Ever Hear Of This?

[GuppyDude]

Alright, last year around october or november (i dont recall) i received a royal blue copper hm female free with the purchase of another unrelated fish. she was very small probably only 4 months old, but i saw an oviposture and know it was a girl. being as small as she was she survived in my female betta community up until she got bigger and developed a problem with aggression (which pretty much ruined my community). now i dont check my girls for an ovi posture regularly, i check when i get them and thats it, but resently i noticed that this girl no log has hers... i didn't think anything of it (nor did i connect her agression problems with it) but now she is blowing bubble nests after being placed in view of a female she is displaying all the mateing habits of a male and appears to be very defensive toward anything that enters her box (includeing me). i know that female bettas have been knwon to blow bubble nests but never have i every seen a female so agressive and defensive of a nest. my only conclusion is that she has become a male. has anyone ever heard of something like this happening?

NOTE: i did see an ovi posture on her at some point i remember. and i have contacted the breeder of teh fish to let them know what had happend, and they are just as puzzled, none of teh other fish from that spawn seem to show these odd symptoms. they did send me a photo of teh fish before it was shipped to me (obviously they catalog all their fish before selling them ) and i saw an ovi posture! im very confused, anyone wanna shine some light on this situation for me, i cant find a whole lot on the .net about this .

 

[Kiarra]

Bettas cannot change sex. But young males will from time to time have an ovipositor, and look and act quite female. But...they're still boys, and they've always been boys. So I'd say you just have a late-developing male.

 

[GuppyDude]

iv never heard of that or would have thoght of that, but that could quite possibley be the case, but what about teh finage, wouldn't a male hm have long brilliant finage? this fish has short female like finage...?

 

[xanthianacid]

That behaviour can be cross sexes, that is building bubble nests and aggression. However a female won't have an extra flap of skin at the gills, that will only appear on a male, and another way to tell sexes physically. When he/she flares does it exhibit that? My most aggressive female tries to flare but can't like a male.

However, it makes me wonder if its possible for a little betta to be of both sexes, just like humans and other animals do?

 

[Synirr]

However a female won't have an extra flap of skin at the gills, that will only appear on a male, and another way to tell sexes physically.

Actually, females DO have a gillflap, it's just smaller than a male's. My Mini displays hers when flaring, and she has laid eggs which are now healthy fry, so I know this to be true

Female bettas can become males. There are documented cases, and I've read several betta books which mention it. Many (maybe all?) fish don't have specific sex chromosomes like we mammals do, and their genders can even be partially determined by things like pH and age of the parents (a young male betta breeding with an old female will produce a mostly male spawn.) If a female betta's ovaries are damaged for whatever reason, she will become a fully functioning male

 

[Kiarra]

Well, I hadn't heard that in relation to Bettas. Mostly livebearers and amphibians. But it's still much more likely to be a late-developing male.

 

[Synirr]

But it's still much more likely to be a late-developing male.

Agreed

 

[GuppyDude]

it had to of been a female at some point, it is an hm, am i correct in saying that male hms have rather large finage? this betta has teh finage of a female. and i know that both sexes of the species displays nesting and agressive behavior but this girl has at some point lost her ovi posture and become a male. a late developeing male (thogh late developeing) would in therory have correct male hm finage right? i dunno this is screwed up what ever teh case, the fish is a male now

its accually not too hard to imagine a betta changeing sexes like an amphibian, bettas and other air breathing fish are the link between anphibians and fish, i wonder if bettas will evolve into amphibians some day...

 

[D Chia]

Female bettas can become males. There are documented cases, and I've read several betta books which mention it. Many (maybe all?) fish don't have specific sex chromosomes like we mammals do, and their genders can even be partially determined by things like pH and age of the parents (a young male betta breeding with an old female will produce a mostly male spawn.) If a female betta's ovaries are damaged for whatever reason, she will become a fully functioning male

It's found on page 15 of Dr Goldstein's book, Bettas: A Complete Pet Owners's Manual. He also cited an interesting research by Dr Lucas in the paragraph.

"There are no unequal chromosomes in bettas that might be sex chromosomes. However bettas seem to follow the XX, XY model since they normally produce 50 percent of each sex. Bettas can produce surprises. If young males are bred with old females, the resulting offspring are mostly males. If the fry are held at abnormal conditions during the first 6 weeks, an overwhelming percentage of males is again produced. And if females are partially ovariectomized (most of the ovaries cut away), they transform into fully functional males (Lucas, 1983)."

However, Dr Goldstein did not disclose details about those altered conditions. The following website sells a solution that increases the percentage of males from a single spawn (usually 50%) to 95%. I've not tried this product before but I believe it prevents the development of the reproductive system of the female fry and causes them to "transform" into males.

http/www.geocities.com/kaiaikmarine/bss.

So, according to Dr Goldstein and Dr Lucas, sex change in bettas can occur as a result of placing the fry in altered conditions in the initial weeks or it could be done deliberately by surgery.

Amazing isn't it?

 

[GuppyDude]

yea it is! i didn't breed her myself, so its not my fault she became a he im sure glad its not something i did thogh, i was thinking the whole time that i may have hurt her with the net or something that would have damaged her.

ok now iv got a question, would this fish be safe to breed? she/he is a very nice fish (a little squawny) but still has good genes.

 

[D Chia]

Place the pair in full view of each other. If she shows the vertical bars (i.e. willingness to spawn) and "he" blows a huge bubblenest, it would mean that "he" has got the mojo and is truly male.

 

[GuppyDude]

done it, thats what leads me to beleive he is a male, there a bubble nest roughly 5"x5" in his container and his colors do seem much lighter than useraly, but still his normal self thanx for all the help folks

 

[leasbettas]

has anyone said that it could be a plakat male thats why it hasnt got long fins?

 

[Synirr]

If you want to try breeding it, go right ahead... there's a chance it may be sterile, but it is probably a fully functioning male if everything you say is true. Sex change or not, good genes are good genes

 

[alabaster]

The explanation is probably that it is a plakat. Even if it's parents were veiltails they could have plakat genes, so its much more likely that your "female" is a male than it changed sexes.