My dwarfs just won't get along

[TorPeteO]

Hi everyone,

I recently purchased two dwarf puffers for a 5 gallon tank, hoping that they'd be a couple of the more friendly characters. Unfortunately, one just doesn't want to get along with his tankmate. It is getting serious, as the subservient is now forced to occupy only the top corner of the tank, staying there while the dominant one patrols his territory (i.e. the entire tank). Any attemt at the subservient to leave his corner is replied with fierce action from the dominant one. The subservient is now looking emaciated, as he cannot get nearly enough food before the dominator attacks him again.

I was hoping that I wouldn't have to intervene, but it seems that there is no other choice. The dominant one is now much bigger than the other, because he eats almost all of the bloodworm that gets placed in the tank. He's a spectacular specimen, while the subservient gets unhealthier by the hour.

The only option I see is to remove the subservient one. I was going to, for a time, put him in my community tank. While maintaining close surveillance to ensure there isn't too much pestering on his part, I hope to nurse him back to shape so that he can once again be re-placed into my puffer tank, and hold his own when he has to.

I realize this may result in bad things for my community tank. I am hoping that the puffer will be only mildly aggressive for a time while he's getting his groove back, and then he will be re-placed. If he proves to be too much for the community tank (or results in even one death of any fish), I have no hesitations of moving him back. Any other advice on this issue would be much appreciated.

Thanks a lot,
Peter

P.S. Sorry it's so long.

 

[SirMinion]

The problem is, 5g is simply too small for two dwarf puffers. Double the size of the tank and they'll be fine.

A tempory answer would be to put a breeding trap in the community tank, with a plastic plant to hide in and put him in there while you fatten him up and get a more perminant home ready.

Another option would be a tank divider for the ten gallon as a tempory measure.

 

[TorPeteO]

Thanks, SirMinion. I heard both arguments whether or not 5 gallons is suitable for two puffers, and my impatience led me to ignore the ones saying it was too small. Now I can see that it is. I am in the process of making plans to acquire a larger tank for my puffers, but it's simply not in my budget today. I'm actually considering getting a 15 gallon for them, so that I can have a larger oto colony in there, too.

I had entertained the option of the breeding net, as well, but right now my community tank has 3 fry in the net, and they're just too small to go back in with the grown-ups. I would feel horrible if I let the puffer loose in there to have his way with the fry (it's just my weak bleeding heart coming through, I know).

That is why I'm now entertaining my last resort. I've also tried trapping the larger puffer and feeding the smaller one, but he's so scared now he'll hardly leave the corner of the tank.

Thanks for the tip, though. I appreciate it.

 

[SirMinion]

Get another breeding trap?

 

[GP]

The problem is, 5g is simply too small for two dwarf puffers. Double the size of the tank and they'll be fine.

A tempory answer would be to put a breeding trap in the community tank, with a plastic plant to hide in and put him in there while you fatten him up and get a more perminant home ready.

Another option would be a tank divider for the ten gallon as a tempory measure.

Wrong. For Dwarf Puffers, it is about 3 gallons per fish, and 2.5 will suffice, as long as you have plenty of spots for the DP's to hide in. Also, I'm guessing you have two males on your hands. I would QT the weak one, feed him lots, and you need to sex them before you place them back together.


Males- Dark line on belly, wrinkles behind eyes
Females- none of these lines or wrinkles, a bit rounder

 

[SirMinion]

Wrong.

Clearly not wrong, as the problems that TorPeteO are having prove.

Really Godrick, you really are quite rude.

In my opinion, 5 gallons is too small for two of any species.

Agressiveness in dwarf puffers has nothing to do with gender, both sexes are equally aggresive.

 

[LittlePuff]

I completely agree with GP.


Kim

 

[TorPeteO]

Some may agree that 2.5 gallons per DP is acceptable, but it always depends on the individual fish, and mine are obviously not the kind that get along well. I'm also quite confident that they're both females, as no line has shown up on either of their bellies, no wrinkles have become evident, and they seem to be quite rounded (at least when they were both eating). I've been observing for some time, trying to discern their respective sexes.

Another breeding trap seems like the obvious solution, but I'm concerned that it will cut down available surface area too significantly to be healthy for the community fish. With both nets in place, I estimate total surface area would be cut almost in half, which would no doubt be troublesome for my tetras, swords, and platies. I also doubt one will fit in my 5 gallon tank, either. I may try one out on the 15 anyway, though.

Thanks again for the advice, SirMinion and Godric. Keep it comin'.

 

[Pufferpack]

I would go with the tank divider option myself. Shouldn't need an actual pre-made divider, you could use pretty much any clean piece of plastic with holes punched in it and wedge it into the gravel, as long as it fit the width/height of the tank, the dwarves are too small to push it over and it would keep the small one safe without disturbing your other tank.

edit: another option is to divide the tank with a row of dense plants in the center of the tank reaching from bottom to surface. If the bigger puff can't see the small one through the plants there should be less trouble. I did something similar with a piece of PVC pipe cut in half lenghtwise and I glued individual stalks of plastic plants in a straight line to make a kind of plant fence and it seemed to work well.

 

[TorPeteO]

That sounds like a good idea, I like the row of plants thing. I don't know how well my live plants would work, although I've got some wysteria that's as high as the tank and could break it up, I think plastic plants may be a more realistic thing to use since this is meant to be a short-term project (until I get a larger tank, of course).

Thank you all for your help,
Peter

 

[a1wonder]

I agree with your previous comment I had a very similar problem when keeping blue gouramis a while back. Stock the tank full of tall plastic plants to break up the line of site and perhaps add more caves. If you don't want to add more caves currently rearrange the ones you currently have in their so that the territories changes and the smaller puffer may stand a better chance. How many caves do you currently have in your tank? I would recommend at least two per puffer or a comfortable three (even if you have to stock one on top of the other).
I think that 5 gals should be suitable room for both but the flaw lies in how the landscaping was done. If you could post a picture of your current sit up that would give us more to go with.

 

[TorPeteO]

I've currently got two caves total in my tank (you can see a picture by clicking here). I've also got six plants, some of which are suitable for hiding (again, you can see the layout in the picture).

When I can, I'll throw in some more hardware to break up the line of sight. It's only going to be for a couple of months until I purchase and set up my new tank, anyway.

If that doesn't work, I'll go for the breeding trap.

Thanks again for all the tips!

 

[GP]

Wrong.

Clearly not wrong, as the problems that TorPeteO are having prove.

Really Godrick, you really are quite rude.

In my opinion, 5 gallons is too small for two of any species.

Agressiveness in dwarf puffers has nothing to do with gender, both sexes are equally aggresive.

I was not intending to be rude, and if I came across, I apologize. However, I truely think it is pointless to give the wrong information to another member.. 5 gallons per DP?! Also, males are much more agressive then females, especially during spawning season, as they will have immense fights over which one gets to spawn, territories, etc.

 

[SirMinion]

We'll have to agree to disagree on this..

As I actually keep Dwarf Puffers, I know from experience that they need lots of room and 5g for two is not enough.

6g for one GSP isn't enough either, but you're a betta keeper and are used to keeping fish in tiny prisons anyway... but that's another argument for another day.

Sorry if now I'm being rude, but so many people seem to think more about how the fish can be kept and not enough about how they should be kept.

*prepares himself for flaming*

 

[TorPeteO]

...people seem to think more about how the fish can be kept and not enough about how they should be kept.

Sounds a lot like Ian Malcolm's quote from Jurassic Park;

You were so preoccupied with whether or not you could do it, you didn't stop to think whether or not you should.

I agree completely, Minion. I'm one of the guilty parties here, as I've now got my specialty tank very close to overstocked, and it's not terribly stable. However, Godric has many threads indicating his plans to transfer his GSP into a larger tank as soon as he finds it necessary.While it's probably true that the proper accomodations should have been secured prior to purchasing the GSP, he's still made it clear that he's got plans to accomodate his little guy. I agree that the situation in which most keepers have bettas in is pretty sad, though.