Cycling: Am I Doing Something Wrong?

[lillykinloo]

Hi everyone! I'm currently cycling my fish tank using fish (I know I definitely should have done the fishless method, but I started cycling with fish before doing my research) I have a 37 gallon tank with 5 Diamond Tetras. I've had the tetras in the tank for about 1.5 weeks, and I've been doing 20% water changes on a daily basis to try to make this process as easy on the fish as possible. I test my water each day before changing the water. Today, these were my readings:

Ammonia: 0.5
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0

Should I have Nitrite readings by now? I've been getting 0.25-0.5 reading for Ammonia for about 8 days now. Am I doing something wrong, or will it just take awhile? Thanks!

 

[bobbicus]

these water changes everyday are not allowing the ammonia to build up in order to attract bacteria to break it down resulting in nitrItes

i know why ur doing daily w/c's but this is RELALY slowing ur cycling down......also it may not actually be enough stock to produce the level of ammonia needed in ur tank to initiate bacteria growth

 

[lillykinloo]

these water changes everyday are not allowing the ammonia to build up in order to attract bacteria to break it down resulting in nitrItes

i know why ur doing daily w/c's but this is RELALY slowing ur cycling down......also it may not actually be enough stock to produce the level of ammonia needed in ur tank to initiate bacteria growth

Thanks Rob w! Actually, I started doing the water changes because I thought this would help me keep the fish alive. So, I guess I need to stop the daily water changes. At what point does the Ammonia become lethal to the fish? (I guess I should wait and change the water when it gets closer to the lethal level?)

 

[bobbicus]

well REALLY any level is NO GOOD - but when we use fish this is inevitable!!!!

we just have to hope that as the cycle continues and we do "some" w/c's during it - the fish survive

i cycled with 7 danios and they survived - and still have them

to make it "easier" on them i made sure of over filtration and a good air stone

rob

 

[TerraDreamer]

I 100% agree with Rob; cut back on the water changes. If you're reading 0.5 ammonia from a color card, this is not lethal to fish, but of course it does introduce stress. Feed lightly, every two days. Do a 25% water change when you reach 1.0. Most kits measure total disolved ammonia, but the lethal ammonia is approximately one percent of the total disolved, given pH and temperature. Water changes will slow the cycle process. If your fish are fine, active, breathing normally and eating when fed, you're on the right path. If your ammonia does gets out of hand, add Ammo Lock. This will not interfere with the cycle process and render lethal ammonia harmless. 1.5 weeks is hardly into the fish cycle process. Expect 4 to 6 weeks for it to complete. Watch for your Nitrite spike. When you start reading nitrite and less or no ammonia, you're about half way there. Keep in mind however, nitrite is just as lethal as ammonia.

I started with five Danios, and have four left. The ammonia didn't kill the first one, he died 12 hours after bringing him home. I'm 2.5 weeks into my cycle, and my ammonia is no longer an issue (since yesterday evening), but I'm now watching closely the nitrite. Careful, light feeding and changing water ONLY when necessary is the key. Be patient, my friend.

This has been my experience, your mileage may vary.

 

[lillykinloo]

I 100% agree with Rob; cut back on the water changes. If you're reading 0.5 ammonia from a color card, this is not lethal to fish, but of course it does introduce stress. Feed lightly, every two days. Do a water 25% change when you reach 1.0. Most kits measure total disolved ammonia, but the lethal ammonia is approximately one percent of the total disolved, given pH and temperature. Water changes will slow the cycle process. If your fish are fine, active, breathing normally and eating when fed, you're on the right path. If your ammonia does gets out of hand, add Ammo Lock. This will not interfere with the cycle process and render lethal ammonia harmless. 1.5 weeks is hardly into the fish cycle process. Expect 4 to 6 weeks for it to complete. Watch for your Nitrite spike. When you start reading nitrite and less or no ammonia, you're about half way there. Keep in mind however, nitrite is just as lethal as ammonia.

I started with five Danios, and have four left. The ammonia didn't kill the first one, he died 12 hours after bringing him home. I'm 2.5 weeks into my cycle, and my ammonia is no longer an issue (since yesterday evening), but I'm now watching closely the nitrite. Careful, light feeding and changing water ONLY when necessary is the key. Be patient, my friend.

This has been my experience, your mileage may vary.

Thanks again, TerraDreamer! I'm going to hold off on the water changes (to be honest, I'll be glad to get some relief from the daily 42 trips that it takes me back and forth to the kitchen sink to empty 20% of my water) I'll keep testing every day, and once it gets higher, I'll start the water changes again. My fish do appear to be fine....very active with vigorous appetites. I've only been feeding them every other day. My lfs said that they expected my cycle would be complete in about 2 weeks, and I'm not even close, so I wanted to check with the experts here. Once again, I appreciate the help!

 

[TerraDreamer]

Keep your temp up as well. Bacteria love warmth. I recommend at least 78F, 25.5C.

 

[lillykinloo]

Hi everyone! Well, here's an update...it's been another week, and now I have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, and 0 nitrates. I called my lfs and asked about this, and they said this is odd since I've had my fish for 2.5 weeks now, and I still don't have an ammonia rating. I've been testing my ammonia reading each day, and my test kit (the API Master Test Kit) has been giving me ammonia readings of 0.25-0.5, but no nitrite or nitrate. Today, the lfs ran a test and said there's no ammonia, no nitrite, and no nitrate. I stopped doing the daily water changes. I feed my fish every other day, and the heater is set at 78 degrees. The pH is 7.4 (I'm ordering a piece of mopani wood to try to lower the pH). Do I not have enough fish to produce enough ammonia?

 

[Rooster]

Are your test kits "fresh" ? I would not trust them much past 6 months...
Try testing tap water, and, errrrr , urine (in cases of no other sources of ammonia ! LOL)

 

[lillykinloo]

Are your test kits "fresh" ? I would not trust them much past 6 months...
Try testing tap water, and, errrrr , urine (in cases of no other sources of ammonia ! LOL)

Hmmm....I actually looked for a date on the kit, but I wasn't able to locate one. The lfs said this as well (that my test might not be fresh). But then, they did their test and also got zero on everything. Maybe their test kit is old, too. I'll try the tap water (and maybe I could use glass cleaner instead of the urine...I'd hate to try to aim for that tiny test tube. ) Thanks, Rooster!!

 

[Miss Wiggle]

i actually disagree about stopping the daily water changes. i do think they are essential when cycling with fish, however it's also essential to get a half decent amount of bio load in there in the first place.

if i was you i'd try to return your fish and do a fishless cycle, or get another group of hardy fish and that should increase your bioload to the point that the cycle kicks off properly.

 

[lillykinloo]

i actually disagree about stopping the daily water changes. i do think they are essential when cycling with fish, however it's also essential to get a half decent amount of bio load in there in the first place.

if i was you i'd try to return your fish and do a fishless cycle, or get another group of hardy fish and that should increase your bioload to the point that the cycle kicks off properly.

Hi, Miss wiggle! Thanks for the reply! i wouldn't mind returning the fish and doing the fishless cycle, but when i mentioned this to my husband today, he started whining about how he doesn't want to take the fish out, because he likes them. i'm glad he likes them, but to be honest, i'm a little surprised that he became attached to them this quickly. i think i'll continue to work on him about this....

but, just in case it doesn't work and i do need to purchase more fish, what should i purchase to get the stocking levels adequate enough for the cycling to start? my plan is to eventually have 5 diamond tetras, 3 pearl gourami (1 male and 2-3 females), and 5-6 cories (trinileatus or burgess II). i have a 37 gallon tank, so this would make me fully stocked. should i add 1 male or 1 female pearl gourami for now? would they be hardy enough to have a fighting chance if i do the daily water changes and feed sparingly? or, would you recommend that i just add 2 tetra (for a total of 7 diamond tetras)? this would make me just a tad overstocked in the end. what would be best as a stocking choice?

thanks again!

 

[lillykinloo]

Well...I still have zero ammonia, zero nitrite, and zero nitrate in my fish tank. I've been up and running for about 3.5 weeks now. I purchased a new test kit, and I'm still getting zero on everything. I also took a water sample to the lfs again this weekend, and they said everything is still zero. I think my fish tank is an enigma. The only thing that the lfs said is, "your pH is a little high. It's about 7.4." So, I collected some rain water (with a pH of 6.5), and I've been slowly adding small amounts to my tank to soften the water and lower the pH a bit. But I don't think this has anything to do with cycling?? I know my tetras prefer a lower pH and softer water tho, so I figured it couldn't really hurt.

I never did add any other fish. I asked around on the Gourami board about possibly adding a Pearl Gourami (I inquired as to whether or not the Pearl might be hardy enough to tolerate the cycling process), and it sounds like the Gourami might not make it. Also, I quit doing daily water changes (because I'm not getting any readings anyways.) I just picked up feedings a bit, because I realized that I may be feeding too sparingly. I still feed every other day, but I feed a little more....still no readings.

I called my lfs about 2 weeks ago to inquire about taking my fish back, and unfortunately, since I've had them for more than 14 days, they won't take them back.

Should I just keep doing what I'm doing?

 

[Amunet]

I disagree with stopping daily water changes as well when you start getting ammonia readings again.
It will slow down the cycling process, but if you want your fish to be less stressed from the ammonia build up, then you must do daily water changes. Perhaps only about 10%.. and larger if ammonia is spiking.

And don't worry about your pH. 7.4 is pretty darn good and your fish will adapt to it.

 

[sarahmom22]

How important is the PH of the water? I ask because mine is in the high range as well, but my fish seem to be doing fine...