Ich and water changes

[platypus]

Hi everyone,

This weekend I bought 6 variatus platies from my LFS as I had never experienced livebearers before. I put them straight into my main tank without quarantining them first .

Last night I noticed that one of the male platies has two white spots on the top of his head and the clown loaches are 'flashing'. I'm planning on treating them for ich tonight with methylene blue before it gets any worse. My question is - what should I do about water changes while I am treating the tank? I tested for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate yesterday and they were all at 0 but I'm worried that because there are 6 new fish there could be an ammonia spike if I skip my usual weekly water change and gravel clean.

Also the treatment claims that two doses should be sufficient (four days apart) - does this sound right or should I do another one just to make sure I get the critters?

Sorry to post yet another ich question but I couldn't see if this particular issue was dealt with elsewhere!

Thanks for all your help, I don't know where I'd be without you!

 

[Alien Anna]

I would strongly recommend you don't use methylene blue because it can affect your filters and your filters need to catch up with the new, larger fish load anyway.
Try Protazin or something like that - its a lot safer.

However, assuming your tank is properly cycled, I would not expect to find an ammonia or nitrite spike. You can either do water changes as planned, replacing the commensurate amount of medication as you do so, or skip the water changes as instructed on the medication bottle. Also, cleaning your gravel can be rather a double-edged sword because although it will remove ammonia-producing fish poop etc. it will also remove bacteria. I'd leave well alone, personally, except for removing anything really bad.

Don't forget to raise the water temperature to 80F and if your fish are salt tolerant, add a little salt.

 

[Kossy]

Yes I wouldn't use meth blue due to the new fish like alien said however you should keep doing water changes. Add the water with the appropriate amount of med to that water. read my sig for ich for more info

 

[platypus]

Thanks to both of you I had no idea the m. blue would cause a problem - we were sold it when we had a problem with ich ages ago when our tank was new. It's called 'anti whitespot plus' I believe - has a pic of a clown loach on the box. It did get rid of the ich but the fish didn't seem to like it much. I will investigate 'protazin', hopefully my LFS will sell it.

Also, cleaning your gravel can be rather a double-edged sword because although it will remove ammonia-producing fish poop etc. it will also remove bacteria.

Thanks AA, I usually only clean about 1/4 of the gravel one week, then 1/4 the next etc. I'd be worried about skipping this altogether because we feed them bloodworm/tubifex every few days and this always sinks to the bottom and some of it must not get eaten.

Will definitely increase the temperature a bit which is at 25º at the moment. I'm not sure about salt - I have no corys which I have read don't like salt. Other than that I have platies, clown loaches, dwarf gouramis, sucking loaches (CAEs), neons and a rummy nose tetra. I have had a look online to see if these have a problem with salt but couldn't find anything.

I will keep you posted - I hope it turns out OK as I was tossing and turning all last night having constant nightmares about deaths in the tank! Does anyone else get recurring fish dreams?!

PS if I cannot get hold of Protazin is there an equivalent I can ask for?

 

[Alien Anna]

Hi, I relate to the fish nightmares - the other fish nightmare is the one in which your fish have bred in the night and you have to find homes for 500 male bettas, or whatever.

As for reality, well there are quite a few ick medications out there, most of which are safer than meth.blue:

Interpet Anti-whitespot No.6
Waterlife's Protazin
King British WS3 Whitespot terminator

Plus a pile of others available according to where you live. In the US, Jungle and Aquarisol are products I've heard about.

If ich is treated it is rarely fatal, so try not to worry too much. Except for the rummy-noses, all the fish you've got can tolerate quite a lot of salt. The rummy-noses might not like it, but it won't kill them so maybe use a small dose of salt (1 teaspoon per 20 litres/5 US gals). Gradually increase the tank temperature to 28-30 degrees C, and after treatment, gradually drop it again.

 

[platypus]

Quick update - rang my LFS and they stock Protozin but they recommend using a different one - I bet they do, one that costs 5 times as much no doubt, tsk . Will also ask about aquarium salt while I'm in there - if anyone has any recommendations so I can go in there armed and prepared against their onslaught of dodgy sales pitches I would be very grateful!

I relate to the fish nightmares - the other fish nightmare is the one in which your fish have bred in the night and you have to find homes for 500 male bettas, or whatever.

Hee hee, I have not had any fry in my tank yet, but I bet when I do I will understand what you mean!! My other one is waking up to find the tank's broken and they're all flapping across the floor feebly

 

[platypus]

OK, the latest is, I got home ready with my Protozin to start treating and - the white spots had gone. There were only ever a couple on one of the platies and maybe one on the female gourami and another platy in the first place. However the clown loaches ARE still flashing. I'm really scared now of putting the treatment in in case ich isn't really the problem - presumably the clownies' scratching could be down to any number of problems?



So sorry to keep clogging up the board with another variation on the 'my fish have ich' post but I couldn't see the answers I was looking for in the archive.

 

[Alien Anna]

The ich parasites fall off the fish (which happens more quickly if you had put the temperature up) and then live in the gravel. Unfortunately, you then get an endless cycle of re-infection. But salt can kill the parasite so maybe...

Personally, if you were convinced it was ich, I'd use the Protazin anyway. Don't forget to take out any carbon from your filter and keep the dosage low for the clown loaches. Ich treatments kill all kinds of parasites, not just the ich, so that should help if the clowns have something else.

 

[platypus]

Thanks AA. I'm not convinced , I'm starting to wonder if I imagined the whole thing! I think perhaps I will leave it until tomorrow and see if any of the fish develop any more symptoms. Hopefully even if it is ich an extra day won't cause too much harm, particularly as so few of them are showing any symptoms ATM.

 

[AquaNut]

I definitely would not add any sort of medication unless you're absolutely certain that you need it. I would, however, add a trace amount of salt to your tank. Ich and other parasites do not do well in salted water, but your fish won't even notice if you add it gradually.