Neons developing bent spine

[paulthegreat]

I have recently had a couple of my neon develop a bent spine. One died this morning and I noticed a second one with this condition. I have had my neons for a year now and was wondering if this is common or a sign of old age? How long do tetras live? Any help is welcome.

 

[illusion54]

Common reasons why bent spine occurs:

*Congenital (from birth)

*Trauma

*Fish TB (Mycobacterium)

*Nutritional deficiencies (tryptophan, phosphorus, calcium, Vitamin C)

*Neon Tetra Disease

Source: http/www.aquamaniacs.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9284

 

[jollysue]

I'm sorry paulthegreat. It's not good news. Best separate the bent ones asap and also any more that might show the symptom. Some of these causes can be contagious.

 

[Lateral Line]

Old age can also create bent up rough looking fish, (and people!).

If you'd said they were new, I'd be thinking Neon Tetra Disease, but if you've had them a year and they are only just now starting to bend, it would be somewhat suprising.

I assume your tank maintenance is up to scratch. It is always possible that if conditions suddenly get worse for fish, pre-existing problems which were being held in check by the immune system, bubble up and become a problem.

Small tetras etc. typically live 2-3 years. Some species are renowned for living a long time, I had a little group of Barbus viviporous. I'd no idea how old they were when I got them, but they lived in my tank for 8-9 years.

 

[paulthegreat]

If it were Neon Tetra disease would it cause problems for the other fish in my tank?

 

[Lateral Line]

Neon Tetra Disease is appallingly named. It is so called because it was first observed in Neons, and thought, at the time, to be specific to that species. In fact, NTD is an infection with sporozoan parasites which live in the muscle of the affected fish. As the parasites grow, they push the fish out of shape, sometimes into a corrugated shape.

Many species have been found to suffer from this, mostly other characins, but there have been reports of barbs, danios and other cyprinids developing NTD as well. It is contagious if you have other suitable hosts in the tank.

That said, normally NTD develops slowly, but not that slowly, typically taking a few months to be apparent. If you've had the fish for a year or more, and the tank conditions have been kept good, I'd be somewhat suprised if NTD was the cause.

 

[Omega_squid]

I have read that deficiency of vitamin C in a fish's diet can cause several serious symptoms, including bent or curved spines.

 

[jollysue]

Well so how are they doing?

Sorry for jumping in there with limited knowledge. Sometimes I speak without thinking long enough.

Lateral lines info is interesting. You hear lots of different stories about NTD.

 

[paulthegreat]

I have removed the remaining neon that was looking bent and had to begin treating for ich since 2 of my Swordtails were getting the dreaded spots. They are looking better today and none of the neons appear to be affected. Thanks for the info on NTD!

 

[kniesh]

illusion54, could you tell me what those fish are called under ur name, been trying to find the name of them for ages, cant find it anywhere.

 

[Lateral Line]

They are Parambassis baculis, although I suspect many people still use the old name Chandra ranga, commonly called Glass Fish. Those in the picture have been dyed/painted - an extremely cruel process which kills many of the subjected fish. That is why he has the red cross through them.

 

[jollysue]

Well, Paul, I hope your swordtails are fairing well.

I don't know why I find so many of the little neons so dear. Of course I hate all death, although the loved one or thing is dear, the death is wretched. I had a neon, one of my first purchases get bent and watched as it suffered. ) I don't let them suffer anymore. They can't live if they can't control their swimming.

At first I thought it was hurt during a hifin serpae terrorist war. The serpaes wrecked havoc on the community and each other. Then from what others said I began to wonder if it could have been NTD. Now I am pretty sure again from what lateral line has posted here that it had been injured in the serpae outrage.

I have lost a lot of my affection for my hifin serpaes. It's one thing for them to hurt one another, it's quite another for them to murder my little neons in their frenzy.

Keep in touch.

 

[Lateral Line]

At the same time JS, remember the Serpæ war might have been enough of a stress factor to push the bent Neon over the edge and loose it's fight against the sporozoan.

The immune system is a funny thing, it can work really well, and then when stressed to the right extent, almost collapse entirely.

That said, I have always found Serpæs to be aggressive out of all proportion to their size, and have no time for them anymore. I had some wreak lethal havoc in an otherwise very placid tank in the late 60's - I have not kept them since.

 

[jollysue]

I had certainly thought of the immune/stress factor regarding the little diamond head. I of course prefer to believe that my remaining first neon purchase is desease free and that my serpaes are little pygmy red pirhanas.

I bought some emergency medication at petco last week (it is half the price of my lfs.) I always stop and look at their information handouts on varieties of fish and plants. They have the serpae in the catagory of "Semi-Aggressive" while the lemon and most others are classified "Non-Aggressive." All my tetras nip but only the hifin serpae were killing and leaving tattered fins in their wake. I had little diamond heads with tail fins missing and all the silvertips were tipless. My black phantoms were in tatters.

If I can ever get them fit looking again, as stiking as they are, I will return them to the lfs. Right now at least one of the ones (an alpha) looks like what I imagine fin rot might be. The tips are white white. I have treated with Melafix and Pimafix for two weeks with no improvement (while he contilues to bully his mates.) I am starting Mardel's Maracyn Plus, a broad spectrum, gram positive and gram negative, today. Two cycles of that and then we'll see. The little frenzied terrorists.

Thanks for responding. Another member urged me to get them out of my community just before the war.

 

[Lateral Line]

The thing to remember with Characins is they are front toothed. A single nip from a small tetra can take a chunk out of a fin. A back toothed Cyprinid would need to grab hold and have a good chew to produce the same result.

Now whilst it is true that some Cyprinids are well capable of causing damage in a short time, they all take second stage to a similaly sized, and aggressively minded Characin.