Need Some Fairly Basic Guidance

[@ombomb]

I am in the process of trying to persuade my g/f that we DO need another fish tank and marine seems like the option that she likes best (having gone through SHs thread with her!) and something a really would like to try (been keeping fw for 5 years).

I have found a supplier that is selling 18" cubes with a hood, but need some guidance in terms of what else I need to include in the initial set up.

So far on the list I have:

Tank (inc hood) - (24USG)
Lighting - Compact T5, what is required for soft corals?
Filtration - External Eheim 2213 was the original plan, should I look at a sump though? If not what media is recommended?
Refugarium - Would I be best to set up a small (5G) sump filter / refugarium? If so do you know of a good DIY guide?
Heating - 75W I know people are keen on Ebo Jager, are these available in the UK?
Live Rock - 25lbs by my calculation
RO Unit
Hydrometer
Protein Skimmer - Required?

Thanks in advance for any help you can give me, it's not just laziness asking on here, I need the info quickly so I can get her commited to this before she changes her mind!!!

 

[@ombomb]

Been having a look round and can't find anywhere that stock Ebo Jagers in the UK.

Would 48W be sufficient for soft corals in a 24G?

Looking through other people's diaries etc, it looks as though 24lbs would be the bare minimum I would need in my tank, but this seems to be one of the cases where more... is more. Obviously if I went down the sump / fuge road this would give me the perfect place to put some more rock and add to the volume.

I have found some small protein skimmers that would be perfect for a Nano reef setup (size wise anyway) and again these could easily fit in a sump / fuge.

Back to see how sumps / fuges need to be set up!

As a side thought, do you think a chiller would be required in a tank this size?

Look through some photos, I think it would be fairly easy to DIY one from an old PC heatsink / fan...

 

[@ombomb]

Well setting up a small 3 chamber sump doesn't look too difficult, however I could so with some guidance on what a good size would be? The plan would be to build a small acrylic overflow in one corner of the tank, siliconed in, to feed the sump and maybe house some live rock fragments.

I'm leaning towards a smallish 10G, but am dubious as to wether this would be large enough for the needs of the tank.

Potential hardware shopping list:

Tank / hood = £78 inc delivery
Aquaclear 301 (658 litre/hour = sufficient?) = £25
Small heater = £15
Small skimmer = £30
Sump tank = £20
Sundries (silicone / acrylic / sump media / outflow / inflow piping) = £50
Hydrometer - £12

Which brings the initial outlay to £230

Have I missed anything?

 

[@ombomb]

Yes I missed the lighting and the RO unit off, which is the best part of another £100! (based on two 36W marine bulbs + starter unit = 72W in total instead of 48. May take some DIYing of the hood, but worth it in the long run I think)

Having said that, I have near enough got the green light from the g/f so it looks as though the vast majority of the costs can be written off as Xmas presents!

Fingers crossed I can start the ordering of all this at the end of the month and have this up and running before Xmas ("so we can enjoy it together!" ).

Anything else I need to consider?

 

[parker313]

I'm so sorry. I started a nice, big reply to you yesterday, but hit backspace and lost the whole thing. Unfortunately I didn't have time to retype it all...

I am not really up on many of the DIY type projects, but there are definitely good references out there, some at www.nano-reefs.com , including ones for refugiums made from an AquaClear 500 (or whatever new number the 500 now is - 110, I think). Plus, if you had a sump, you could put your macros and other refugium things down there and not worry about a fuge at all...

I would nix the AquaClear you have listed in favor of powerheads. The liverock is going to give you all the filtration you need so filters just become nitrate factories... I am running two ACs on my tank, but they are empty except for a phosphate reducer in one.

When setting up cost lists, don't forget your water. An R/O unit can be pretty expensive - your options are to buy R/O water from your lfs or even to buy pre-mixed SW from them.

Yes, the more LR, the better. Especially if you're adding a sump, I'd bump the LR up to 30-35lbs.

Hope that helps

 

[@ombomb]

Big help, thanks Parker, your's and StealHealr's threads are the inspiration!

I'm not planning on going that deep into DIY, just adding a couple of baffle bars for the sump and the overflow.

Having had another look round, I have found a powerhead which simulates wave movement, same cost, better effect and more water pumped per £. I'm still not 100% clear on what the flow should be, but I have plenty of time to research that.

The plan for the sump is to have 3 sections: 1 - Intake 2 - Refugium 3 - LR / media. I'll have a look on nano reef, hopefully there'll be soe fairly detailed info there on the best way to set this up.

R/O units are fairly cheap here at the moment on eBay. You can pick one up for about £20 - £30 which is another cost initially, but I don't drive and shifting 24+ gallons on public transport is... awkward .

 

[parker313]

Oh wow, R/O units here are a couple hundred dollars!

Yeah, I can see wanting an alternative to lugging 24+ gallons of water on public transport!!

 

[@ombomb]

What do you think about the lighting / sump size?

There's not a huge difference in cost from going to a 72W instead of 48W, but it will mean DIY on the hood to make the fitting fit I think.

I worked out the cost of the live rock earlier...

Ah well, I've started so I'll finish!

Going to order the tank tomorrow, to spread the cost of this out between now and the new year (and to make sure my g/f doesn't get the chance to change her mind! )

 

[@ombomb]

Am going to order some stuff tomorrow.

How much water movement do I need for a 24? I am planning on getting 2 powerheads for plenty of water movement, but some help on how powerful would be appreciated.

 

[steelhealr]

Rough rule of thumb...10X good, 15X better, 20X great...however, this really applies if you are going to keep corals, although, having excellent circulation is good for filtration.

I have a 24G and I have about 20X. A Maxijet 1200 provides about 295 GPH flow. Depending on how you want to set up your pumps, you could do any combination if you like MJ brand.....a 1200 and 900, two 900's.....etc. SH

 

[@ombomb]

Thanks for the info.

Am just trying to work out how to make sure I have the correct water flow through the sump and am still unsure how to make sure the sump doesn't get sucked dry by the pump. I sure there must be someway to work out the correct strength for the sump pump, but it's escaping me so far.

The revised plan then is to have a the sump turning over around 100GPH, one powerhead which creates a wave motion providing around 150GPH and another power which can be directed straight over the rock / coral providing around 250GPH giving a total flow through the tank of 500GPH.

Am planning on ordering the tank today and am planning on asking them to fit the overflow / drill the in / out lets for me, so If anyone can give me some help on the sump issue I'd appreciate it.

 

[bunjiweb]

Tank - √
Compact T5 Lighting - √
Eheim 2213 - √
Couple Of Powerheads - √
Hydrometer - √
Skimmer - √
Heater - √

As for a sump... I would say this is not required. People get obsessive over sumps but if this is your first marine tank and you haven't plummed a sump then i'd just stick with your external filter. Sumps give you extra water capacity, but they can be a pain in the ass to get right in the first place, and really it's just more than you need on a tank with just soft corals and what I assume will be basic fish and inverts
If however you do decide to go for a sump then make sure its big enough to house the skimmer, pointless having a tiny sump that wont house your skimmer as well as filteration.

As for R-O water, unless you get a £50 unit for yourself, don't bother at all. I've been using tap-water on my nano, and as long as you prepare it properly you shouldn't have any problems. In fact I was reading an article which was saying that a lot of marine aquarists are swinging back to just using tap water as anenomes and mushrooms do better in it, and there are alot of trace elements in the tap water that are worth keeping.

Ben

 

[@ombomb]

A large part of the thinking behind the sump is it's the perfect place to put a refugium with macro algae etc.

I would like to try and make it work on a small scale and it's also a long term plan for my larger tank.

 

[bunjiweb]

Thats fair enough. If you do it properly and don't skimp on the pumps etc it will be fine. Just make sure you check, double check, then triple check it all with freshwater before you fill it up with saltwater etc.

Ben

 

[@ombomb]

Well things are starting to take shape finally! (I don't think I've stuck with an idea for a potential tank this long before, let alone actually do anything about it!)

Progress to date:

Tanks:

24G Cube - Final quote received - will order next week (after payday )
10G Sump - " "

Lighting:

2 X 36W Compact T5 unit - ordered
1 X 36W T5 Daylight bulb - ordered
1 X 36W T5 Actinic bulb - ordered
2 X 16" T5 Reflectors - ordered
1 X 24W T5 Compact lighting unit (for sump / fuge) - ordered
1 X 24W T5 Daylight bulb (for sump / fuge) - ordered

Water movement:

New Jet Pump (NJ1700) - Xmas present!
Power Sweep Self-Rotating Powerhead (228) - Xmas present!