perfect 100% good feedback, and he says the same thing as loraxchick and OldMan47.

He keeps his bettas in small jars in a warm room, changes their water completely on a weekly basis. I told him that my betta was in a 2.5 gall unfiltered, heated container and that I saw ammonia traces every couple of days. He said he used to stress over that too, but saw that his fish did fine even with weekly water changes.

He has kept his breeding stock for years that way and he says he uses a bit of salt plus Indian almond extract and his bettas never get sick.

His opinion is that bettas are so hardy and have been domesticated for so long that they can adapt to harsh conditions. He probably selects out his breeding stock based on fish who can survive in these conditions as well, I'm thinking.

So, yes, there are plenty of opinions and experience out there that doesn't jive with the "must keep bettas in nothing less than heated/filtered 5 gall" container.

That being said, I think they do like having the extra space and all the nice plants you can put in a larger container. Mine seems to, at any rate.

 

[JoshuaA]

Just picking up on what Oldman said about the wiki sites...

Completely true, though I would go even further saying Wikipedia is a treasure trove of misinformation. For example looking up your place of residence and you will have "facts" you know are incorrect. It's similar to Yahoo answers however that is usually even worse.

Everything is opinionated when it comes to sizing, in my opinion whether or not you can or can't do it I wouldn't keep any fish in anything under 5UK gallons.

Edit:

My responses are opinions based on a time when I worked in a Pet store, I had multiple instances of people trying to give their animal the least amount of whatever possible to keep costs down or the fact they just didn't want a big hutch or cage. The store I worked in also had a large aquatic selection and I did on multiple times find people trying to cram loads of fish in a tank, trying to put massive fish in small tanks or having small fish which grew too big and wanting to ditch them. It didn't take long to catch onto the fact those who wanted the smaller cages etc had the most problems or ended up spending the most as they needed a new cage fairly soon after.

When it comes to animals though my feelings on giving more space of even stronger. Both my Rabbits and dog have complete freedom of the garden and house and my gerbils have oversized tanks also.