New Virgin !

[Rooster]

Just decided to take up the hobby again... been keeping tropicals since I was 8, but it was always a "hit and miss" affair... this time I have the internet ! lol
Theres SO much changed since I started 30 odd years ago.

Just bought a 4 foot tank.... will be looking for a community setup, from what I've read so far, "playpit sand" is a good source of substrate (always used gravel before.... but boring !)
Tank is 48x12x15 - not my first choice of size, but a local diy shop was selling them off, so couldnt resist !

The supplied hood will accomodate a single tube... is this enough ? if so, which one ?

Also, I have read about CO2 injection.... using a cylinder (I use them for welding, so no stranger to CO2)
Is this just a "fad" or can it be of benefit ?

Lastly.... I have always "cycled" (another new phrase) with a few fish... It now seems this is non PC, whats your opinion please ?

Many thanks
Paul

 

[dwarfgourami]

I know how you feel, having recently got back into the hobby after 30 years. Suddenly, there's an awful lot of terminology. Then again, in my case, anything seems better than the hit and miss of my early fishkeeping experience. I am getting a lot more enjoyment out of the hobby this time, not least because i understand more of what's going on in my tank.

I decided to give fishless cycling a go this time round, partly because I didn't want to make room for suitable starter fish, partly because the folks on the forum just kept twisting my arm.. Actually, I found it really good, easy to understand and all my fish seemed happy. Haven't got as far as the CO2 injections though.

Oh, I forgot: Welcome to the forum!

 

[prios]

Cycle the tank with bio-spira and you won't have to wait for anything. You have to add the fish at the same time though. Instant cycle. I use it and love it.
CO2 is for plants but you don't need it at all for fish.
The fish don't need light at all shining on them constantly so unless you're trying for a nice planted tank, the one you have should be fine for viewing the fish.
That's an odd shaped tank, is it a 40 gallon?

 

[kris-b-]

I'm not too sure about the bio-spira thing (I'm not saying it doesnt work just never heard of it) so here are a few links for you!

The pro's & cons of performing a fishless cycle:

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=114350

How to do a fishless cycle....

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=113861

Hope these help

 

[Durbkat]

Actually don't use bio spera because it doesn't really cycle the tank and the tank will become dependent on it. There is some stuff you can buy (not sure of name) that adds ammonia to your tank which speeds cycling process and a good starter fish that I'd reccomend is the black tetra or black skirt tetra and get about 6-8 of them and they are really hardy and look nice when they swim around in there school and once they feel safe they will start swimming around on there own.

 

[kris-b-]

If you are going to do a cycle with fish, you have to add your fish very slowly and this could take a few months to be complete, but if you do a fishless cycle you can add all the fish you want straight away with the fish not being exposed to any ammonia at all.

 

[dwarfgourami]

Actually don't use bio spera because it doesn't really cycle the tank and the tank will become dependent on it.

Bio-Spira is supposed to work very effectively indeed provided it has been kept refrigerated all the time. Otherwise it is useless. It is also very expensive. If I have understood things rightly, it consists of a bacteria colony so don't think your remark about tanks dependent on it is really relevant.

[/quote]
There is some stuff you can buy (not sure of name) that adds ammonia to your tank which speeds cycling process
[/quote]

Yes, it is called ammonia.

[/quote]
and a good starter fish that I'd reccomend is the black tetra or black skirt tetra and get about 6-8 of them and they are really hardy and look nice when they swim around in there school and once they feel safe they will start swimming around on there own.
[/quote]

Durbkat, you need to think about how you word your posts. The way this is written, an inexperienced reader might think that you can add ammonia AND starter fish to the tank- you'd kill the fish doing that. (If you yourself have not understood the process of fishless cycling, don't offer advice on it).

 

[Bloo]

Actually don't use bio spera because it doesn't really cycle the tank and the tank will become dependent on it. There is some stuff you can buy (not sure of name) that adds ammonia to your tank which speeds cycling process and a good starter fish that I'd reccomend is the black tetra or black skirt tetra and get about 6-8 of them and they are really hardy and look nice when they swim around in there school and once they feel safe they will start swimming around on there own.

where do you get that information from ?
Durbkat, you really need to think about dispensing advice before doing so. Either speak of something that you know as fact from personal experience, or repeat something as well document evidence. Not just something you think you heard somewhere once

Firstly, Bio Spira is just about one of the only live bacteria cultures you can buy (if it was kept refrigerated correctly).

As for the tetras, they generally do better in mature tanks and are not suited as fish to cycle with.

Rooster,

If you are questioning your light and CO2, I suggest you look down further on the board and check out some of the excellent articles in the "planted section" - what you will find are not just fads, but facts

As for cycling - the best and only way anyone should really go, is fishless.
1 - it's quicker (to reach the final full cycle)
2 - much much safer for the fish
3 - once you've done the fishless cycle, you can actually stock fish you want to keep - not just hardy fish that will "hopefully" survive atrocious conditions they are put through.

HTH

 

[prios]

Durbkat wrote:
"Actually don't use bio spera because it doesn't really cycle the tank and the tank will become dependent on it. "

This is utter nonsense.
Convince me otherwise by explaining in great detail this "dependence."

Bio-spira works exactly as advertised. I've used it on 4 tanks and it's worth every penny. You only have to do one small eensy teensy thing......follow the directions.(Which is apparently the single most difficult task in fishkeeping for some hobbyists)

Hey look at that...another argument about bio-spira. What are the odds?

E.T.A.
Rooster: sorry to be a part of your thread's highjacking, don't worry it'll get back on track. You'll get some good advice here. I always did.

 

[Durbkat]

Sorry next time I'll keep my mouth shut if I'm not 100% sure I was only 85%sure about what I said about bio spera.

 

[Ethos]

If you are going to do a cycle with fish, you have to add your fish very slowly and this could take a few months to be complete

Lie! (Oh, these arguments sure are fun...lol)
Actually, I've had a fish cycle go as fast as a week and a half, and my longest cycling w/ fish is 3 weeks.
You can do it both ways, I'm beggining to see it a little better.
I still prefer fish cycling, but I might need to try fishless cycling sometime.
You can add all your cycling fish at once, or add half one time and half another.
I've lost 1 small WC during 7 different cyclings, thats it.

1 - it's quicker (to reach the final full cycle)

Ug! Where do you people get this from? Seriously, thats a "fact" that needs to be put to rest.

 

[Bloo]

Ug! Where do you people get this from? Seriously, thats a "fact" that needs to be put to rest.

Ethos, how can you speak of fact when you've only ever tried the one method ?

Your "cycles" with fish - how large were these tanks ?
Do you actually test your ammonia, nitrite and nitrate during the entire cycle ?
Do you use any established materials to "clone" or seed your new tanks ?
And why do you have to continually cycle with fish if you can simply clone your tanks ?

 

[kris-b-]

In reply to ethos, if you add all your fish at once, they will all produce ammonia which there will be no bacteria to break down leading to the fish to be exposed to this. I'd love to know how that is kind to the fish!
Then you SHOULD add fish gradually to allow the bacteria to build up to deal with the increased bio load.

So please don't call me a liar.

 

[Ethos]

Ethos, how can you speak of fact when you've only ever tried the one method ?

Becuse I've heard the other side of it from you guys.
Thanks for that

Your "cycles" with fish - how large were these tanks ?

I've cycled.. One 5 gallon, three 10 gallons, I've cycled one twice, so technically four, and I've cycled a 55 gallon.
None of those took more than 3 weeks.

Do you actually test your ammonia, nitrite and nitrate during the entire cycle ?
Do you use any established materials to "clone" or seed your new tanks ?
And why do you have to continually cycle with fish if you can simply clone your tanks ?

No (I did after, the water levels were at where I needed them to be), no, and because I didn't
I dunno why.