Help Needed With Cyling!

[kenkat]

like 8 days

 

[Ch4rlie]

Give it time and keep continuing to test the water parameters for any changes.

 

[kwi]

Have patience and test every 3 days for now. Use the time to research what stock you want.

 

[FishBearer9845]

Mines been fishless cycling for over three weeks, it’ll be worth it though

 

[kenkat]

So the nitrates went up while the nitrites and ammonia stayed the same. It was 2ppm ammonia, 0ppm nitrite and like 10ppm nitrates now

 

[Treestone]

So the nitrates went up while the nitrites and ammonia stayed the same. It was 2ppm ammonia, 0ppm nitrite and like 10ppm nitrates now

That's pretty normal for the cycle to "skip" nitrites as it really means it's cycling as it should. Since your pH is quite a bit lower expect some of the ammonia will convert through nitrogen fixation into less harmful ammonium due to the excess of hydrogen ions. Ammonium will generally take longer to cycle according to some sources. But overall you're on the right track. My best advice is to just chuck in some ammonia (supplement every now and then), forget about it for a couple of weeks and before you know it it'll be cycled, the grimier the better.

 

[Ch4rlie]

That's pretty normal for the cycle to "skip" nitrites as it really means it's cycling as it should. Since your pH is quite a bit lower expect some of the ammonia will convert through nitrogen fixation into less harmful ammonium due to the excess of hydrogen ions. Ammonium will generally take longer to cycle according to some sources. But overall you're on the right track. My best advice is to just chuck in some ammonia (supplement every now and then), forget about it for a couple of weeks and before you know it it'll be cycled, the grimier the better.

Am curious. What or where are you basing your answer from as its slightly confusing for me.

For me, I am no scientist but I've never heard of a cycle skipping nitrites and ammonia bacteria taking longer to cycle.

It's normally the other way around, ammonia bacteria (nitrosomonas) are quickly formed while it can take anything from a week to a few weeks for the nitritfying bacteria (nitrobacter) to form.

This is what we wait for in the cycling process and why we dose 3ppm ammonia at certain phases of the cycle, its when ammonia is being consumed by the nitrosomonas and then redosing ammonia to keep those bacs going while we wait for the nitrobacter bacteria to peak and form an adequate colony to deal with nitrite that the nitrosomonas produces.

Interesting that you mention ammonia will convert through nitrogen to ammonium due to hydrogen ions. I'd be interested in reading the papers or website where you have gathered this information from if that's possible.

 

[Treestone]

Am curious. What or where are you basing your answer from as its slightly confusing for me.

For me, I am no scientist but I've never heard of a cycle skipping nitrites and ammonia bacteria taking longer to cycle.

It's normally the other way around, ammonia bacteria (nitrosomonas) are quickly formed while it can take anything from a week to a few weeks for the nitritfying bacteria (nitrobacter) to form.

This is what we wait for in the cycling process and why we dose 3ppm ammonia at certain phases of the cycle, its when ammonia is being consumed by the nitrosomonas and then redosing ammonia to keep those bacs going while we wait for the nitrobacter bacteria to peak and form an adequate colony to deal with nitrite that the nitrosomonas produces.

Interesting that you mention ammonia will convert through nitrogen to ammonium due to hydrogen ions. I'd be interested in reading the papers or website where you have gathered this information from if that's possible.

Sorry, I worded that badly, the nitrogen cycle never skips nitrites although it may seem (only ammonia and nitrate readings). This article sums it all up nicely https://petcentral.chewy.com/the-role-of-ph-in-the-aquarium-nitrogen-cycle/

 

[seangee]

What is your pH now. NITROSOMONAS grows very slowly at 6 and cannot survive below 6. But you are correct that most of your ammonia will be in the form of ammonium in acidic water. 3 of my tanks are simply not possible to cycle. Add lots of plants, wait till they are actively growing and add fish. Just a few every couple of weeks to make sure the system can cope.

 

[Treestone]

IME experience at a high pH (7.8~8.2) tanks cycle very quickly (bb love a pH of 7-8) and almost never shows any nitrite as it goes through the process so quickly. Nitrosomonas bacteria (ammonia to nitrite) may take longer than Nitrobacter (nitrite to nitrate) to colonise, causing these readings but that's just my inference.

 

[Ch4rlie]

What is your pH now. NITROSOMONAS grows very slowly at 6 and cannot survive below 6. But you are correct that most of your ammonia will be in the form of ammonium in acidic water. 3 of my tanks are simply not possible to cycle. Add lots of plants, wait till they are actively growing and add fish. Just a few every couple of weeks to make sure the system can cope.

Indeed this is a good point.

Have highlighted in bold.

Quoted from Cycling your new Freshwater Tank article -


Besides the ammonia or nitrite, the bacteria need oxygen and inorganic carbon as well as a proper temperature. While they can survive from just above freezing to about 42C (108 F), they do best between about 75F and 85F. Lastly, the ammonia converting bacteria do not function as well the lower the pH gets. If your pH drops under 7.0, they start to slow their activity markedly and under 6.5, they slow dramatically and by about 6.0 they will appear to stop completely.

To get a tank cycled in a reasonable amount of time, you need to make sure that, in addition to ammonia, the bacteria will also have:

• Lots of oxygen by keeping the surface of your water well agitated to let oxygen in.
• Inorganic carbon (as carbonates) by keeping your KH up. Do not let it drop below 3 dg (55 ppm).
• A good pH level by insuring it is above 6.5. The closer to 8.0 the faster the cycle will go. We do not recommend one alter their pH if it holds fairly steady anywhere between 6.8 - 8.5.
• An optimal temperature by having a heater set to between 75F and 85F (24C and 29C). Lower tends to slow the cycle while higher won’t make things go even faster.

If you give the bacteria all they need, they will multiply. Even more importantly, they will produce a bio-film which they use to attach themselves to surfaces in your filter and all over your tank and which protects them. In a cycled tank the nitrifying bacteria do not live free floating in the water.

Cycling Your New Fresh Water Tank: Read This First!

Cycling Your First Fresh Water Tank What is Cycling and Why is it Important? Fish waste, and especially fish breathing, plus uneaten food and other organic matter breaking down in a tank all produce Ammonia. This can quickly become toxic to fish if it is allowed to build up to any measurable...

www.fishforums.net

 

[kenkat]

I am getting worried as it has been a few weeks and it is still at 0 ppm nitrite like it always has, about 4ppm ammonia and 10ppm nitrate. I will check the ph tomorrow and as far as the temperature goes, it has been at around 76 degrees and for the oxygen, I have an air stone. I have a filter hang on the back as well as some sponge filters I was using to try to get bacteria from an old tank. Could too much filtration impact it? What should I do to raise the ph if it is indeed low.

 

[itiwhetu]

Why do you guys make things so hard to understand!!. Listen put a neutral natural base into the tank plant it switch on your filters and lights 10 days later add fish.

 

[Essjay]

Most newcomers don't have live plants so they need to do a fishless cycle.

 

[Ch4rlie]

I am getting worried as it has been a few weeks and it is still at 0 ppm nitrite like it always has, about 4ppm ammonia and 10ppm nitrate. I will check the ph tomorrow and as far as the temperature goes, it has been at around 76 degrees and for the oxygen, I have an air stone. I have a filter hang on the back as well as some sponge filters I was using to try to get bacteria from an old tank. Could too much filtration impact it? What should I do to raise the ph if it is indeed low.

What test kit are you using?

And would suggest doing a 25% water change to bring your ammonia down to 3ppm if your test kit is accurate.

Too much filtration should not have an impact, agigation of water surface is good for oxygen exchange which the bacterias do need oxygen so would not worry too much about that at this point.

What is your pH?
If its anywhere between 6.8 to 8.5, should be fine.

Your temperature at 76 is fine, as normally between 75F and 85F or 24C and 29C, lower temperature will slow the cycle down while higher temperatures won’t make things go any faster at all.