Help With Plants

[keenonfish]

Hey folks ok I planted my tank a couple of weeks ago this Sunday and generally things have been growing ok. Considering plants die very quickly under normal low light conditions I am quite chuffed really and in fact there is going to be a mass pruning and removal of plants this weekend! However, there is a BUT...

Here's a rundown so far...

Vision 180
2 x 35W T5 Juwel standard light bar
30ppm co2 from home made canisters however I have a question about my home made d4kh below....
dosing E.I. as stated in pinned area KNO3 3x a week & KH2PO4 3x & traces 3x 30, 18 & 10ml respecitively...

Echinodorus osiris var. rubra is growing very well with new leaves appearing nearly every day... Quite a space hog!

Myriophyllum hippuroides Egeria densa Micranthemum (baby tears), Hygrophilia polysperma doing very well lots of roots..

Rotala macranda slow growth but roots and branching points and Valis Spiralis shows no change except there are some runners appearing. Also outside of leaf is darker is this normal?


ok so all above are ok to some extent. however I feel some of them could look a little better and one or two plants below are not moving at all or showing signs of deficiencies....

Echinodorus unknown (bleheri?) showing no signs of growth, and also a couple of spots have appeared in leaves one leaf the spots are redish brown the other they are very dark surrounded by black. Almost look sooty.

However the biggest surprise is my frogbit! initially grew very well in my other tank until nutrients got on the thin side but since transfering, they have showed signs of recovery but the growth isn't great tbh. Leaves and roots are fairly small (couple large ones have sprung up) and some have ridges along the length some have red spots basically a variety of symptoms..

From what I have read sounds like my plants might have a calcium / mag deficiency. One site I read suggested if one element is missing it could result in a number of symptoms that look like other elements are missing which is why I am posting here now so I don't end up going down the wrong route!

I know kh is about 1.5 round here but not sure about gh. I have emailed United Utilites for info so it will be interesting to see what they come back with.

Does it sound like I need gh booster or is there something else missing?

If it helps I will post some pics when I get to the other computer later on..

Oh there are some very, very small signs of algae growth but we are talking tiny amounts on the odd pebble so not worrying yet Haven't had to clean glass or anything else yet!

Thanks,

Olly.

 

[aaronnorth]

Rotala macranda slow growth but roots and branching points and Valis Spiralis shows no change except there are some runners appearing. Also outside of leaf is darker is this normal?

new leaves are always a different colour to older leaves.

From what I have read sounds like my plants might have a calcium / mag deficiency. One site I read suggested if one element is missing it could result in a number of symptoms that look like other elements are missing which is why I am posting here now so I don't end up going down the wrong route!

Yes, or the othe way round for example too much sodium can limit potassium uptake. It shouldnt be too much of a problem though,

Keeping the kH round 4 is reccomended as this then ensures there is enough "hardwater" nutrients for the plants - Mg++ Ca++ K+ etc.

Pictures will help

 

[keenonfish]

Hi Aaron, thanks for your help.

Some picies...

Frogbit. Leaves are a little pale with darker green ridges in some leaves.. I have tried to pen the frogbit in so it gets consistent light etc...

roots couple of days ago...

roots now... some improvement?

Echinodorus unknown (bleheri?) with spots.. It is the one plant where I have seen absolutely no signs of growth!

Next pics just to show general growth of the tank over last 5 days...

Last Sunday..

Today..

I think I need a machete this Sunday!

As you can see the aquascaping has gone down the pan but I just want a feel for simple plants / dosing at the moment then I will develop things over the next few months hopefully

BTW aaron I made my own 4dkh solution which tests spot on with kh test kit. However when I initially add the solution to my drop checker it will turn green. Then, after half an hour it is the regent blue everyone talks about. In my small tank it goes greeny blue (more blue) (old co2 bottle and air pump for UGF so to be expected really!) and my tank above green but more on the yellow side. Is it possible there is something wrong with my solution other than accuracy? I would have thought if accuracy were off it would stay green and not change so that is why I am thinking there is something odd going on... maybe plastic bottles reacting? Water was from halfords btw.

Olly.

 

[keenonfish]

ok just checked my M. umbrosum and whilst growing there is burning round the edges of the leaves...

 

[aaronnorth]

As you can see the aquascaping has gone down the pan but I just want a feel for simple plants / dosing at the moment then I will develop things over the next few months hopefully

Learning how to grow plants and different techniques is much more imporatnt than aquascaping intially.

BTW aaron I made my own 4dkh solution which tests spot on with kh test kit. However when I initially add the solution to my drop checker it will turn green. Then, after half an hour it is the regent blue everyone talks about. In my small tank it goes greeny blue (more blue) (old co2 bottle and air pump for UGF so to be expected really!) and my tank above green but more on the yellow side. Is it possible there is something wrong with my solution other than accuracy? I would have thought if accuracy were off it would stay green and not change so that is why I am thinking there is something odd going on... maybe plastic bottles reacting? Water was from halfords btw.

when it turns green, it is basically doing a pH test, it isnt until the CO2 gasses off that it turns blue.
So in the small tank is is more blue. In the large tank it is more yellow.

If you have an air pump then i dont see why it it shouldnt be blue in the little tank.

How far is the frogbit away from the light? It may be getting burned.

How long have the plants been in the tank again?

 

[keenonfish]

As you can see the aquascaping has gone down the pan but I just want a feel for simple plants / dosing at the moment then I will develop things over the next few months hopefully

Learning how to grow plants and different techniques is much more imporatnt than aquascaping intially.

BTW aaron I made my own 4dkh solution which tests spot on with kh test kit. However when I initially add the solution to my drop checker it will turn green. Then, after half an hour it is the regent blue everyone talks about. In my small tank it goes greeny blue (more blue) (old co2 bottle and air pump for UGF so to be expected really!) and my tank above green but more on the yellow side. Is it possible there is something wrong with my solution other than accuracy? I would have thought if accuracy were off it would stay green and not change so that is why I am thinking there is something odd going on... maybe plastic bottles reacting? Water was from halfords btw.

when it turns green, it is basically doing a pH test, it isnt until the CO2 gasses off that it turns blue.
So in the small tank is is more blue. In the large tank it is more yellow.

If you have an air pump then i dont see why it it shouldnt be blue in the little tank.

How far is the frogbit away from the light? It may be getting burned.

How long have the plants been in the tank again?

It will be two weeks Sunday.

Frogbit is perhaps too close however where I penned it in it is more in the shade and not directly below the lamps. I could try moving this to the other side of the tank near to the filter as it may be more suitable there...

Regards the drop checker so is it ok for things to be green for a while initially? I wish I could definitively test the liquid but I am sure it must be ok as the kh says so - I did two tests one with the usual single drops = 1 unit the second with 10ml and two drops per unit so I got 4 drops first then 8 drops on second test to change to yellow.

 

[aaronnorth]

2 weeks isnt long, especially for species like echinodorous and cryptocorynes which are the main species to be grown emersed.

How green is the DC turning? If it is just a slight tinge then i wouldnt worry. Can you get a pic?

 

[keenonfish]

Hi mate ok I refilled drop checker last night and as you can see it is quite green at first!

It will normally take about an hour to change from this to the regal blue colour as shown below...

I left the DC in my small tank over night with air pump and I removed co2 bottle as there is only moss in their atm...

This morning this is how the drop checker looked..

I moved it to the large tank this morning with co2 and 2 hours later...

So not sure what is going on tbh I think I will make another solution up... I have to be honest I used a slightly different method here. Like I said above it tests to 4dkh fairly accurately using a new API kit so I can't see what else I could have done.

Just one more thing.. I have noticed very small isolated amounts of hair algae on one or two leaves. Quite hard to see atm but more evident on a screwed up leaf of one of my Rotala's.

Tank is not ready for a clean up crew atm so should I be worried or is a tiny amount acceptable?

Oh could this be considered as pearling or something else..

Thanks for your help!

Olly.

Just want to add nothing has changed with the DC since I snapped the neck and re-glued - so that can be ruled out as the reason for the discrepancy!

 

[aaronnorth]

It must be just doing a pH test. If the 4dkh is pH 7 theni t will turn green. Perhaps Andy can confirm, give him a PM (supercoley1).
I suggest making 4dkh like so in the DC guide:
Add 6g of pure Sodium Bicarbonate to 5l of DeIonised water (DI) to give you a solution at 40dKH.

Mix 10ml of this solution with 90ml of 'fresh' DI to give you 100ml of 4dKH reference solution.

The rotla leaf will be attracting algae, because it is rotting and therefore producing ammonia. Any signs of algae i would remove asap to stop it developing further.

The MU is pearling.