Just A Question(s)

[bbfordhp]

Id first like to say im new to the hobby and would appreciate any responses. I cant offer much insight on fish in return, but if your having car troubles, im an automotive tech so just let me know :0) Ive been doing a lot of reading, feel my tank is doing OK but just looking for some conformation/opinions on a few issues.

Im running a 29 gallon biocube, with 20lbs of CC, and an aditional 600GPH powerhead. Did the "shrimp" cycling about 2 months ago, but wasnt able to get inhabitants immediatly afterwards. One week ago we added 10lbs cured live rock from the LFS, and 6 damsels. The Biological filter had a little trouble dealing with all the amonia(hit about 4ppm), before it started to break it down. PH also dropped to ~8.0, but is on the rise. Salinity is slightly higer than my hygrometer reccomends, 36-7. Running a temp about 73, and a lighting cycle 6am to 3pm(bright day bulb)with LED's, 3pm to 10pm(bright night bulb)with LED's, and 10pm to 6am LED only.

My first concern is one of the damsels. He's been quite "shy" since day 1, stays in the same spot all day...figured he'd come out when he gets hungry enough. but still havent seen him eat. Still swimming upright. He is the biggest, and presumably the oldest...read somewhere its hard to "teach an old fish new tricks." I can see several possible causes, does anything raise a red flag?

I am quite pleased with my live rock(but it doesnt take much to impress me). Was tickled pink when I discovered 2 cattipillar looking worms, I later IDed as brisstle worms. I've my opinion on them, but yours?

Some sort of growth is starting to form on the surface of the live rock. Brownish/Golden/Green. Diatoms? Or something else? There are just think patches, that coat most of the surface now. Was able to scrap a little off. I dont consider it to be a problem yet, it hasnt spread to other parts of the tank. Should I worry?

Also IDed two small patches of corraline algae. From what ive read this is desireable? Ive an what ill call "plant", looks just like a venus fly trap, i have not been able to identify. ?!?! Along with a "spongy" thing, with a teeny snail. And one other plant, kind of hand looking thing. Has lobes like the "fly trap", but without spikes, but doesnt look like its the same creature.

Next step i plan on getting some inverts. 5 snail, 5crab, 5 shrimp. Starfish and maybe an anemone, for the clownfish to come. Eventually want an Koran or Emerior Angelfish to anchor the tank.


Thanks in advance.
Tyler

 

[Miss Wiggle]

i don't think the tank is fully cycled or at least wasn't when the damsels were added, it sounds likely to me that this has caused some damage to the damsel that's poorly, what are your current stats for pH, ammonia, nitrite and nitrate?

the algae/diatoms/cyano is pretty likely a result of the tank cycling, it's fairly common. get some rowaphos which will probably clear it up.

you need to research your stocking some more though.

6 damsels in a 29g is the tank fully stocked, you should not have added all these at once, the biological filtration is not able to cope with it which is causing problems.

you should have added CUC (shrimp/snails etc) before adding any fish, this will be causing part of your algae issues as there's nothign to clear up the waste from the fish.

your tank is not big enough for a starfish, lighting is not good enough for the anemone, it's a common misconception that clown's 'need' them. a good alternative is teh torch coral, looks similar to an anemone, has fairly low lighting requirements and clowns will host in them. tank is also not big enough for a koran or emporer angelfish, at most you can keep one of the smaller pgymy angels in there, something like a fireball angel.

you need to go and do a tonne of reading cos it seems like you've not really got your head around all this marine stuff and have rushed things.

personally i would return all the damsels to the store you bought them from and read up on how to cycle the tank properly.

look in the marine section for pinned topics about it

 

[bbfordhp]

i don't think the tank is fully cycled or at least wasn't when the damsels were added, it sounds likely to me that this has caused some damage to the damsel that's poorly, what are your current stats for pH, ammonia, nitrite and nitrate?

the algae/diatoms/cyano is pretty likely a result of the tank cycling, it's fairly common. get some rowaphos which will probably clear it up.

you need to research your stocking some more though.

6 damsels in a 29g is the tank fully stocked, you should not have added all these at once, the biological filtration is not able to cope with it which is causing problems.

you should have added CUC (shrimp/snails etc) before adding any fish, this will be causing part of your algae issues as there's nothign to clear up the waste from the fish.

your tank is not big enough for a starfish, lighting is not good enough for the anemone, it's a common misconception that clown's 'need' them. a good alternative is teh torch coral, looks similar to an anemone, has fairly low lighting requirements and clowns will host in them. tank is also not big enough for a koran or emporer angelfish, at most you can keep one of the smaller pgymy angels in there, something like a fireball angel.

you need to go and do a tonne of reading cos it seems like you've not really got your head around all this marine stuff and have rushed things.

personally i would return all the damsels to the store you bought them from and read up on how to cycle the tank properly.

look in the marine section for pinned topics about it

I figured that too. But like I said Amonia only jumped to 4ppm, is now closer to 0. Ph is 8.1-2ish, no nitrites. 5 of the 6 damsels really seem to be thriving. I thought the same thing about a cleaner crew, but for some reason LFS didnt reccomend it.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

lfs don't recommend it because fish are more expensive than CUC, and if they die off you go back there to buy more so they get double the money. harsh but true

lesson #1 of fishkeeping - do not trust the lfs.

 

[SkiFletch]

lesson #1 of fishkeeping - do not trust the lfs.

Agreed, its tough to find a good one nowadays.

To elaborate, bristleworms are good just don't touch them as their bristles sting and can make some nasty rashes. A few words about damselfish. They're REALLY hardy and are one of the few marine fish that can survive a treatment of 4ppm worth of ammonia. Remember, the effect of chemical poisons/toxins in marine fish is magnified GREATLY over that of freshwater fish because of the way marine fish's kidneys work. 4ppm is A LOT in the marine world. Heck, 0.25ppm is way too much. Damselfish can sometimes survive such conditions, but do not get the false impression that the rest of the marine world can. Damsels are more often than not exceptionally aggressive and will establish and defend territories in a tank. Your big guy is proably just staying in his spot because he's the biggest and he "owns" that spot now. The longterm problem of course is that very often once you have a tank full of damsels, they'll harass, nip, chase, and ultimately kill anything else you put in there. Unfortunately a very common mistake amongst rookie marine reefkeepers.

Anyways, start/keep reading, theres lots to learn.

 

[Lynden]

Your tank is cycling, you should not have many more problems. Also, Damsel fish are far from the monsters that everybody seems to think they are. Coming from someone who has owned many damsel fish throughout his years.

Next step i plan on getting some inverts. 5 snail, 5crab, 5 shrimp. Starfish and maybe an anemone, for the clownfish to come. Eventually want an Koran or Emerior Angelfish to anchor the tank.

I do, however, see a problem with your plans.

Sea Anemones are a group that has been met with mixed reviews over the years. Many anemones are very hardy (Bubble, Saddle Carpet), while others are not (other carpets). Most anemones also have very powerful stings that can make short work of your fish.

True anemones (that we keep) also require fairly powerful lighting to replicate the conditions they likely came from, and all should be fed a few times a month. The Long Tentacle Anemone (Macrodactyla) is one species that can be hardy, but requires extremely powerful lighting in most conditions. Avoid this species.

Most anemone deaths result from poor handling, poor capture, poor transport, and, suprisingly enough, overfeeding. If one chooses an immaculate, perfectly healthy specimen, it can live for many years; however, if one chooses a croaking specimen (tears at the base, stringy tentacles, other damage, bleaching), it's demise is assured.

Tube 'anemones' (Cerianthus; not true sea anemones) are one genus I definitely recommend for aquaria. They are tough, do not require lighting, are highly coloured, and are profoundly unlikely to consume fish or ornamental invertebrates. In fact, these animals are probably the best 'anemones' for reef aquaria. The only downside is that they require a deep sand bed to feel secure. Do this by placing a PVC pipe in to sand, inserting the animal, and placing sand all around it, filling up the pipe.

Lastly, Pomacanthus (Emperor, Koran, et cetera) angel fish are not suitable for small aquaria. The smallest species I know of, P. annularis, is hardly even suitable for a 90 gallon tank. They can reach lengths of over 12'' in aquaria. Choose a dwarf angel instead.

-Lynden

 

[steelhealr]

Agree with the above...sounds like you are rushing things too quickly. I'd so slow down. Sea stars do not belong in a nano tank...the majority will starve. Your lighting seems too low to keep an anemone and, IMO, the interval is too short. Most people illuminate for 12 hours. Coralline ...well...has good and bad things about it. Most like it for it's color. You seem light on LR. In a 29, you should have 30-45 lbs. The less LR, the less 'biological filtration' you may have.

My main advice.....slow down. SH

 

[bbfordhp]

Rushing in what way? Introducing live rock/fish together? Or the 6 damsels?


I really was not happy at all with the LFS service. Like i said earlier they totally reccomended against a cleaner crew, to the point the pratically would not sell me one. I asked for 2 damsels, they bagged 6............

I know damsels are hardy fish, thats why we cycle with em :0). They gave me two different breeds, 3 & 3...figure on keeping a couple of the more active ones.

Anybody know about the "venus fly trap"?

Thanks yall,

Tyler

 

[SkiFletch]

Saldy, "venus fly trap" is not a good enough description... Got pics?