I Have A Salty Taste In My Mouth...

[fishwatcher]

I have a 30-g tank that is currently housing a few fish, but I am getting ready to empty. I've been thinking about converting it to a saltwater tank. I'm thinking of just a few gobies, maybe a clown fish or 2, some shrimp and snails. Nothing too crazy really. I've read over a few of the pinned topics, but of course have some q's.
The set up I have now is sand substrate (play sand), heater, HOB filter that's rated for a 70g with 2 outflows on it, an air curtain and a single-strip light. I can buy a skimmer, but I can't get any higher lighting for it, at least not right now.
If I have just fish/inverts and add some rocks, how would that be? I guess my biggest worry is the lighting, as I read that I would need a ton of it for some reason.
Any advice?
Thanks!

 

[fishwatcher]

I am wanting to make sure the sand I already have would be ok. As I said, it's just regular playsand.

I'll add 1 powerhead on the opposite side of the tank from the filter, angled down towards the bottom, so that it blows across the whole tank. Then I'll get a couple pieces of live rock, since I've read that they will still work fine even in the dimmer lighting that I have.
The rest of the tank will be bare sand, I guess, unless there is something else I should add for decor.

So far I'm thinking that a couple of clown fish, a few gobies (really liked the flame? gobies I've seen recently), a couple of snails and few shrimp would look nice. I'd really like a starfish too, but not sure how delicate they are.
Is there possibly a topice around here that has a list of easier to keep fish/inverts for beginners?

Thanks for any/all advice!

 

[kkyyllee]

you will need to buy new sand, you can use play sand but it wouldnt be a good idea to use it form an existing freshwater

 

[AK77]

Hi Fishwatcher,

I had a salty taste in my mouth earlier too (get your mind out the gutter people!). I was priming my overflow box and had to suck on the airline pipe to remove all the remaining air to create the syphon. I didn't realise that the valve on the pipe (which doesn't work properly ) had a quarter turn shutoff. I turned it a few times thinking it was a normal screw type. As a result I got a gob full of salt water, some of which went down my throat. I swear I almost puked.

My first reaction was to spit the rest of the water out.... but I managed to refraim from launching that back into the tank. I ended up just dribbling down my t-shirt. If anyone had entered my room seen me drooling and pulling the faces I was.. I'd have been dragged away by the men in white coats... again.

Anyhooooooooooo............. Play sand I would think is a no-no, as its most likely silica. If it is silica you'll end up with algae galore. I'd play it safe and get yourself crushed coral sand or Aragonite. Its a good choice because of its buffering capacity (calcium carbonate). I'd recommend getting enough sand to create a deep sand bed (3+ inches) . Also get the fine to medium grade as this will really help with bacteria including the anerobic type that will establish themselves at the lower levels, provided its not disturbed.

I wouldn't point the powerhead at the sand either. You'll be forever blowing fish poop and other waste around, creating murky water and it may disturb the bacteria colonies deeper in the sand. If you are going for a live rock tank, then you can essentially dispense with the external filter. Alternatively you can remove all the filter media and fill the canister with live rock rubble, or maybe a sachet of rowaphos phosphate remover.

As this sounds like a FOWLR (Fish Only With Live Rock) It wouldn't hurt to get some macro algaes. Cheato is a good one. Avoid bubble algae as it can go mental and run rampant. The algaes act like a live filter, absorbing nitrates and phosphates which prevent coralline growth (the pretty pink stuff on live rock).

As for fish, have a read up on the sticky threads about them and also try reading some of the journals from tank beginnings to becoming fully established.

HTH,

AK

 

[fishwatcher]

you will need to buy new sand, you can use play sand but it wouldnt be a good idea to use it form an existing freshwater

Just curious, why would it be bad being from a freshwater tank?

Oh no, AK77! That's just nasty!!! LOL
I'm not really going for a live rock tank too much.. just a few pieces. The rest will be just plain old rock that they sell for tanks. So I guess I'll need to keep the filter for now at least. I thought you were supposed to make cross-currents in the tank, but since you mentioned all the poo floating around I guess I'll just aim it straight at the other side. (That won't cause the glass to break, will it? Yeah, I'm a paranoid freak... I need a white jacket, too!)

When it comes to stocking a salt tank, do you still use the same general rules as with fresh?

As for adding algae so it will prevent the pink stuff, I thought the pink stuff was some of the reason people like LR?

Thanks!!

 

[FLcracker94]

You need to get crushed coral or live sand.

Saltwater fish are more picky so you have to be careful in chosing fish.
You need to make sure that the readings are...
Nitrite:0
Ammonia:0
Nitrate: as close to 0 as you can get
Calcium: 400-450, 420 is the ocean's usual calcium level
PH: 8.0-8.5
Alk: I'm not entirely sure, usualy my dad tests that.
Salinity: 1.023-1.025

Use livesand/rock. Usualy the lighting is for corals, and in my case, heat (and corals too).

Temp: 77F-84F

I would suggest getting:
A pair of Percula clowns
A firefish or two
A yellow tail damsel or green chromis

Make sure the tank acclimates for 4-8weeks. And please, dont use a Damsel for acclimation, thats just cruel.

The pink stuf is Corraline algae (Comes in White,pink,red,green, ect). Corraline algae isn't bad and makes your tank more colorful.

Make sure you watchout for hitchhikers such as:
Mantis shrimp (aka, Thumb splitter)
Apistasia
bristle worms
Limpet snails (certain types will eat your corraline algae)

Hope this info helps, I'm sure theres more that people might wanna add that I missed.

 

[fishwatcher]

When you say the tank should acclimate for 4-6 weeks, do you mean for it to cycle?
After I switch over to the crushed coral sand and add the skimmer and salt, then I can add the live rock pieces I want to use, right? Or will I need to wait awhile on that? When I add the rock, can I add any fish then too, or will the rock make the tank cycle? If the rock cycles the tank do I need to add food or anything like that to feed the cycle until I add fish (the way you would in a fresh water tank when you fish-less cycle)? I'm assuming also that I would add just 1-2 fish at a time every 8-12 days. Is that correct?

For stocking, I was thinking along the lines of:

1 clown fish
1 firefish
a trio of chromis (read that they prefer a small group) or 2-3 chalk bass
1 sailfin/algae blenny
a few hermit crabs
a couple of snails

Thought I would add the crabs and the clown fish first, the firefish and snails, then the blenny, then the chromis. How does this sound?

Thank you for all the help! I'm glad I don't have to worry about the lighting, since I'm not going to a full reef tank.


ETA: Are the hitchhikers you mentioned dangerous to the fish or myself, or just not things people normally like in teh tank?

 

[kkyyllee]

i think he means cycle, add ur lr and sand then add some food or dead shrimp since you wont have very much rock t get things started, then when everything is down to zero and nirtates below 20ppm you can add ur cuc, wait a week, add a fish or 2, then keep doin that till u have em all. since this isnt a reef tank the aptaisia will probably die anyways from lack of lighting, mantis shrimp can kill ur fish or iverts depending on the type and may smash ur fingers up, bristle worms will sting you if you touch them so just dont touch them .

 

[fishwatcher]

oh Lord... so is there an invert or fish that will kill/eat these wretched little hitchhikers???

 

[Musho3210]

dont take it in a bad way, the hunt for evil intruders is half the fun of the live rock..... Well in my eyes it seems fun...... And if they all peacefully leave its fun.... maybe if they are impossible to catch and kill everything in your tank its not fun..... But hey be optimistic.....

 

[kkyyllee]

mantis shrimp arent a very common hitchighker i wouldnt worry unless you here clicking at night

 

[SkiFletch]

since this isnt a reef tank the aptaisia will probably die anyways from lack of lighting

Actually, if in a nutrient rich environment, aiptasia can survive in benthic (no light) areas of the tank... Makes them tough buggers to eradicate.

To the OP, since I'm not sure if it was answered before, the reason you want to use an aragonite based sand is for buffering. Silica play sand will not buffer your pH like aragonite will.

It sounds like you've got a good plan for a FOWLR. Remember, high powered lights are only needed when you start keeping corals, and thats another issue entirely

 

[fishwatcher]

So will I actually NEED aragonite or is it just preferred?
Thanks!

 

[SkiFletch]

I'd say "strongly reccomended"

If you're looking to save a few bucks, check out your local lowes/home depot and look for kolorscape sand. Their sand is an aragonite, not a silica

 

[andywg]

Saltwater fish are more picky so you have to be careful in chosing fish.
You need to make sure that the readings are...
Nitrite:0
Ammonia:0
Nitrate: as close to 0 as you can get
Calcium: 400-450, 420 is the ocean's usual calcium level
PH: 8.0-8.5
Alk: I'm not entirely sure, usualy my dad tests that.
Salinity: 1.023-1.025

In a FOWLR people often keep the salinity lower to cheapen the salt bill (an SG of 1.020 to 1022 is oft used). Also, salinity is usually quoted as being 35 ppt, it is Specific Gravity which is aimed for 1.025-1.026.

Furthermore, if just keeping fish then nitrates are not that important. You will find most lfs have their nitrates between 20 and 80 in their fish stock tanks. The only research I have seen shows 100ppm to be the upper lower limit of any long or short term damage to marine fish.

0 nitrates are a fine goal, but not very important until you are into the world of touchy inverts. Similarly, Alk and calcium are only needed in reef tanks. Fish don't care about those values.

Make sure the tank acclimates for 4-8weeks. And please, dont use a Damsel for acclimation, thats just cruel.

"Acclimate for 4-8 weeks"? Acclimate for what? If you are curing with LR you just throw the rock in and await all the levels to hit zero and start stocking. This ca be as little as 2-3 weeks. Leaving a tank a further 6 weeks without a food source is just letting benficial organisms die.