Goldfish Blood-Like Gills

[crmpicco]

Hi,

I have a 5 year old Goldfish that is in a large tank with a small Shubunkin of a few months old. I am concerned as I have spotted some blood-like substance in and around his lower gills in the area I would refer to as his "chin". He seems to be swimming around and eating as regularly as normal. I have noticed that his top fin is slightly "flat", although this may not be pertinent. The red appearance doesn't spread as far as his side gills, however my wife believes his eyes look more "buggy" as if he is a bit bloated.

I've dropped a couple of pipes of Revitaliser Tonic in tonight to see how he is in the morning - is this advised/recommended?

I do regular water changes to remove as much waste as possible and also have a light and filter. The temperature of the tank is always at a steady 20 degrees Celsius.

Is the fish suffering from an illness that I should be concerned about and is there anything I can do to help him recover?

Any help appreciated.

Picco

twitter.com/crmpicco

 

[This Old Spouse]

If you can provide some more information we can be more helpful. How big is your tank? What other fish do you have? How old is the goldfish? What do you feed it and how much and how often? Is your filter cycled? Do you test your water for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate? And if so do you use a liquid testing kit?

 

[crmpicco]

If you can provide some more information we can be more helpful. How big is your tank? What other fish do you have? How old is the goldfish? What do you feed it and how much and how often? Is your filter cycled? Do you test your water for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate? And if so do you use a liquid testing kit?

I have a Hagen Tropiquarium 68 (72 litre) tank. The other fish is a small shubunkin which is only a couple of months old. The sick fish is around 5 years old.

I feed both fish Tetra goldfish flakes and some pellet food as well. I'm not sure what you mean by filter cycling - I have it on for about 6 hours per day (I don't leave it on when i'm out at work).

I don't test the water, however if I need to then I will. I've never done it before so I don't know what to buy or what i'm looking for.

I hope this answers a few questions necessary to help me out, as I say, any help appreciated.

Cheers,
Picco

 

[fluttermoth]

Your fish will be suffering because of poor water quality, probably from ammonia (which is produced by the fish's pee and poop) and which chould be being dealt with by your filter.

A 'cycled' filter has a colony of good bacteria growing in it, which eats the ammonia (which is very toxic) and turns it in nitrite (also toxic, but not as much as ammonia) and then more bacteria eat that and turn into nitrate, which is only toxic at very high levels, and which is removed from the tank with water changes.

You must leave your filter running 24/7; it is your fish's life support system and they'll continue to get sick, and possibly die, if you don't.

For now, do a 50% water change (makes sure you dechlorinate the new water) every day; this will remove the toxins in the water, and your fish should feel a lot better.

If you go to the 'beginner's resource centre' (the link for that is in my sig) there are some great articles about the nitrogen cycle and cycling filters, which should help you understand what's going on with your tank.

I should warn you that your tank is really too small for goldfish; fancy goldies should have a minimum tank size of 100l, and 'normal' goldies like your shubunkin (and your sick fish, if it has a streamlined body and a single tail) really shouldn't be kept in tanks at all (unless you have space for a 5 footer); they're really pond fish.

If you can afford it, get a master test kit (don't bother with the paper strip type, they're notoriously inaccurate) that uses liquids and test tubes and then you can monitor what's happening with the water in your tank.

 

[crmpicco]

Your fish will be suffering because of poor water quality, probably from ammonia (which is produced by the fish's pee and poop) and which chould be being dealt with by your filter.

A 'cycled' filter has a colony of good bacteria growing in it, which eats the ammonia (which is very toxic) and turns it in nitrite (also toxic, but not as much as ammonia) and then more bacteria eat that and turn into nitrate, which is only toxic at very high levels, and which is removed from the tank with water changes.

You must leave your filter running 24/7; it is your fish's life support system and they'll continue to get sick, and possibly die, if you don't.

For now, do a 50% water change (makes sure you dechlorinate the new water) every day; this will remove the toxins in the water, and your fish should feel a lot better.

If you go to the 'beginner's resource centre' (the link for that is in my sig) there are some great articles about the nitrogen cycle and cycling filters, which should help you understand what's going on with your tank.

I should warn you that your tank is really too small for goldfish; fancy goldies should have a minimum tank size of 100l, and 'normal' goldies like your shubunkin (and your sick fish, if it has a streamlined body and a single tail) really shouldn't be kept in tanks at all (unless you have space for a 5 footer); they're really pond fish.

If you can afford it, get a master test kit (don't bother with the paper strip type, they're notoriously inaccurate) that uses liquids and test tubes and then you can monitor what's happening with the water in your tank.

Thanks for taking the time to reply to me.

I will be doing a 50% water change tonight when I get home as a matter of priority. I have TapSafe so I will add that in as I normally do.

I'm not sure what you mean by a "cycled" filter? I will leave the filter on all the time from now on, although this makes me nervous. The filter has two suction cups which stick onto the inside of the tank and has a sponge filter inside. I have a spare sponge filter that i've been given should I need to change this. The filter is 2/3 the height of the tank. I don't think I fully understand the need for the filter and how I should be cleaning/maintaining it.

What do you think I should do with it? Should I change the "sponge" inside it? (Sorry, I don't know the real name for it).

Can you get a water quality tester that is always in the tank which is similar to a thermometer?

Thanks for your help so far.

Picco

 

[fluttermoth]

A cycled filter is one that has a colony of the good bacteria in it. You need to leave the filter running, as the bacteria will die off if they don't have a constant flow of water and food from the fish poo. There's no need at all to be worried about leaving it running all the time; they are designed to do so safely. Obviously you need to switch if off when doing water changes so it doesn't run dry.

The bacteria living in the filter get rid of the ammonia produced by the fish. If you have no filter or no bacteria, then you would have to get rid of the ammonia yourself which, in practice, means you would have to be doing water changes every or every other day.

The sponge (that is the right name for it, although you might hear it refered to as 'filter media', because not all filters have sponge in; media is the name for anything inside the filter) is where the bacteria live. Once a week, when you're doing a water change, take the sponge out and rinse it in some of the old tank water. Never wash it out under the tap, as the chlorine in the tap water would kill the bacteria.

The sponge should never need replacing; a lot of filter maunfacturers recommend that you do, but that's just a ploy to get you to spend more money! If you replace the sponge, you will lose all your good bacteria and have to recycle the new sponge, which could lead to your fish being exposed to the poisonous ammonia.

I don't know of any testers that work like a thermometer. The API master test kit is the one we normally recommend as it's accurate enough for the normal hobbyist and can be bought for about £20 online. It might seem expensive, but it does last a long time (mine has been in use for about two years now, and I have six tanks on the go!) and is the only way you can really tell what's going on with the water.

 

[crmpicco]

A cycled filter is one that has a colony of the good bacteria in it. You need to leave the filter running, as the bacteria will die off if they don't have a constant flow of water and food from the fish poo. There's no need at all to be worried about leaving it running all the time; they are designed to do so safely. Obviously you need to switch if off when doing water changes so it doesn't run dry.

The bacteria living in the filter get rid of the ammonia produced by the fish. If you have no filter or no bacteria, then you would have to get rid of the ammonia yourself which, in practice, means you would have to be doing water changes every or every other day.

The sponge (that is the right name for it, although you might hear it refered to as 'filter media', because not all filters have sponge in; media is the name for anything inside the filter) is where the bacteria live. Once a week, when you're doing a water change, take the sponge out and rinse it in some of the old tank water. Never wash it out under the tap, as the chlorine in the tap water would kill the bacteria.

The sponge should never need replacing; a lot of filter maunfacturers recommend that you do, but that's just a ploy to get you to spend more money! If you replace the sponge, you will lose all your good bacteria and have to recycle the new sponge, which could lead to your fish being exposed to the poisonous ammonia.

I don't know of any testers that work like a thermometer. The API master test kit is the one we normally recommend as it's accurate enough for the normal hobbyist and can be bought for about £20 online. It might seem expensive, but it does last a long time (mine has been in use for about two years now, and I have six tanks on the go!) and is the only way you can really tell what's going on with the water.

Thanks for the advice

I have now completed the 50% water change, well it may have been slightly over 50% but it was there or thereabouts.

I opened up the filter and cleaned it out in the dirty tank water and put it back together. I have taken note to ensure that I do not clean it out under the tap again! Will the steps i've taken ensure that the good bacteria is built back up in the filter?

Also, do you think there is value in adding the revitaliser tonic over the next few days?

What would you recommend doing over the next few days to help my fish get better? Buy a coldwater tester kit? Revitaliser Tonic? Any other medicine that I should be looking at buying? Pets at Home here in the UK are selling one of the kits for £33.

Many thanks for your help.

Picco

 

[fluttermoth]

I don't think you need add any meds; plenty of good, clean water cures 90% of illnesses in fish.

Hopefully, as your tank has been set up quite a while, there will be some bacteria, either in the filter sponge or on the gravel or other decor that will colonise the filter quite rapidly, but if you can get a test kit, you can keep an eye on that by testing every day.

P@H are quite pricey (for everything, I've found) so you might get a better deal elsewhere, or online, but the API one is a good kit; the nitrate test can be a bit inaccurate, but as it's only toxic at very high levels (unlike ammonia and nitrite) it does the job perfectly adequately.

 

[crmpicco]

I don't think you need add any meds; plenty of good, clean water cures 90% of illnesses in fish.

Hopefully, as your tank has been set up quite a while, there will be some bacteria, either in the filter sponge or on the gravel or other decor that will colonise the filter quite rapidly, but if you can get a test kit, you can keep an eye on that by testing every day.

P@H are quite pricey (for everything, I've found) so you might get a better deal elsewhere, or online, but the API one is a good kit; the nitrate test can be a bit inaccurate, but as it's only toxic at very high levels (unlike ammonia and nitrite) it does the job perfectly adequately.

Thanks for this, a couple of days have passed since i've done the water change and the sick fish (Jack) certainly seems slightly better. The blood red gills seem to be subsiding very slightly. My plan is top do another water change next Friday (exactly one week on) and monitor him after that.

I did spot the API tester kit in Pets at Home at the weekend, however as you advised, they are quite pricey - £33!. Unfortunately, I couldn't justify that at the moment due to finances. However, I will buy this in the next couple of months to keep an eye on the levels in the tank.

The filter has been on constant since Friday, so hopefully this will contribute to a better quality of water in the tank for the fish.

Cheers for the help - I will post up again to let you know how he (Jack) is getting on.

 

[lilirish]

for ill fish, DAILY water changes are the best thing you can do - - as said above, clean water is the best thing to help your fish recover.

 

[crmpicco]

for ill fish, DAILY water changes are the best thing you can do - - as said above, clean water is the best thing to help your fish recover.

OK, this is understandable. I will be doing this tonight when I get home from work - is another 50% water change recommended or could I bring this down to 25%?

FWIW, the water does appear to be quite clear to date. I have had the filter/pump on continuously since Friday and I have fed them twice (Saturday and Monday).

Many thanks,
Picco

 

[This Old Spouse]

for ill fish, DAILY water changes are the best thing you can do - - as said above, clean water is the best thing to help your fish recover.

OK, this is understandable. I will be doing this tonight when I get home from work - is another 50% water change recommended or could I bring this down to 25%?

FWIW, the water does appear to be quite clear to date. I have had the filter/pump on continuously since Friday and I have fed them twice (Saturday and Monday).

Many thanks,
Picco

Sorry, but clear water doesn't mean a thing really. You should be testing with a liquid test kit daily to see what the parameters are. And 50% daily is much better than 25% until all problems are solved.

 

[crmpicco]

for ill fish, DAILY water changes are the best thing you can do - - as said above, clean water is the best thing to help your fish recover.

OK, this is understandable. I will be doing this tonight when I get home from work - is another 50% water change recommended or could I bring this down to 25%?

FWIW, the water does appear to be quite clear to date. I have had the filter/pump on continuously since Friday and I have fed them twice (Saturday and Monday).

Many thanks,
Picco

Sorry, but clear water doesn't mean a thing really. You should be testing with a liquid test kit daily to see what the parameters are. And 50% daily is much better than 25% until all problems are solved.

50% water change done last night. The red gills appear to be not as red, however he does seem to have fairly red "side fins". Again, sorry, I'm not sure what these are called.

At the moment I don't have the money to buy a API tester kit - I seen them at Pets at Home at the weekend, but I couldn't afford the £33 at that moment in time. I would have absolutely tested it in normal circumstances.

 

[This Old Spouse]

I keep seeing on the forum that folks are picking up the test kits online for around 20 pounds. In the meantime, your LFS should be able to test the water for you. Just be sure to have them write down the actual numbers of the test results and give them to you. "Your water is fine" doesn't tell us anything, and we are trying to help!

Nice big water changes are good, though. Cures a lot of evils.

 

[fluttermoth]

I did spot the API tester kit in Pets at Home at the weekend, however as you advised, they are quite pricey - £33!. Unfortunately, I couldn't justify that at the moment due to finances. However, I will buy this in the next couple of months to keep an eye on the levels in the tank.

If you're really strapped for cash right now, could you at least afford some of the dip strip type test? I wouldn't normally recommend them, as they're generally nowhere near as accurate as the liquid type, but it would be better than nothing at all.

The filter has been on constant since Friday, so hopefully this will contribute to a better quality of water in the tank for the fish.

Cheers for the help - I will post up again to let you know how he (Jack) is getting on.

I'm sure it will; keep up the water chages, and please think about getting a bigger tank (or a pond, next spring?) for them.

Great name, btw; my dog's called Jack too