How to get a sump into my system?

[SWMWTHDAFISHES]

I've read all of the recent posts on sumps on the forum, but nothing seems to really fit my situation, so I was hoping to get a little expert advice on this. I have a 75-gal FOWLR that is drilled and pretty much looks like the diagram that Navarre posted on another thread:

Hope you don't mind my using the pic, Navarre. I have a wet/dry that it flows into and get's pumped back out and goes in the tank through the intake tube. Here's my question: Since I would really like to have a 10-gallon sump also, how do I do that? Is the best way with my particular setup an overflow box on the back that goes to the sump? What is the suggested way of getting the water back to the tank? OR should I take it from the wet/dry and go to the sump that way? Should I do elbows on the existing lines to the wet/dry and tie in the sump there or just pump it right out of the wet/dry?

So many options, my brain is on meltdown!!!! Help!

 

[SWMWTHDAFISHES]

OK, upon further research, I think I may have figured out how to do this. You guys tell me if this is the correct way. The 75-gal overflows into the sump, which overflows using an overflow box into the wet/dry, which returns back to the main tank via pump Is that the best way? What flow rate would I need for the overflow box in the sump?

 

[Navarre]

I dont mind you using the photo at all. That diagram you have shown is a tank thats drilled in the floor and those long poles are actually pipes that act as overflows.
How the diagram works:

The sump sits below the tank (usually directly beneath the drilled holes). Water is pumped up from the sump and into the main tank... the water level in the main tank rises until it overflows down the pipe and back into the sump. and so the loop continues....


Ok now an overflow system...

The overflow sits on the side of the tank and water passes through this via a siphon method. The water falls down into the sump (you wil need pipework connecting from the overflow down into the sump) and a pump will pump the water back up into the main tank again in much the same way that the drilled tank works. Basically the only difference is that the overflow does the work rather than a simple gravity action of the pipes in a drilled tank.

WHen you purchase an overflow siphon it should have a maximum flow recomended on it. Just make sure you match it with a pump that can work within the peramters of the overflow box.

 

[SWMWTHDAFISHES]

OK, I may not have been clear on my question. The tank in the pic is actually what I already have, my tank is drilled and the overflow system is in place and it overflows into a wet/dry. This is currently my setup. Because I like the idea of certain things about a sump that obviously, you can't do with a wet/dry, I want to ADD the sump into the mix. So, that's what I was asking about. I am assuming the best way to do that is let my already-established overflow in the main tank now overflow into the sump, then let the sump overflow into the wet/dry using a newly-purchased overflow box and let my existing pump that is in my wet/dry return the water back to the main tank. Is that the correct way to add a sump to my already setup system with a wet/dry? I hope I haven't even further confused everyone!

 

[Navarre]

Ah! Ok now i understand!

Hmm... Well yes actually you are right, this will work but do you really want to keep the wet/dry filter? I have never used them so i cannot speak from experience but i have heard they can push up nitrates? (i may be wrong on this of course). If you are going to run a MM system for example in the sump and with loads of liverock in the main tank this should easily handle any excess nutrients you will produce. However if you feel that the extra volume of water in the filter will add even further to the stability of hte tank then go for it!

 

[SWMWTHDAFISHES]

Well, that does need further contemplation, doesn't it? Hmmmmm. I haven't had any trouble with Nitrates, but then again I only have 2 fish in there right now! You have given me something to think about. I have 30 lbs of live rock only b/c I am seeding the rest with the 30 lbs, so the rest will be in there, but not doing much filtering for a while, obviously. I do like the 3 media trays in the wet/dry. Those do come in handy. I'll have to think about this some more. As always, you are a fountain, Navarre!!!

 

[Navarre]

If it helps at all (and im probably gonna only help cause you more stress now ) I know a few people that actually swear by this system. Nitrates are zero and the filter is very capable!.

I would sugest that you keep the filter and see how things develop. if the filter doesnt work you can always remove it and just use the sump.

 

[SWMWTHDAFISHES]

I think I will run them both, they both have their benefits, that's for sure. I really want the sump primarily for isolating any problem fish, I know 100% for sure that I will have to put my tang in there since he is the only thing that is currently in my tank and he won't take too well to my new arrivals when I put them in. Since I am going to do the 10-gallon sump, the question arises, What to put in it??? If I'm going to go to the trouble of putting one in, I might as well make it work for me, right? So, I was thinking of putting some mangroves in there, and I wanted to put chaetamorpha in there, but I know the tang will eat it so that's sort of pointless. He won't be staying in there too long, but it doesn't take them long, does it, LOL? Do you have any suggestions of what to put in the sump, knowing that I will be running the wet/dry in conjunction with it? Mangroves OK? How much do I need for a 75 US gal tank? Any other magro algae that you would suggest that the tang wouldnt' demolish in 5-seconds flat? Oh, and is an ECO the best choice here? You make one decision and it brings 10 more to the table with it! Thanks!

 

[Navarre]

I had toput my tang in the sump for a week and it never touched my macro algeas.

I have Haliptilon, Halymenia, Halimeda, Cheato (yep it didnt touch it!).

I would get 5 mangroves for a tank of your size. They take a while to kick in but once they start to produce leaves then they are doing the business!

 

[SWMWTHDAFISHES]

OK, I got the mangroves. I got red mangroves that already have roots and leaves on them, they are seedlings, but I thought roots and some leaves were definately a good start! I got 12 (the pkg didn't come any smaller than 12). Can you have too many of these? Should I only put 5 in there or is it a the more the better kind of thing?

I also got 10 ounces of Chaetomorpha and 2 lbs of live sand, as well as 1 gallon of Mineral Mud for the ECO refugium. Is this the right amount of Chaeto? How deep should my mineral mud be and how deep should the sand be on top of it? I think about 1 gallon is the recommended amt for a 75-gallon tank, but do I need to cut down on the mud since the sump is only a 10-gallon? Maybe I should just ask you how many inches deep it should be?

Oh, and this is sort of coming as a pkg deal with 7 lbs of live rock (just a taste!), do you think that I should put that live rock in my refugium or just put it in the main tank with the rest of it? I would rather enjoy it in the main tank, but didn't know if there was a good reason to put it in the refugium.

Thanks again!

 

[Navarre]

Seems like you are getting yourself a nice filtation system to gether now!

Ok the mangroves are god.. 10 is even better. I dont think you will have a problem with too many apart from if they are not looked after they can grow large! Make sure you prune the leaves regualr to stop it getting out of control.

Cheato is a great choice of algea! it doesnt crash, grows fast and easy to prune when it gets too large. (Looks aweful though but its in the sump so who cares!)

I would recomend 2 inches of mud and 1 inch of sand over it. this will give the sump a great kickstart. If you have any mud left over then keep it as you never know if you will upgrade in the future etc.

I would put the liverock in the main tank. I have a couple of small bits of live rock in my sump but as your sump is small i really dont think its necessary.

 

[SWMWTHDAFISHES]

You are making this very easy for me, I really appreciate the help! Does it matter what size bioballs that I get? Since this is only a 10-gal sump, I was thinking the smaller 1 inch black ones might be a better choice and I'm thinking I shouldn't really need too many of them, thought I would just buy 500 and see what that does.

I'm thinking I won't need the bio-balls at the beginning of the sump b/c they are supposed to break up bubbles and catch large particles, but since my wet/dry is feeding the sump, I shouldn't have any of that? Do you agree with that assessment?

As I was thinking about this, going through the wet/dry first may be a reason to put that live rock in the sump b/c the wet/dry would be filtering out what I would want to go in the sump from the live rock in my main tank to populate the mud. What do you think?

 

[Navarre]

forget the bioballs if you are using the wet/dry. Try some liverock there. if you dont think its working then you can always remove it back to the main tank.

 

[SWMWTHDAFISHES]

You are THE MAN!!!

 

[SWMWTHDAFISHES]

Hey, Navarre, didn't I see a pic of your mangroves floating? in the main tank? The reason that I ask is that I would like to go ahead and take delivery of the mangroves, but it will probably take a week (I'm guessing) before I can use the sump to give the silicone time to dry (is that right?). Can I put them in the main tank until then and how exactly do I do that? Thanks so much.