Cycling Question

[EmmaNic286]

At the start of a cycle does it make a big difference as to how quickly ammonia levels go up on a daily basis if you reduce how much food you give your fish? Say by about half?

Right now my family's aquarium is at at the start of a cycle. But as we're in the unlucky situation of having to do a cycle with 2 fish (1 Black Skirt tetra and one Plecostomus) in our tank we started to reduce their feeding some days ago and have been also been doing our best to keep ammonia levels low (which we've been doing since last week when our internal filter was first installed) so they're given the best chance possible of surviving the process. This didn't appear to lead to any immediate difference - as a number of tests done between last Wednesday and this Monday afternoon consistently showed ammonia levels were constantly increasing at a pretty fast rate. But since that same Monday afternoon this appears to have suddenly stopped! Test results are now showing the ammonia since then hasn't been going up. This has struck me as really strange - considering I can clearly see there is a certain amount of waste in the water right now, and there is still no nitrite in the water either - at least according to my test results (though there is quite a bit of nitrate in there right now as this is from our tap water). This is telling me the sudden drop in ammonia increase must be down to something else other than related bacteria growth.

The only two possible explanations I can think of as being the cause is that either my liquid test kit has suddenly gone funny (though strikes me as very unlikely as it's appeared to be working fine up until now) or else this is down to having reduced fish feeding which has slowed down the ammonia build up. Being a beginner though I'm only guessing - and realise for all I know there's other possible explanations I'm not thinking of.

Would be really grateful for anyone's input - if anybody has any and would be happy to share

Many thanks for reading

Emma

 

[JMcQueen]

Reducing food will help but not significantly. The only way to really control the ammonia with fish in cycles is to do vast water changes (talking 60-90%) on a regular (daily) basis. The only way reducing food helps is by reducing the ammonia produced as fish digest and expel waste and the uneaten food that eventually breaks down and forms additional pollutants.

Its big water changes and often as a rule of thumb.

Out of interest, what levels of ammonia are we talking? Anything other than 0.0 is harmful to the fish though and WILL eventually result in damage/death.

 

[Timmy_Bee]

Also read up about how to gravel-vac if you havent done so already. This is a much more affective way of reducing levels and keeping your tank looking clean and tidy

 

[EmmaNic286]

Reducing food will help but not significantly. The only way to really control the ammonia with fish in cycles is to do vast water changes (talking 60-90%) on a regular (daily) basis. The only way reducing food helps is by reducing the ammonia produced as fish digest and expel waste and the uneaten food that eventually breaks down and forms additional pollutants.

Its big water changes and often as a rule of thumb.

Out of interest, what levels of ammonia are we talking? Anything other than 0.0 is harmful to the fish though and WILL eventually result in damage/death.

Many thanks for confirming that on the feeding. Much appreciated.

On the water change thing - that's exactly why I'm so confused! Normally if ammonia levels were constantly going up - you would be totally right. Big water changes would be needed to remove it and help keep levels in the tank to 0. And between last week (since the day I was able to first test for ammonia) this is just what myself and another family member have been doing. Between last Thursday and this Monday afternoon we've been monitoring the water on a daily basis via testing. It consistently showed ammonia levels were increasing in some quantity on a daily basis - each time it did we performed the needed water change amount to get it down to 0.

However now the test results have suddenly changed! Between Monday afternoon and early this morning they've been saying the ammonia has stayed at 0 - which has been telling me since Monday afternoon there's been no ammonia to clear out of there through further daily water changes - if you see what I mean? In terms of the fish's health, agreed - that's most definitely not a bad thing. But at the same time - at such an early part of the aquarium cycle - this is not natural. Because the right bacteria haven't yet grown to start breaking it down into Nitrite. So unless my master liquid test kit has somehow gone wrong and is showing incorrect results (which I really don't see as being likely) something has suddenly happened to either stop the natural ammonia increases in the tank - or at least dramatically slow them down, which has nothing to do with water changes. But I'm really having a hard time working out what that is!

Again, unless this is somehow down to my liquid test kit somehow going wrong, I just don't get what's caused the sudden change in test results!

Out of interest, what levels of ammonia are we talking? Anything other than 0.0 is harmful to the fish though and WILL eventually result in damage/death.

Last time I tested, which was around 8.30 am where I am today, the result read 0. This was despite it being around 43 hours since the last water change was done to keep ammonia levels down.

@ Timmy Bee many thanks for the tip! This is something I'm already doing whenever I do a water change - but many thanks for the mention anyways.

 

[anon02]

If you have fish in the tank they will produce ammonia through respiration as well as excretion, so perhaps the rising levels of ammonia were due to overfeeding or decaying plantstuff ?

Do you have any plants in your tank ? plants can use up ammonia

Are you testing for nitrites and nitrates regularly ?

Dont discount the possibility that you do have bacteria

Whatever I would proceed as indicated by the test results

 

[EmmaNic286]

Just did another test. Result is still the same! And it's now just over 48 hours since the last water change!

If you have fish in the tank they will produce ammonia through respiration as well as excretion, so perhaps the rising levels of ammonia were due to overfeeding or decaying plantstuff ?

Do you have any plants in your tank ? plants can use up ammonia

Are you testing for nitrites and nitrates regularly ?

Dont discount the possibility that you do have bacteria

Whatever I would proceed as indicated by the test results

Hey there Anon

Many thanks for your input there. We only have plastic plants right now, so don't think it's anything to do with them - though then maybe I'm wrong there. But has occurred to me, after what you said on stuff decaying, there's a good chance too much decaying food was in the tank before which could have been responsible for the extra ammonia increase (as not too long ago we had 3 fish's rather than 2 - and just before one of them died he wasn't showing much of an appetite and neither was the other tetra at one stage) and also thinking you made a good point there on the bacteria. Maybe even though there's no nitrite registering on the kit result right now, and though the tank has only been at the start of the cycle for 7 days, some have already grown. I guess it is always possible!

Anyways will definitely do as the test kit results dictate for now. Thanks again!

 

[anon02]

What size tank do you have btw, 2 fish wold take a lot longer to pollute a large volume of water than a much smaller volume

 

[EmmaNic286]

What size tank do you have btw, 2 fish wold take a lot longer to pollute a large volume of water than a much smaller volume

Can't remember the exact tank measurements. A member of my family did tell me but have since forgotten. I can tell you that the volume of water is around 15 litres though. The tank is one of those small hexagon shaped types. Like this image shows below:

Hope that helps!

 

[anon02]

At 4 US gallons it wouldn`t take much to pollute

It wont take much to stock either, 4 inches of fish !!!

 

[EmmaNic286]

Totally agree! Which is another reason why the situation with the ammonia levels as it is right now seems as strange to me as it does!Still hopefully further testing will reveal more over the next day or two!

 

[EmmaNic286]

Well it's looking like the answer to what's happened has finally become clear! I tested the water again for both ammonia and nitrite this morning! Again the master kit results showed there was no ammonia. But this time the nitrite result showed up as 0.25! According to strip test kit results there is still no Nitrite. But I'm inclined to believe the master kit test results. Thinking at this stage there's little doubt the aquarium must have already reached the second stage of its cycle - which is why the ammonia levels suddenly dropped out of the blue! I'm pretty surprised as I thought it would take at least another week - if not longer than that - for that to happen. But at the same time I'm not complaining! The sooner the tank is properly cycled the better from my point of view.

Thanks again to everyone who took the time to reply in here! Much appreciated.

 

[EmmaNic286]

I spoke far too soon! Since my last post things have got very weird again!

I did another nitrite test - using my API test kit - a few hours since the last one I mentioned in my last post, expecting that it would be at least the same - if not higher - than before, believing it was pretty much a certainty I'd have to do a water change. Now my result is saying there is none in there! This morning the colour showed up as a light purple which indicated 0.25. Since it's been showing as pale blue which indicates 0!
I also re-tested this evening but the result is still showing up as pale blue. I know I definitely did not imagine this morning's results so this is making absolutely no sense!

I'm wondering if at this stage nitrite levels are high but off the chart. Though would have thought the test mixture would have instantly turned purple then blue during the 5 minute wait (as have heard that kind of thing can happen) if that was the case. The only other thing I can think of that might have caused something like this was adding in a little Tetra Safestart not long before the cycle started - in an attempt to help it along that little bit extra faster. Though didn't expect anything like this to happen! I've also read online today Safestart can give false test readings. Am really hoping this is not what's been going on. Am feeling so confused as to what to think right now!

 

[coldcazzie]

It is possible that there were some bacteria already present before you put the filter in - after all the fish were in there for a long time before the tank was passed to you, and one way or another the tank will have cycled - it's just the previous owners will have known nothing about it. So, it's possible that there is a small amount of bacteria present on gravel/decor which is handling the ammonia present from the fish, and that the extra was because of food etc decaying. Or, that could be a load of tripe and there could be a third factor involved. Whatever it is, the basic rule is, if you get a positive reading on either ammonia or nitrite then water change to get it back to 0. If it takes a few days to see that, then fair enough, but still test daily at this stage. Also, I believe 1ppm of ammonia turns into about 2.7ppm of nitrite... (if I remember correctly) so, if the filter had been processing ammonia at this stage, but not nitrite, I'm pretty sure you would have seen a bigger peak of nitrite than 0.25ppm. However, if the test is in fact turning grey, rather than blue, then that is an indication that it's off the chart nitrite, in which case water change like your life (or, in fact, the fishes lives) depends upon it!

Sorry can't say more, baby needs boob!

 

[EmmaNic286]

Many thanks for your response Coldcazzie! That's a good point on the bacteria - could have well been the case there were already some present on the gravel/decor before the filter was put in, and it's now taking care of the ammonia. Maybe it's also a similiar situation with nitrite eating bacteria too. Though must say I've not noticed any signs of nitrate levels going up above their usual level. Will definitely continue to test daily - and thanks for the mention
on the grey colour aspect of Nitrite testing. I will look out for that in case it happens at any stage.

 

[anon02]

Have you tested for nitrate ?