diatom problems

[ILikeVoltron]

Sorry about cross-posting this, but basically after 50 views and no responses, I don't think anybody noticed my post dirty gravel (all the way at the bottom)

QUOTE (Bol @ May 14 2004, 04:49 PM)

The first thing I'd check with the gravel is, is the new brown color kind of a slimy coating, that rubs off easily?

If so, what you most likely have is an outbreak of diatoms (sometimes called 'diatom algae'). It's pretty common in newer tanks (I usually see it in my tanks about ... four to seven weeks after cycling is complete). Also happens in low-light tanks.

It's not harmful to the fish, and usually goes away without any intervention as the tank matures, in my experience. Also, otos like to munch it off of rocks and glass -- not sure about gravel, though.

About the snail, were the bloodworms live?
Also, if you put any live plants in the tank, chances are good that's where the snail came from (eggs on the plants).

A few snails can be beneficial, but too many can be a hassle, in my opinion. If you do have a couple of snails (I'm assuming they're the plain old 'pond snails'), they'll be a sure-fire indicator if you're overfeeding your fish. If you overfeed, chances are you'll fairly suddenly see that you have dozens and dozens of snails.

I've got the same problem with the Alge. Its just as you describe it 'diatoms.' Although I've had it for quite some time now, several months in fact. I am starting to get a little worried about it as I have no started buying water from a shop that uses RO water. I was using tap water at first (the local water is pretty clean) then I started using bottled water, and now the Shops water.

I've also tested for phosphates, pH and salinity, all testing fine. How long will it take now to get rid of this stuff?

My tank -- 29 Gallons, "Compact fluorescent 65watt BLUE JBJ" and "Compact fluorescent 65watt DAYLIGHT JBJ", got some 'substraight in a bag', and about 20lbs of liverock in there right now. I'm using the Emperor 200 or 280 hang on filter, with a single power head.

Also, the 'diatoms' completly cover my rock and I can even see small air bubbles forming under it, and under some of the substraight.

Please help


fyi: this is a saltwater tank

 

[Hazmat]

Few questions first... how long has your tank been set up?
Do you have any fish or inverts in it? Is their direct sunlight from a window
on your tank?
The filter you have may not be adiquit for a saltwater tank and using tap water my have kept puting your tank into a cycle.


Hazmat

 

[ILikeVoltron]

Few questions first... how long has your tank been set up?
Do you have any fish or inverts in it? Is their direct sunlight from a window
on your tank?
The filter you have may not be adiquit for a saltwater tank and using tap water my have kept puting your tank into a cycle.


Hazmat

Few questions first... how long has your tank been set up?

Several months, like.. perhaps, 4-5

Do you have any fish or inverts in it? Is their direct sunlight from a window

No, and no. The tank is not near direct sunlight. I won't put anything that could die in the tank if i'm not sure its going to live. Also, the only light problem I can imagine is the fact that I have a glass cover on the top of the tank, below the lamp. This glass cover gets a bit of evaporated salt on it. I clean it up every week or so, but its alot of work to do it everyday.

The filter you have may not be adiquit for a saltwater tank and using tap water my have kept puting your tank into a cycle.

Hmm, how sure are you about that filter not being enough? I was told by both the shop owner and a employee that it should work, as he said, "Thats your chemical and mechanical filter, the other would be your rock, ie: biological filter"

edit: I'm not sure if he said that was my chemical filter or not.. i think so though.

As far as the cycle go's, so by using tap water for so long, I may have been prolonging the cycle of alge growth?

Thanks in advance

 

[Hazmat]

Not saying the filter is the problem.... I ran a 60 gallon FOWLR with an Emperor 400 for 4 months and it did ok but then i got a mag 350 canister and ran both. The ideal filter for a saltwater tank is to have a wet/dry sump tank with a protien skimmer. I would let it be for now (filter) and see how it does with the RO water changes. The glass cover issue is no big deal... we all have to put up with salt build up in the marine world

Good luck
Hazmat

 

[Fuzzy]

what is ur lighting? i had diatom algae to, then someone told me my lighting was to low so i got more powerful lights and now the problem is gone

 

[ostrow]

Diatoms are a natural part of the cycle process and it is occurring at exactly the expected time. I would be concerned about lack of flow and lack of a skimmer, if I understand your setup properly. The lighting may be part of the problem.

If what you have on the surfaces is bubbling, the odds are it is cyanobacteria and not diatoms. If you get a turkey baster, or even using your hands, does it lift up in sheets? If so, you have a cyano outbreak and flow, lighting, nitrates and phosphates are almost certain to blame. RO/DI will help but you would have to keep sucking out what you can for a while. Eventually it'll go away. Search here on cyanobacteria for many strategies for combatting it.

 

[ILikeVoltron]

lionfish:

what is ur lighting? i had diatom algae to, then someone told me my lighting was to low so i got more powerful lights and now the problem is gone

reading the parent post might answer your questions

My tank -- 29 Gallons, "Compact fluorescent 65watt BLUE JBJ" and "Compact fluorescent 65watt DAYLIGHT JBJ", got some 'substraight in a bag', and about 20lbs of liverock in there right now. I'm using the Emperor 200 or 280 hang on filter, with a single power head.

ostrow:

Diatoms are a natural part of the cycle process and it is occurring at exactly the expected time.

All sources I've read say it takes 4-8 weeks. My tank has been running for over 3 months.

If what you have on the surfaces is bubbling, the odds are it is cyanobacteria and not diatoms. If you get a turkey baster, or even using your hands, does it lift up in sheets? If so, you have a cyano outbreak and flow, lighting, nitrates and phosphates are almost certain to blame.

I posted in the parent post,

I've also tested for phosphates, pH and salinity, all testing fine.

I guess I'll test for nitrates as well. For this 29 Gallon tank, are the two 65watt lights not enough? I was under the impression they were. Also, from other well to do tanks I've seen, the ammount of flow in my tank looks fine... But thats just my observation.

Thanks for all the help guys (and girls).

 

[impur]

I would say your problem is phosphates. The reason they are not showing up on tests is that they are being consumed by the algae at the source, therefore not showing up in the water column. Keep using the RO water and if possible get RO/DI. You also need to topoff with strictly RO/DI.

Another thing i would suggest as ostrow did is up the flow in your tank. You could also consider a phosphate removing media such as rowaphos or chemi-pure. I have not used rowaphos though i hear excellent things about it. I do use chemi-pure and the stuff is great.

 

[ostrow]

Impur beat me to it. Exactly right. And you didn't answer my questions relating to cyano. This may not be diatoms at all.

As for flow, you don't say what your flow is ... what powerhead, what is the flow from the emperor?

 

[ILikeVoltron]

Impur beat me to it. Exactly right. And you didn't answer my questions relating to cyano. This may not be diatoms at all.

As for flow, you don't say what your flow is ... what powerhead, what is the flow from the emperor?

Its a emperor 280. So, 280GPH. There are two powerheads, both of them wallmart ones, and I'm not sure on the exact output, but it pushes the water all the way to the end of the tank with enough umpf to cause it to circle back to the front of the tank. I have considered buying one of those spiffy ones with the little nozzle you can direct, does anybody have a model they would reccomend. I think I saw one at my LFS for $26.

also, fyi: I did another water change yesterday with some RO water I got from my local shop. Also cleaned up the glass cover. I was thinking about getting one or two of those snails that are susposed to love this stuff.

again, thanks for all the help!

 

[ostrow]

Which snails you bought would depend on what you have and you still haven't convinced me you have diatoms rather than cyanobacteria. My hunch is it is cyano.

You ought to get a small RO/DI unit of your own. Will save you money over buying the water all the time. People sell them used all the time on reefcentral, you probably have a club in your area with a forum on that site where you could pick one up. That would solve a lot of your problems quickly.

 

[ILikeVoltron]

I was looking at some RO/DI units on ebay and found some apparently very good units for as little as $60.

RO/DI Unit on ebay

that one sold for $76, much cheeper then the $200 I was quoted for at a LFS (however, I don't know what brand he was refering too he just mentioned that we sell a small one for that much)

Also, I'm not trying to convince you its _not_ diatoms just thats what it looked like to me at first glance (and reading some other similar problems)

But the solution for both problems is the same (as I understand it) cycle my water. I also bought a bottle of "chem-pure" and was considering using it. I'd prefer to have the tank clean itself then have to use chemicals.. but thats just the concept I would like to portray into my tank.. its own eco system with as little human chemical intervention as possible.

again, thanks in advance.

 

[ostrow]

Actually the solutions are not the same if you want to intervene to speed up the cycle and get rid of the stuff. This is particularly the case if you are wanting critters to eat the stuff/prevent a return. Fighting conch are the best cyano defeaters by far but will do nothing against diatoms.

Those are good ro/di units.

I agree totally re: the chemicals. They did nothing for me vs. cyano. Microbe-lift Special Blend did, though.