Figer 8 puffer

[PaintballFan07]

Hello All, My friend is planning on buying a figure 8 puffer and putting it in a 10g tank. I do not think this is enough space but i already told him this. He is also putting 2 red fin sharks in the 10g wich is difinately not enough space. Wat do u guys think about this?

 

[Jason_S]

tomorrow I'll hopefully be getting a F8 for my 10 gallon. I've heard many times from puffer enthusiasts whom I trust that a 10 gallon for a single F8 is fine. The only thing is in a smaller tank like a 10 gallon it's even more important to stay on top of water changes and filtration as the water will foul more quickly in a 10 gallon as opposed to a 20 or 29 gallon.

 

[Lexie3787]

Ahh don't put a F8 in a 10 gallon. They need atleast a 29 gallon. And they are very hard to put with other types of fish.

 

[stellablu]

A 20g long tank is adequate for one Figure Eight.

 

[Jason_S]

I'm not sure if anyone here knows her, but PufferPunk is one of the leading internet experts on Puffers as is Robert T. Ricketts (known on the net as RTR). Both RTR and Pufferpunk recommend 1 Figure 8 puffer per 10 gallons of water, meaning that 1 F8 will be fine in a 10 gallon so long as the water parameters are kept in check. Here are a few examples where you'll see that 10 gallons is fine for 1 F8 puffer. These puffers only grow to ~3" or slightly less, so I don't see why much larger than 10 gallons would be absolutely necessary for a 3" fish.


See the third post down by PufferPunk

3 Figure 8's are recommended for a 29 gallon here

Here it is recommended to keep 1 F8 per 10 gallons

 

[stellablu]

I do know Pufferpunk, she is a current on another forum I frequent, but with all respect I wouldn't go on that third post where one person mentions the 1 per 10g.

The sad thing about forums, websites, and I'm learning even books is that information is varied upon the author. It is better to do your research, taking in advice from experience, but also using as many references as possible. There are so many people on forums who consider themselves experts...in my opinion and personal experience, I have found some of these people to be wrong on many occasions. We're all human and none of us agree on anything.

Some people keep F8's in 10g per fish, others prefer to give them the space and exploring room of a 20g long. (From my experience you can keep gobies with F8's in the 20g without problems, whereas I found it troublesome in a 10g) It can be frustrating to have one person claim they do something a certain way with success and have been for 15 years and also have another person claim the opposite with same success for the same amount of time. It could drive a person insane...and yet we still ask for advice from faceless strangers...heh

Here is a site run by Pufferpunk that states basically my point in keeping them in at least a 20g. Puffernet - F8 Puffer If you're like me you want to get the most out of your tank, meaning more fish to make it look fuller instead of a desolate puffer. It just makes it look more like an environment instead of a fishbowl

(Geeez, I hope I didn't go off topic...sorry)

 

[Jason_S]

true, everyone will have their own opinions on things...that I do agree with. All I can tell you is I've been involved on forums for years where Pufferpunk posts and have yet to see any misinformation from her. Also, puffernet is not her website. If you look here you'll see the credits for the puffernet.tripod site. You'll notice

Website design and content: Frederick L. Calalang c.2001.

In fact I've seen many times where Pufferpunk and others have exclaimed their displeasure with a lot of the misinformation given on the puffernet site. Pufferpunk's site is here. In the brackish forum you'll find pinned at the top a link to an article written by RTR (Robert T. Ricketts) from his many years of experience with the Figure 8 puffer. He also recommends a minimum of 1 F8 per 10 gallons.

Am I saying that F8's wouldn't appreciate the extra space...absolutely not. I'll always stand by the statement that a bigger tank is always better. However, as these experts have said over and over again, 10 gallons is fine for 1 figure 8 puffer. If mine (which I just got today) at any time appears to be cramped or look like it needs more space I will without hesitation get a larger tank ready for it. In the meantime though, it will continue to reside in my 10 gallon. B)

 

[pica_nuttalli]

are red fins brackish? that's the biggest issue.

probably you can keep a f8 in a 10 gallon, but i think the presumption there is that it is ONE f8 in IDEAL conditions.

since ideal conditions for f8s are very clean, brackish water... your friend may be setting himself up for a sad surprise.

is there a particular reason he's so keen on these fish? if that's the case, convince him to upgrade the tank size unless he wants to be measuring salt once a week. you may also want to explain how a puffer can still chow down on a rather fast fish if there isn't any room to run away.

if he's just wanting a puffer and something fast swimming, try talking him into maybe a dwarf or two. they're purely freshwater and reportedly quite hardy. so long as your friend is ok with a little carnage, get a bunch of platies to put in with them. platies are quick-swimming, cheap, colorful in the same way as red-fins, and prolific. think of it as a snack machine of sorts.

any of the PLAIN livebearers would make an excellent feeder/companion for a f8, so long as they were properly acclimitized. most common livebearers like a bit of salt and are harder to prevent breeding rather than otherwise. obviously don't buy balloon mollies or guppies with beautiful fantails--they're too slow, you'll run out. the regular molly and any lyretailed guppy should be fast enough to keep out of the way and drop some slow-moving fry.

i've seen a f8 turn anorexic and waste away in an LFS 10 gallon. puffers are very intelligent fish and perfectly capable of suiciding when overly stressed and bored. they need good water and things to hunt (fish, snails, etc.) to be "happy". a "happy" puffer will live for easily 10 years, and an "unhappy" puffer might not make it past three.

and as always... don't put it with a puffer unless it's ok to be eaten.

 

[Lexie3787]

Im still sticking with larger than a 10 gallon. You did post it here, and people did respond with their opinions, personal experience etc etc. I wouldn't get a f8 for a 10 gallon, i'd rather my puffer be happy. Think of the fish...not of what your friend personally wants to do.

 

[Erised]

Both RTR and Pufferpunk recommend 1 Figure 8 puffer per 10 gallons of water

If you're ok with giving your fish just enough water for them to be ok in, rather than given them a bit more then it is indeed true. Which means that in a 30G you could keep 3 figure eights. However, being able to keep 1 f8 per 10G doesnt mean you can keep 1 in a 10G. Not because of their size, but because its a real pain in the a$$ to keep a tank like that on the correct salt level and to keep it clean enough with a puffer in it.

I take you have a hydrometer? If not, you really gotta get one and keep a very close look on the salt level in the water ... you'll probably have to do water changes to keep the salt up every 2 or 3 days. Better of getting a 20G and keep 2 figure eights in there then

 

[stellablu]

Yes, good points. The larger the tank the easier to keep the perimeters stable...this is especially true if this is the first brackish tank you've worked with...

Sorry about the wrong website. I just remember her giving that address several times and must have mistaken her saying that was her site with her forums. Also I never said anything about Pufferpunk giving misinformation; it was a generalization about "experts" on forums altogether.

 

[Jason_S]

If you're ok with giving your fish just enough water for them to be ok in, rather than given them a bit more then it is indeed true.

With all the people that keep and recommend keeping fish such as Oscars in 50 and 55 gallon tanks, I don't see how keeping 1 fish that will grow to no more than 3" in a 10 gallon tank is just enough water for them to be ok in.

However, being able to keep 1 f8 per 10G doesnt mean you can keep 1 in a 10G.

Both PufferPunk and RTR have said 1 F8 per 10G and that 1 F8 would be perfectly fine in a 10G.


As for keeping water parameters stable in a 10 gallon, I definitely agree that it will be more difficult than in a smaller tank. I have the utmost confidence that I can keep the tank in good condition for the F8. However I wouldn't recommend to someone new to the hobby to attempt to keep a 10 gallon in good condition for a fish as sensitive as a puffer.

So, back to the original question by Paintballfan, if your friend has been keeping fish for a long time and has plenty of experience keeping good water quality in his fish tanks over a long period of time then he may be ok with the F8 in a 10G. However, if he is not experienced in the hobby or if this is his first tank/fish then this is a really bad idea. B)

 

[stellablu]

So, back to the original question by Paintballfan, if your friend has been keeping fish for a long time and has plenty of experience keeping good water quality in his fish tanks over a long period of time then he may be ok with the F8 in a 10G. However, if he is not experienced in the hobby or if this is his first tank/fish then this is a really bad idea.

Here, here!

Now let's move on, hehe

 

[PaintballFan07]

are red fins brackish? that's the biggest issue.

probably you can keep a f8 in a 10 gallon, but i think the presumption there is that it is ONE f8 in IDEAL conditions.

since ideal conditions for f8s are very clean, brackish water... your friend may be setting himself up for a sad surprise.

is there a particular reason he's so keen on these fish? if that's the case, convince him to upgrade the tank size unless he wants to be measuring salt once a week. you may also want to explain how a puffer can still chow down on a rather fast fish if there isn't any room to run away.

if he's just wanting a puffer and something fast swimming, try talking him into maybe a dwarf or two. they're purely freshwater and reportedly quite hardy. so long as your friend is ok with a little carnage, get a bunch of platies to put in with them. platies are quick-swimming, cheap, colorful in the same way as red-fins, and prolific. think of it as a snack machine of sorts.

any of the PLAIN livebearers would make an excellent feeder/companion for a f8, so long as they were properly acclimitized. most common livebearers like a bit of salt and are harder to prevent breeding rather than otherwise. obviously don't buy balloon mollies or guppies with beautiful fantails--they're too slow, you'll run out. the regular molly and any lyretailed guppy should be fast enough to keep out of the way and drop some slow-moving fry.

i've seen a f8 turn anorexic and waste away in an LFS 10 gallon. puffers are very intelligent fish and perfectly capable of suiciding when overly stressed and bored. they need good water and things to hunt (fish, snails, etc.) to be "happy". a "happy" puffer will live for easily 10 years, and an "unhappy" puffer might not make it past three.

and as always... don't put it with a puffer unless it's ok to be eaten.

My friend has 2 red fin sharks in his 55g with 12 1" red belly piranha's. It has been in with the rbp's for 3 weeks and have been doing well. My friend is a newb when it comes to fish keeping n thinks he knows everything about fish. I tried to tell him that it wouldnt work out but he argued with me that he knew wat he was doing. I have more than 7yrs worth of fish keeping experience n he has no more than a month of experience.

 

[PaintballFan07]

If you're ok with giving your fish just enough water for them to be ok in, rather than given them a bit more then it is indeed true.

With all the people that keep and recommend keeping fish such as Oscars in 50 and 55 gallon tanks, I don't see how keeping 1 fish that will grow to no more than 3" in a 10 gallon tank is just enough water for them to be ok in.

However, being able to keep 1 f8 per 10G doesnt mean you can keep 1 in a 10G.

Both PufferPunk and RTR have said 1 F8 per 10G and that 1 F8 would be perfectly fine in a 10G.


As for keeping water parameters stable in a 10 gallon, I definitely agree that it will be more difficult than in a smaller tank. I have the utmost confidence that I can keep the tank in good condition for the F8. However I wouldn't recommend to someone new to the hobby to attempt to keep a 10 gallon in good condition for a fish as sensitive as a puffer.

So, back to the original question by Paintballfan, if your friend has been keeping fish for a long time and has plenty of experience keeping good water quality in his fish tanks over a long period of time then he may be ok with the F8 in a 10G. However, if he is not experienced in the hobby or if this is his first tank/fish then this is a really bad idea. B)

So, back to the original question by Paintballfan, if your friend has been keeping fish for a long time and has plenty of experience keeping good water quality in his fish tanks over a long period of time then he may be ok with the F8 in a 10G. However, if he is not experienced in the hobby or if this is his first tank/fish then this is a really bad idea. B)

Nope dude has no mroe than 1 month of experience.