HOB filter size for 36 gallon bow tank

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Bking426

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I have a brand new tank I have yet to use. I’m leaning towards a HOB filter. My 10 gallon has one so I’m used to them. From what I’ve read you can get over what the tank brand specifies. My Aqueon paperwork inside says filter rated for 35-55 gallon tanks and submersible heater 150-200 watts. I’d planned on possibly getting one that would run on a bit bigger tank. Does that help water quality better?


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Short answer to your question is, no. Larger filters do not help water quality better. Provided the filter is sufficient for the tank volume and fish load, "more" is not beneficial.

Before deciding on a filter, you need to know the sort of fish species you will have in this tank, as some have specific needs when it comes to water current and this is where your filter does the task. Some fish do not like water currents at all, so a different type of filter would be better for them. Tank size and fish species are the factors to consider. Also, if live plants are intended.
 
One of the biggest misconceptions in the hobby is that bigger (or more) filters means cleaner water (and or more fish). Nothing could be further from the truth. I once saw a photo of a 55g tank with 3 large canister filters underneath....the hobbyist proclaimed 'there's no such thing as over filtering.
Well, yes there is!
The reality is that filters trap particulates and provide a good home for beneficial bacteria, and although they improve water clarity, they really don't maintain or improve water quality. The detritus that gets trapped in a filter decays and pollutes the water - there's no stopping it. The only way to maintain/improve water quality in the aquarium is with fast growing plants, especially floating pants, AND routine partial water changes. Fast growing plants use the pollution (aka nutrients) and convert it to plant tissue which at some point is trimmed and removed from the tank. The routine partial water change dilutes the pollution and resupplies necessary minerals.
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Then there's the flow. We want good circulation in a tank, but not necessarily a raging river. Some hobbyists think that they do their fish a favor because in the wild, the species they have live in fast moving streams. But then most of the fish we have in the hobby were tank or pond raised and never saw a raging stream! Imagine the potential stress of suddenly have to swim like heck 24/7 to keep from being swept away!
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Now as to HOB's, I don't care for cartridge type HOB's - they're marketing genius for the consumable cartridge but not the best for our aquariums. I much prefer the Aquaclear design where I/we can decide what media to use. I have 4 Aquaclear filters (3 currently in use) and all of them are completely filled with bio-sponge material, making them HOB sponge filters. I've tried all sorts of bio-media over the years and concluded that sponge material works every bit as good, is less expensive, cleans easily, and lasts nearly forever and a day.
As to size, the AC50 would suffice for your size tank, however I like the media capacity of the AC70 better, which I have on my 37g. However, I'd suggest using an AC50 or AC30 impeller in the AC70 filter body. (I have two AC70's on my 60g with AC50 impellers and set for low flow/max re-filtration. For the 37g, I'm using the AC70 impeller, but I drilled holes in the inlet tube just above the impeller to reduce output flow while increasing re-filtration.)
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Note: Seachem's relatively new Tidal filters are similar to the Aquaclear, and although it has some interesting features, I still prefer the Aquaclear design.
I hope these ramblings help some.
Best wishes - Mike
 
I actually ordered the AC50 on amazon last night. With my ten gallon I took out the carbon and put biomax and floss. I threw out the carbon. I also have a water bottle baffle on it because I have a betta in there. Thanks for all the helpful info!


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on my 35 gallon tall hex, I use an aquaclear 50 with sponge, a layer of floss and ceramic media. I also use a sponge filter rated at 40 gallons. Should the hob fail by power loss or defect, the sponge filter will help slow buildup of ammonia or nitrites till the hob gets repaired or restarted. I find that I usually have to prime the hob after a cleaning or water change.

I use a penguin 200 filter for my 29 gallon tank but replace the cartridge with a large sponge and a layer of floss. The biowheel also helps to contribute beneficial bacteria. I've been running that filter for 3 years with good results and healthy fish. As a secondary filter, I use a 40 gallon rated sponge filter with air pump.

I recommend 50% weekly water changes and also cleaning the filter sponge and replacing the floss every 2 weeks. By then the floss is pretty gunked up.
 
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I re-plumbed a 800 LPH canister filter to work on a 20 liter Betta cube, Why? Not for filtration but for extra water capacity, that canister holds almost 5 liters of water.

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I have a brand new tank I have yet to use. I’m leaning towards a HOB filter. My 10 gallon has one so I’m used to them. From what I’ve read you can get over what the tank brand specifies. My Aqueon paperwork inside says filter rated for 35-55 gallon tanks and submersible heater 150-200 watts. I’d planned on possibly getting one that would run on a bit bigger tank. Does that help water quality better?


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Usually the rule of thumb is that for a hang on back you want a filtration rate of 8-10x’s the volume. For a 36 gallon, you want a gallons per hour rate between 288-360. Depending on your stocking. I tend to go for more filtration. So an AquaClear 50 isn’t big enough, it only has 200gph. The Aqua Clear 70 would work though.

If you decide on a canister filter, the rule is a rate that is 4-5x’s the tank volume. So a smaller canister filter would work. 144-180 gph.


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Usually the rule of thumb is that for a hang on back you want a filtration rate of 8-10x’s
Depends on the type of fish, 8 to 10 times turn over rate in my 5 gallon cube would kill my Rosetail betta in no time.

My Bumblebee Gobys in a 15 gallon would hate 5 times turn over.
My Endlers would hate 5 times an hour turn over.

And my Betta females in a 100 gallon 6 foot tank wouldnt last long at 4 times an hour turnover.

Most fresh water fish in the hobby prefer sluggish current in the tank.
 
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Usually the rule of thumb is that for a hang on back you want a filtration rate of 8-10x’s the volume. ...
I'm sorry, but this is incorrect. Good filtration is about how well we filter the water not how fast or how many times an hour we push water through a filter!
Imagine if we filtered every drop of water really well, how many times per hour would we need to filter that drop?!
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Btw, the regurgitated and incorrect rule of thumb has always been 4-8x's the volume. I say 2-4x's is more than enough.
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Remember, filters just collect particles where they continue to decompose and pollute the water. Plants, especially floating plants, AND routine partial water changes are the only way to maintain high water quality.
 
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I'm sorry, but this is incorrect. Good filtration is about how well we filter the water not how fast or how many times an hour we push water through a filter!
Imagine if we filtered every drop of water really well, how many times per hour would we need to filter that drop?!
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Btw, the regurgitated and incorrect rule of thumb has always been 4-8x's the volume. I say 2-4x's is more than enough.
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Remember, filters just collect particles where they continue to decompose and pollute the water. Plants, especially floating plants, AND routine partial water changes are the only way to maintain high water quality.

I have read these stats before, and have also had help from long term fish keepers. No one ever has told me anything different. I have been in the hobby for 4 almost 5 years. Literally everyone I know in the hobby, uses the stats I quoted.

I am interested in learning more, always. Do you have articles I can read that talk about filtration rates? And why there are differing recommendations? And why you say what I have learned is wrong?

Looking for more than your word on it, no offense.

I follow the EI method for fertilizing my plants, so I do large water changes and have very well planted tanks. Along with the high gph rates.
 
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Most fresh water fish in the hobby prefer sluggish current in the tank.

There are thousands of freshwater fish, there is no way you can say most prefer sluggish water. Each species needs something different. Maybe the species that you keep have those needs, but the fish I keep don’t. I have canisters on 3 of my 4 tanks. (my betta tank has an attached sump, with a sponge filter to help with surface agitation) That have high gph rates. I even have a wavemaker on my 55g to increase flow. It isn’t an all or nothing situation.
 
My comments on issues raised in the last two/three posts.

Filtration is not always well understood in this hobby. AbbeysDad is correct in what he posted. Let us begin by deciding what "filtration" in the aquarium actually involves.

First, it moves the water around, so the water flow or current must be considered. Most of the hobby fish do prefer less current. Fish that spend six months of the year in flooded forest are not being exposed to strong currents. Some fish do need them, as they live in flowing streams. This is why knowing the habitat of every species we intend to keep is important; we need to ensure we are providing the basic needs for that species, and water current is a vital part.

An example. One of my tanks is a 40g, surface dimensions 36 by 18 inches. I have a dual sponge filter in the right rear corner. There is very,. very little water movement. The 40+ fish in this tank are in a basically ideal environment. Nannostomus eques, Parachierodon simulans, Hyphessobrycon amandae, Characidium fasciatum. All residents of quiet blackwater streams, pools and flooded forest

Aside from that, what do we expect the filter to achieve? Basically, nitrification. We want Nitrosomonas bacteria to grab the ammonia, and we want Nitrospira bacteria to grab the resulting nitrite. Provided the filter is sufficient for the tank volume and fish species/numbers, this will be achieved. We now know that if the water movement through the filter is too fast, the bacteria cannot function well, or even at all. "More" is not beneficial, and may be quite the reverse. This applies not only to the flow rate, but the filter size and number of filters too. There is only so much the bacteria can do, and this is basically not relevant to the filter(s).

We must also keep in mind that the substrate is far more important when it comes to a healthy aquarium than any filter. More bacteria species live in the substrate, and the "filtration" they achieve is much more important to a healthy aquarium.

We can have a well-balanced and healthy aquarium with no filter at all (meaning no "filter" equipment). All of my tanks have a filter, but it is much less than any of the common "recommendations." Too many have the thinking that they can somehow overload the system with more filters, but that does not work.

I follow the EI method for fertilizing my plants, so I do large water changes and have very well planted tanks. Along with the high gph rates.

I would suggest there are two problems here, for fish. One is the flow rate which may be detrimental (not knowing the species, I only make the observation it may be). But second, the EI method is not good for fish, as I will explain. But keep in mind that most planted tank aquarists that are into things like mega light, diffused CO2 and EI fertilization have tanks with few or no fish. As soon as you have fish tanks that happen to have plants, the emphasis must be on the fish if we want to provide a healthy environment for the fish.

Every substance added to the water in the aquarium gets inside the fish. Water is continually passing through every cell via osmosis, entering the bloodstream and internal organs. Substances also enter the bloodstream via the gills during respiration. The ideal is to add nothing at all to the water, but when additives are needed, use no more than absolutely necessary. Water conditioner for example does not need to be over-used, because it does impact the fish. Same for all these plant additives. I went into this in detail with a couple of professional biologists and microbiologists a couple years back when dealing with an issue in one tank. Fish do not need to drop dead to prove these additives are impacting them, they are simply weakened and this means more issues down the road.
 
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I have read these stats before, and have also had help from long term fish keepers. No one ever has told me anything different. I have been in the hobby for 4 almost 5 years. Literally everyone I know in the hobby, uses the stats I quoted.
I can't speak to who told you what other than to point out that many of the 'rules of thumb' that hobbyists pass along are incorrect and simply repeated with seemingly little examination. But because it's repeated so much, it becomes gospel.

I am interested in learning more, always. Do you have articles I can read that talk about filtration rates? And why there are differing recommendations? And why you say what I have learned is wrong? Looking for more than your word on it, no offense.
No I don't have articles I can point you to. What I do have is 50+ years of experience in the hobby and an analytical, objective approach to fish keeping.

I follow the EI method for fertilizing my plants, so I do large water changes and have very well planted tanks. Along with the high gph rates.
I'm not really a fan of the estimated index approach as it would seem to favor plants over fish. I use plants for naturalization and to aid in water purification to increase/maintain water quality. I am only willing to add modest amounts of ferts to support the plants...and only as/if necessary. Most of my plants grow fine with little/no added ferts. I suppose EI is fine for aquatic gardens, but no one would convince me that all those extra ferts are good for the fish!
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As to large water changes...all tanks with avg. stocking levels should receive 50-75% weekly water changes (regardless of excess ferts). Some of my tanks get 50% twice a week - some fry tanks even more! It's only with fast growing plants, especially floating plants, AND routine partial water changes that we maintain high water quality. Filters only aid in water clarity, not water pollution...and the solution to pollution is dilution.
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As to high flow rates.... We want good water circulation in a tank, but most often high flow rates should be avoided. Byron makes a good point about fast flow rates inhibiting beneficial bacteria. I'd also suggest that except in rare cases, many of the fish we acquire in the hobby are pond or tank born and raised and never saw a fast moving stream like their wild cousins.
 

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