Fry Status

[FishBlast]

How long can I leave them in the net? They're now very active, beg for food when I go near the tank, but their size hasn't changed much. They're like 1 cm max, and my old swordtails used to give birth to fry that were that size from day 1...
Could they be stunted? Or is it because their mother is too small / had her first time drop? Or there wasn't good enough nutrition (frozen bloodworms and Tetramin flakes were what she ate) before the birth?

EDIT: Just confirmed that I have 2 males in the fry batch... as 2 of them swim backwards -.- Which leaves only the albino as female since it gets courted and doesn't court back. It's becoming a real sausage fest...

EDIT: Updated title, as now I have only 2 fry left after about 1 month. Had 3 when I posted this topic.

 

[OldMan47]

There is nothing wrong with Tetramin flakes as a basic food fishblast. I used it for many years before I started to have so many tanks that I could simply not afford name brand flakes for my fish. When you go through a pound of food in less than 4 months, the cost begins to add up to a fair amount, even for flake foods. Be aware that platies/swordtails do not nourish their young while they develop so I would not expect food quality to affect the fry much. The fry are simply protected eggs that are developing on their own, with no nourishment from the female. The only freshwater livebearers that I know of who do nourish their fry more or less like a land animal might, are the goodeid group. They do not use an umbilicus as we are accustomed to but a structure called trophotaenia that provide much the same ability to nourish the fry from the female. In those fish the diet of the female before a drop must be controlled to preclude birth difficulties. It turns out that a diet too high in protein can actually produce fry that the female has trouble giving birth to. Their fry are huge at birth, compared to the more common livebearers that you will find at the LFS. Some that I keep are born at about 2 cm long but there are only about 10 in a drop and the drops are over 2 months apart.
Backward swimming huh. I never considered that a way to sex swordtails but I guess it is as good as any other method before they start to show their gender with physical characteristics.
You will need to keep swordtail fry away from the parents until they are at least 2 cm long. I do not recall swordtail fry being a full cm at a drop but it has been while since I bred swordtails. In my own memories, swordtails were among the smallest of all fry in my tanks.

 

[FishBlast]

There is nothing wrong with Tetramin flakes as a basic food fishblast. I used it for many years before I started to have so many tanks that I could simply not afford name brand flakes for my fish. When you go through a pound of food in less than 4 months, the cost begins to add up to a fair amount, even for flake foods. Be aware that platies/swordtails do not nourish their young while they develop so I would not expect food quality to affect the fry much. The fry are simply protected eggs that are developing on their own, with no nourishment from the female. The only freshwater livebearers that I know of who do nourish their fry more or less like a land animal might, are the goodeid group. They do not use an umbilicus as we are accustomed to but a structure called trophotaenia that provide much the same ability to nourish the fry from the female. In those fish the diet of the female before a drop must be controlled to preclude birth difficulties. It turns out that a diet too high in protein can actually produce fry that the female has trouble giving birth to. Their fry are huge at birth, compared to the more common livebearers that you will find at the LFS. Some that I keep are born at about 2 cm long but there are only about 10 in a drop and the drops are over 2 months apart.
Backward swimming huh. I never considered that a way to sex swordtails but I guess it is as good as any other method before they start to show their gender with physical characteristics.
You will need to keep swordtail fry away from the parents until they are at least 2 cm long. I do not recall swordtail fry being a full cm at a drop but it has been while since I bred swordtails. In my own memories, swordtails were among the smallest of all fry in my tanks.

Thank you for the interesting information on fry development in the female.

Well, I never saw females swimming backwards like that, and I used to have a huge amount of them when I was a kid. Only males did that either in front of each other (some kind of sword-cross dance) or in front of a female, but usually curved trajectory.
Two of the fry are slim and do cross their tails while swimming backwards, which reminds me of my red wagtail and black berlin males from the past, whom used to do this kind of display dance to warn each other or to see who gets the females or something. Then there's that one fry, which I suspect of being a female due to being bigger and being the subject of one of the males' curved trajectory display (he swims backwards and courts her in front of the face).
My swordtail adult female has displayed a different kind of dance during fights over food with the male: she goes a bit to the side and shakes rapidly with all her fins spread, and if the male approaches, she hits him with the tail, similar to how bettas do when angry.

Not full but about that size of 1 cm (maybe 0.8 cm). All my orange ones were (at birth) as big as these are at the age of 1 week+. These latest fry were 0.5 cm at birth, and not much difference so far in their growth except that they look plumper and a bit longer. Plus that one of the lighter-colored fry gained more red lately while the other remained white.
Could the cage be restricting their growth? It seems to allow plenty of space to swim though.

 

[FishBlast]

Well, lost another one, the albino.
This morning I saw him showing a tint of red so he was going to be a red albino. He ate his morning meal and seemed ok, then few hours later I find him sitting still at the bottom of the net. He was dead.
His belly seemed to have a dark cut on the middle. I think he overate or something, but that seems impossible, I left no food there over night and he hasn't been eating since yesterday evening...

 

[FishBlast]

The calico isn't looking too well either today. He keeps his tail mostly down when he doesn't swim, although he is eating. -.- Looks like this batch isn't going to make it to adulthood. Wish I didn't leave the fry that swam right away in the main tank. I picked up the fry that sat on the ground all the time. -.-

 

[winkle]

Gutted for you some just aren't meant to make it.

 

[FishBlast]

Gutted for you some just aren't meant to make it.

He does seem to have a few genetic problems (black in tailfin... that can't be good.) but I was / still am hoping that he'd be a survivor since he was so hyperactive...
Now he looks as if he's very sad. Pinky is just pecking the net like crazy, very much contrast compared to Ninja, who is just sitting in the plant with his tail down.

Also, water changes didn't improve his state. -.- I don't know what he has, but I hope not a parasite (heard of fry with pin tail syndrome).

 

[FishBlast]

He's still alive, and looks better today. He's eating and is active, but now his tail went up As if it's attracted to the light LOL! Whole night he kept it low when there wasn't enough light.

An odd thing, his mother is the one who is sensitive to light. She will swim inclined with her back at the light if it's coming from the side and will also become aggressive if there's too much light.
The fry does almost same, only that it seems to be with the tail

 

[FishBlast]

The 2 remaining fry are now 3 weeks old... seems the one that looked like a calico is getting more black and less red. Might end up like a copy of his father -.- They haven't grown much though, still at 1 cm.
Pinky is becoming more red now too and seems to love grazing off the net. Ninja's eating only from the surface, he still likes to show off his tail to Pinky for some reason.

 

[FishBlast]

Almost a month old now (they were born on the 3rd of April). Pic where their mother appears under the net.

Cleaned their cage with a syringe, because they poo like crazy, also changed some of the water, tomorrow's the day for the bigger water change for the whole tank.
They seem to love egg yolk a lot and so do the other 3 adult fish.

 

[OldMan47]

A 3 weeks platy at only 1 cm is a bit on the small side but platy fry do start out very small at less than 0.5 cm if I recall correctly (I breed mostly wild type goodeids). That would mean a size doubling in only 3 weeks. Looked at that way they are growing very quickly indeed.

 

[FishBlast]

A 3 weeks platy at only 1 cm is a bit on the small side but platy fry do start out very small at less than 0.5 cm if I recall correctly (I breed mostly wild type goodeids). That would mean a size doubling in only 3 weeks. Looked at that way they are growing very quickly indeed.

They're swordtails.
Today they are 1.2 cm or so. They were around 0.5 cm when born. They will be 1 month old on the 3rd of May.
I hope the black one keeps the red face, looks so cute with it.
The other one is still more pink than red. I wonder if its genes will result in a pink swordie or it might look like its mother...

And from the two kinds of fry I've had before, guppies take the cake when it comes to growth. In just 2 weeks I already had them around the size of these. Swordtails on the other hand, I remember it once took me around 2 months to get them about 2 cm and they still could have very well fit into the two hoplos' mouths, but they ignored or even allowed fry to hide under them anyway so that wasn't a problem. Too bad I didn't have a lid over the tank then though... Lost them when they were so far...
I hope to see these grow to adult size.

Also, my teenage swordies don't seem to be growing any faster either, they're only a bit bigger than when I bought them (5 months ago).

 

[FishBlast]

Is it ok to put some of my ramshorn snails in the fry cage? They might clean up the plants in there and eat whatever falls on the net. They're all home-bred snails so I doubt they carry any parasites.

 

[OldMan47]

Swordies are definitely small at birth but they do grow up to be a nice size. Try feeding a bit more than you have been. Growth requires food and, as long as you do the water changes, keeping food in front of them at all times is a way to promote faster growth.

 

[FishBlast]

Swordies are definitely small at birth but they do grow up to be a nice size. Try feeding a bit more than you have been. Growth requires food and, as long as you do the water changes, keeping food in front of them at all times is a way to promote faster growth.

Yeah, they seem to be growing nicely now, and coloring up too.
I feed them around 3-4 times a day the equal of 1 flake each time (powdered). I leave it there for about 5 minutes, then I remove the powder off the surface.
For some odd reason, the black fry has a weird shaped tail, either it's the black amount of it giving that impression or he has some problem, as it looks quite pointy, but it's been like that for a week or more.

And I've added one ramshorn snail to the cage for some cleanup until tomorrow when I change more water and clean their cage again.