New Tank ...Need Advice

[Sheila]

Ok...I think I just about have the tank under control since the overstocking disaster at startup (posted before about that). Anyway, got water tested again today and the ammonia is 1-2ppm, Nitrites are negative, but pH is 7.8 I didn't get any new fish yet and have done 25% water changes for over a week now every other day. They are now telling me to add pH decreaser and remove the filter cartridge for 24 hours. I thought pH wasn't that important. They also said not to do any more water changes. Would love advice so I don't screw up again. Thanks
Sheila

 

[waterwatereverywhere]

Didn't see your posts before but I've read them now. My personal advice would be to never go near that pet shop again!!! I was shocked to read of what they told you to start with, especially the warnings that a few fish would die in the first week - well, only because they gave you such rotten advice!!

Anyway... first of all, do the test results come from the shop or your own test kits? If from the shop, can you trust them?

Assuming they're accurate, it looks like your tank hasn't started cycling yet, as you've got ammonia but no nitrites. You should soon get nitrites, when your ammonia will drop to 0, then you'll start getting nitrates, and when both ammonia and nitrite are at 0, your tank will be cycled. Have a look at the pinned topics on new tank syndrome if you haven't already - they explain it much better than I can!

I wouldn't worry about pH at the moment personally; I think a stable pH is more important, and I wouldn't tip any more chemicals into the water at the moment anyway; I think they're just trying to sell you stuff.

And DON'T take the filter cartridge out!!! - that will set your cycle right back to square one!

And DO carry on doing water changes to dilute the ammonia - it's poisonous to your fish.

Finally, once again, find another shop!

Good luck!

 

[jams.alaskan]

Shelia, I like the advice you just got from waterwatereverywhere. The pinned topics mentioned are great. Give them a peek. Best of luck!!!

ALASKA

 

[Sheila]

I am hoping I can trust the girl that did the test at the lfs today. She seemed knowledgeable and I watched her do the test. Anyway. This past Monday, I had ammonia at 2-3ppm, nitrites were positive and pH was ok. I have done 25% water changes every other day since last saturday (so 4 water changes in the past week) to bring down the ammonia levels. Today, like I mentioned, the pH was high, the ammonia level was down to 1-2 ppm, and the nitrites are now negative. Does this mean my tank is almost cycled? or that it hasn't finished cycling? Initially I did add pH decreaser, but only half what they recommended and I had initially removed the filter cartridge like they said to. Then I saw the post by waterwatereverywhere and immediately replaced the cartridge and did another 25% water change. Right now I have 2 Opaline gouramis and 3 gold barbs in the 38gallon tank and they look quite good actually. They told me to wait until monday and get water tested again to see if the pH and ammonia are improved. They mentioned that if the pH is ok and the ammonia is zero that I can then add a few fish a week until the tank is stocked. Does this sound right? Anyway, the manager wasn't there today for my credit slip that they owe me. I do plan on purchasing my own test kit once I get my store credit. They won't give me my $70 some dollar credit until the water is ok. Sheila

 

[waterwatereverywhere]

First you get ammonia from fish waste, then helpful bacteria in your gravel and filter break that down to nitrite, then another bunch of friendly bacteria break it down to nitrate. Last Monday you had ammonia and nitrites, implying that the first lot had started to multiply. Now you have zero nitrites, so you've got some of the second lot, too, although you've still got some ammonia...

Yes you do need to wait until ammonia and nitrites are both zero before adding more fish. It would be worth getting the nitrate tested as well, though - its presence proves that you've got all your bacteria growing nicely, but you also need to keep an eye on it that it doesn't get TOO high - water changes will keep it down. (Are you adding any water conditioner to the tap water?)

So yes it looks like the tank's nearly gone through its first mini-cycle with the fish you've got. But build up your stock very gradually, as every time you add fish, you'll get another mini-cycle, as the bacteria multiply to cope with the extra waste. So test your ammonia/nitrite whenever you add fish, and don't add any more until they're back to 0 again.

I don't understand what they said about the filter cartridge; that's where most of your bacteria live. For the same reason, never clean it out under the tap - always use old tank water.

It sounds like you've had a rough start but it's now coming together for you Again, do read all the stuff on this site, there's so much info here! Good luck!

 

[Sheila]

waterwatereverywhere, thanks for all your advice. Yes, i have been adding Start Right to my water and making sure it's the right temperature prior to adding it to the tank. I understand what you mean about the filter, but they said that any time you add any chemical to the tank you have to remove the filter for 24 hours or it would just filter out whatever you added and it wouldn't work. Is the high pH anything to worry about? Is it something that I should fix? Or will it come down on it's own? And what causes it to be so high? Thanks so much.
Sheila

 

[G_Sharky]

You could also use a product called Nitro-Zorb where it takes away ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. It work for me it took less than 24 hours to drop my ammonia and nitrite to 0. BTW i have an establish tank that went into a minicycle so your ammonia won't drop that fast but it work be a great help and might prevent fatalities....Good Luck

 

[waterwatereverywhere]

I see why they said about the filter now, although it depends what's in the filter. I thought that only things like activated carbon removed chemicals from the water, so you could have just taken the carbon out, if that is you've got any.

But as I said it's probably best not to put chemicals in the water at the moment, if ever, unless you absolultely have to. Water chemistry is a pretty complicated subject (in which I'm no expert!!) and messing with it by adding extra chemicals is not something I'm over-keen on.

pH is a particuarly tricky topic, and if you're interested in learning more about it, I suggest you search the forums or start another thread especially about it, to attract the attention of people who can tell you far more than I can! Lots of things can affect pH - first of all, what's the pH of your tapwater? Bogwood will tend to lower the pH, so will injecting carbon dioxide for plants. So will peat in the filter. Some kinds of substrate can increase the pH. You're now pretty much at the limit of my knowledge on pH, except I know it's all something to do with hydrogen ions, depends how much chemistry you want to learn from people!

In any case I don't think 7.8 is all that high, depends what fish you want to keep I suppose - as long as it's not continually rising but is fairly stable. (It will fluctuate overnight, and be different in the morning and evening.) If you want to lower it, I'd stick a piece of bogwood in - it has the added advantage of looking pretty! (Though you need to be aware of the pitfalls; even after soaking it for weeks it may still discolour the water - harmlessly - and some folk don't like that.)

 

[waterwatereverywhere]

After a quick look at other threads, the general view seems to be - don't bother using chemicals to mess with your pH. It would only be temporary anyway.

 

[Sheila]

Thanks all for the great advice....it's been really helpful. I have a cartridge with charcoal (it's a whisper 40 if that helps). I did leave the filter sponge in, just removed the charcoal. Anyway, I took my own pH reading (not real scientific...need to get the master test kit...I used my hot tub pH test kit) anyway, it read 7.6. So hopefully I'm headed in the right direction and can very soon get a few more fish.
Sheila