Cuc - Back To Basics.

[jennybugs]

I have only got 6 astrea snails and a sand conch as my CUC at the moment and am now thinking I need more diversity.

Out of interest, what CUC have you got?

Bearing in mind I have a relatively small 90L nano, I'm looking for suggestions for hermits/maybe mithrax crabs/small brittle starfish maybe? Are dwarf hermits the way to go with a nano?

Any other snails I could be thinking of? I got the conch as I was told it would keep the sand clean, which it does, and it also climbs all over the rocks (totally ungraceful to watch), but it doesn't get right into the sand as I was told it would. It's cool though so I don't mind.

Does current stock have any bearing on the sort of CUC to have? I have 2 percs, 1 starry blenny, 1 coral goby, montipora digitata, branchng hammer and ricordeas in the tank at the mo.

Your thoughts would be greatfully received peeps

 

[xxBarneyxx]

In my tank (150l) I have:
10 turbo/astraea snails (some are turbos some are astraeas, all bought as turbos though)
10 blue knuckle hermits
1 cerith snail (only one I have ever seen for sell locally).

Wouldnt really count the below as CUC but they do a good job of finding leftover food:
3 peppermint shrimp
1 blood shrimp
1 skunk cleaner shrimp

This seems to be plenty for my tank. I want to get some Nassarius snails as these burrow in the sand and help keep it turned over. Will try and get maybe half a dozen of these later in the year.

The cerith snails I think do a much better job on algae then the turbos and astraea's but they tend to stick only to the substrate and liverock so very rarely go on the glass.

Personally if I was you I would go for a few astrara snails, a couple of cerith snails, 3 or 4 nassarius and maybe a few dwarf hermits.

 

[jennybugs]

I already have 6 astreas Barney and I forgot to mention the pepp and skunk cleaner

Nassarius are what I was looking for when I got the conch tbh.

I am loathe to add a crab as it took me long enough to catch the meatyman that was in the rock when I got it really so the hermits would be the only ones I'd consider. Pompom crabs are nice but not algae eaters I guess.

I'll have a mooch about and see what I can find. Thanks for answering my thread

 

[xxBarneyxx]

No problem. Yeah I wouldnt want to add any crabs either (though I have also been tempted by pompom and procelin (spelling?) crabs). I didnt have very good experiences with hermits in my nano (they pretty much killed every snail I put in there) but in my new tank they have been ok (maybe its because there is more space or maybe I just didnt give them enough shells in the nano to play with ).

Just noticed a typo in my first post. That should have read "wouldn't really count them as CUC"

 

[seffieuk]

I've got four blue legged hermit crabs, although think two of them are something else, but they were sold as blue leg - they do a good job on every surface etc the glass lol - now that would be funny

about 10/12 Nassarius snails, Trod and I bought twenty off a chap on fleabay - he sent us a few extra. They turn the sand over and go on the glass after lights out.

two fire shrimps - eat anything and everything

Three snails, bought as ceriths but I think one of them is a astrea, but he has never fallen over!

Seffie x

 

[Donya]

I have only got 6 astrea snails and a sand conch as my CUC at the moment and am now thinking I need more diversity.

Is there a specific problem like debris/algae buildup or something similar? If not, there's always the "why fix it if it ain't broke" principal. A CUC doesn't necessarily have to be all that diverse to get the job done.

Out of interest, what CUC have you got?

In my 20gal (~76L I guess?) my CUC is made up of 4 Clibanarius erythropus hermits, 3 nassarius of uncertain species, and a Strombus luhuanus conch. The conch is probably less of a CUC member at this point and more of a big mooch on the food I give to the other gastropods in the tank. The other gastropods are a three turbos and a cowrie, but they all get fed daily so they don't count as CUC.

I got the conch as I was told it would keep the sand clean, which it does, and it also climbs all over the rocks (totally ungraceful to watch), but it doesn't get right into the sand as I was told it would.

If they find enough food in a certain place, they'll stick to that place quite often. My conch never used to dig in the substrate much until I moved it to a tank that collected more debris in the substrate. If yours doing a lot of rock climbing, just keep an eye out to make sure it doesn't get stuck in a crevice somewhere. They're usually pretty good at getting out, but if they land head-first they can get stuck pretty easily.

hermits/maybe mithrax crabs/small brittle starfish maybe?

True crabs are probably not the best choice with your current stocking. True conches are really easy food for those guys if they get hungry. All the crab has to do is flip the conch over, stick a claw in, and dig around until it gets a hold of the snail's foot/eyestalk/nose/etc. Not sure about the brittle starfish; haven't kept one myself.

Are dwarf hermits the way to go with a nano?

They can be, but they don't have to be, since their role can be filled by other animals. Which "dwarf" species you end up with can be the difference between a CUC war and a happy tank, so you need to choose carefully. Definitely don't add any if they'd be hard pressed to find munchies, and mixing species in smaller tanks carelessly can sometimes lead to hermits beating on each other. Clibanarius erythropus (red-tip or red-leg) is pretty peaceful, with C. tricolor (blue-leg) being a close 2nd. A lot of people keep Paguristes cadenati (scarlet or red-leg) without incident. Regardless of hermit species, the safe way to go is to not add too many hermits and make sure you don't have any live snails in the tank that would look like an appealing new home to a growing hermit. The conch would probably be safe with small Clibanarius or Paguristes, but the Astreas might not.

 

[jennybugs]

Thanks so very much for that great reply Donya!

I haven't got any 'problems' as such with my tank. My live rock needs a bit of a check kept on it from the point of some areas of it getting fluffy here and there, but I do the 'gardening' frequently enough so it's not being allowed to build up.

Interesting to see that some people say get yourself loads of CUC and others say it's not vital...like so many things in this hobby, there's always a different view point just round the corner
From a personal point of view, I try to have creatures in the tank that I like and am interested in, rather than buying something just because it does this or does that. I wouldn't go and buy a tons of snails for a freshwater tank if I had an algae problem, rather get them because I like and am interested in them - which is indeed the case as I have them in most of my freshwater tanks
Obviously, I want my tank to be clean enough to look nice but also be healthy and not a mini war inside its walls, which is why I have reluctantly shied away from hermits (being a bit of a snail lover). I'd like one or two small hermits for their interest as an animal really but am apprehensive about putting my lovely conch at risk.

I do conch/snail watch every day to make sure no-one's stuck/upturned/vanished btw

It was out of curiosity that I started this thread as I feel it's always good to get other opinions - your's has been most informative/thought provoking

 

[Donya]

Interesting to see that some people say get yourself loads of CUC and others say it's not vital...like so many things in this hobby, there's always a different view point just round the corner

There are certainly a million ways to do a marine tank and have it turn out right. Just species selection alone will lead to huge differences in CUC stocking (hermit species for example - one Calcinus seurati can do the job of a handfull of Clibanarius erythropus), and everyone has his/her favorites.

From a personal point of view, I try to have creatures in the tank that I like and am interested in, rather than buying something just because it does this or does that. I wouldn't go and buy a tons of snails for a freshwater tank if I had an algae problem, rather get them because I like and am interested in them - which is indeed the case as I have them in most of my freshwater tanks
Obviously, I want my tank to be clean enough to look nice but also be healthy and not a mini war inside its walls, which is why I have reluctantly shied away from hermits (being a bit of a snail lover). I'd like one or two small hermits for their interest as an animal really but am apprehensive about putting my lovely conch at risk.

Ah...I probably misunderstood your original post in that respect. Well, if you're interested in CUC-related animals without needing CUC help, there's a whole world of possibilities, particularly if you're prepared to target feed a little to prevent competition between herbivores or scavengers that are already doing the CUC job. As far as snails go, some of the bigger Turbinids like Turbo fluctuosa, Cittarium pica (zebra turbo), and others do just fine in nanos if target fed a couple times per week with seaweed - which will also make them less likely to compete with something like Astreas. The only problem with those guys is their ability to bulldoze corals by accident; the same goes for some other interesting groups of gastropods like cowries. Of course, if there are no hermits, some of the more colorfull smaller snails like Nerites become a possibility, and in a 90L those probably wouldn't need target feeding to avoid CUC competition.

Unless you get big hermit species, hermits and conches are probably not that big of a risk, particularly if the conch is large enough. Fighting conches in the 2" range are safe from most CUC hermit species, and have kept juvinile conches <1" with Clibanarius erythropus with no issues. If the conch is small though, it may be best to play it safe, especially if the species is at all uncertain on candidate hermits.

 

[jennybugs]

Thanks again for a great load of information!

My conch is over 2" long so I am now feeling a little more relaxed about dwarf hermits in my tank. i will look into all the suggestions you have offered me though