Immunity to ick--possible?

[Scarab]

Was just wondering....I've read a couple of places, during my research, that some fish, after making it through their first bout with ick, can develop immunity to ick. Does anyone know whether or not this is true? And if so, is there a site out there with some sort of documentation/study?

Thanks...was just curious.

 

[smb]

Never heard of that before.

Ichthyophthirius is present in all of our water we use to fill our aquariums but if we have healthy fish they can withstand the onslaught of diseases and bacteria. Once they become stressed, harrassed,injured or not fed a diet consisting of a variety of foods, they can succumb to disease. I don't think any tolerance is built up.


Could you post the link as to where you read that, or if you can't remember, could you tell us what it said? I'd be very interested in seeing it and seeing who wrote it.


Either way, this is a good thread and am excited to see all the posts and learn something from it.

 

[jerenycool]

never heard of it but it would be cool to see what is said about them and if could really happen. i am lucky i have never had ick but everyone talks about it thought.

 

[Dragonslair]

The answer to your question is No. There is no immunity against ick. You can however destroy the parasite with the use of UV or an Ozoneator. I have both running with my tank, the UV is great for destroying algae and the Ozoneator destroys all waterbourne organisms under 5 microns. The water in the tank is almost disinfected, and because the good bacteria in the tank is either under the gravel and below the ozoneator air stream or in the filter they are not affected.

 

[mrV]

Like others said, the answer is no. But...

ICH (and other bacteria/parasites...) can become "immunity" to medicines. So, don't ever medicate your tank without any reason and always be sure, you use right medicine.

 

[Scarab]

Thanks Dragonslair and everyone. There's actually quite a lot on the net (i.e. websites, threads, etc.) out there about this very topic. Some saying yes, others no and still others saying more research is needed.

I can't post them all, but since you asked smb , here's a few:

http/aquascienceresearch.com/APInfo/Ich.htm“What about immunity and re-infestation?
As with most animals, fishes have a fairly well-developed immune system. Once a fish has suffered an ich infestation and survived, it is less likely to develope the disease again. This, of course, assumes the fish is not severely stressed at a time when the parasite is also present in the water.”
AND
“A recent study done in Southeast Asia with tiger barbs, zebra danios and goldfish has found that some fishes can mysteriously impart their acquired immunity to ich to others of their own, as well as different, species. This is an interesting discovery, but not yet practical for managing the disease in store and home aquariums.”
This site also makes a good argument for NOT raising the temperature when treating ich.

http/www.petsforum.com/personal/trevor-jones/marineich.html
Acquired Immunity
"Acquired immunity occurs when the response is specific to the invading organism, which is recognised directly or through antigens (Dickerson and Clarke, 1996). Colorni (1987) first suggested that marine fish could acquire some immunity to C. irritans by surviving several infections. Burgess and Matthews (1995) demonstrated acquired immunity in the thick-lipped mullet, Chelon labrosus. They found that 82% of fish that had been previously exposed to high levels of theronts were immune to a secondary exposure. "

More on Clark & Dickerson research:
http/www.reeusda.gov/nri/pubs/covers/clark/clark.htm

http/www.uk.gardenweb.com/forums/load/ukponds/msg0720133214880.html
Posted by: Scotty24 Derbyshire. UK (My Page) on Fri, Jul 18, 03 at 23:12
“have researched this and also talked to 'long term' fish owners who say that 'Ich' is usually always 'in the background' in most ponds and aquariums, but fish develop an 'immunity' to this. “

http/www.aquariumadvice.com/viewtopic.php?t=4720&start=20
"stresco wrote:
I am not too sure that i believe the theory of an animal developing an immunity to a parasite. Just dosnt seem to follow any logic.
timbo2 wrote:
Why would that not be logical? The fish may not become completely immune, but they do have immune systems that aid in warding off disease. I haven't ever dosed my tank and I have had fish and still have them, battle and kick ich with no aid. Today they have been parasite free for months on end. So, To say it doesn't follow logic, I have to wonder which logic?
steve-s, Advisor:
The fish do not become immune to C irritans but rather a healthier stronger fish has the ability to effectively resist the theront trying to attach to a fish host. Without that host, the theront cannot survive much past 12 hours. In many cases that is all that is required.
A healthy fish will have a strong slime coat which helps resist parasitic problems. A less healthy animal will have a reduced (thinner layer), which allows the theront to become attached and establish a colony. Wether that be through less than par water conditions, improper diet or other stressors.
To say the fish can build up an immunity to the parasite itself is incorrect. It is a parasite, not a disease.
Establishing a QT routine is the most recommended way of preventing the problem in the first place. A tank can be "ick free" forever providing the new inhabitants are properly introduced."

 

[smb]

I can't post them all, but since you asked smb,  here's a few:

Thank you Scarab.

I'll read up on them soon. I actually never heard anyone that was of the opinion of immunity being possible and I would really like to see why they think this.

Thanks again.

 

[Scarab]

You're welcome.

 

[Scarab]

bump

 

[mrV]

There's actually quite a lot on the net (i.e. websites, threads, etc.) out there about this very topic. Some saying yes, others no and still others saying more research is needed.

As you saw too, they didn't say either that "Fish has immunity from ich..."

What comes raising temperature, I "agree" with them. Everybody knows that O2 level decreases when temperature is increasing; That's why you need keep good circulation on the surface (that water will absorb O2 better), use diffusor or air-pump. If you read carefully instruction of medicine manufacturer, they usually recommend to use air pump when using medicine.

And what becomes to internet, you shouldn't believe everything what you find from there B) Like in this presentation: http/aquascienceresearch.com/APInfo/Ich.htm, there is no references at all, no mention who has done the studies, where and when. No mention at all, only phone number. Ok, Im a scientist, so Im always skeptic if there is only "talking" but not any facts - I'd like to see refences too, that I can find more information if I want to know more.

 

[Scarab]

I agree with you mrV. I learned a long time ago not to believe everything I read on the internet. Especially if there no studies, etc., sited. It's amazing how much stuff is out there with nothing to back it up. But I did find some with references to some studies.

I just thought this would be an interesting topic of discussion. At this point I don't think it's possible for a fish to develop/aquire immunity to ick...they can become less susceptible due to healthy conditions, i.e. water, less/no stress, etc.

But there are some out there who believe fish can become immune and some are studying that specifically...others are just studying ways to make fish immune. It's all kind of interesting.