Considering Cichlids for the first time

[FunkyDexter]

I've kept a planted aquarium for years but would really like to set up a Malawi cichlid tank. I'm not 100% settled on the fish but I'm mostly considering a mix of peacocks. I've got a few concerns before I dive in.

1. My floor space is a limited to 100cm x 50cm so I'm considering getting a moderately tall tank custom made. A height of 50 cm would give me a 55 gallon tank and I could probably go taller than that if needs be. My concern is that as I get taller my surface area to volume ratio will diminish. That can be alleviated with air pumps etc. but is there a sensible upper limit I should set myself? And is that floor space going to be enough space for them to move around comfortably?

2. From my research I gather that peacocks tend to feed at the bottom. If I'm setting up a taller tank is it just going to be an empty void at the top or will they make use of it? If they won't, are there any suggested tank mates I could mix in who will swim closer to the top?

3. Finally, I see a lot of people talking about crowding the tank. I've seen a few crowded tanks in fish shops and really love the look but I'm concerned about the implications of that. I imagine it needs extra aeration, extra filtering and, presumably, more frequent/larger water changes. Could anyone provide a bit of a guide on that?

Thanks in advance for any advice
FD

 

[utahfish]

I've kept a planted aquarium for years but would really like to set up a Malawi cichlid tank. I'm not 100% settled on the fish but I'm mostly considering a mix of peacocks. I've got a few concerns before I dive in.

1. My floor space is a limited to 100cm x 50cm so I'm considering getting a moderately tall tank custom made. A height of 50 cm would give me a 55 gallon tank and I could probably go taller than that if needs be. My concern is that as I get taller my surface area to volume ratio will diminish. That can be alleviated with air pumps etc. but is there a sensible upper limit I should set myself? And is that floor space going to be enough space for them to move around comfortably?

2. From my research I gather that peacocks tend to feed at the bottom. If I'm setting up a taller tank is it just going to be an empty void at the top or will they make use of it? If they won't, are there any suggested tank mates I could mix in who will swim closer to the top?

3. Finally, I see a lot of people talking about crowding the tank. I've seen a few crowded tanks in fish shops and really love the look but I'm concerned about the implications of that. I imagine it needs extra aeration, extra filtering and, presumably, more frequent/larger water changes. Could anyone provide a bit of a guide on that?

Thanks in advance for any advice
FD

Malawi are strong swimmers and fish with long bodies need length over height. Deep bodied fish like gold fish angels discus require height more than length.

Also confused about the mention of plants. If one is planning on keeping malawi with plants there are few they won't uproot or eat.

The idea of crowding cichlids is to decrease aggression as the idea is that they are less likely to establish territories due to so many fish. This requires lots of water changes as cichlids are big eaters which creates lots of waste which creates lots of ammonia. I wouldn't take into account the way a fish store has the tanks. Those tanks are temporary homes as fish are sold or transported. Most fish store tanks aren't ideal living conditions for fish.

 

[FunkyDexter]

The mention of plants was purely that my past experience is with a planted tank, nothing to do with the new tank. Sorry I wasn't clearer about that. The new tank will be sand and rock.

Thanks for the info

 

[Stefan3289]

Im sure @Wills can give some good input sinceI only have experience with SA cichlid, not African...

But yes overcrowding is a method to reduce aggression but cichlids are quite the bio load. Maybe going for some electric labs (or any smaller Malawi cichlid that grow 3-4") could be a good spot to start out. Not sure about your fish keeping experience but if you don't have much, could be easier.

 

[FunkyDexter]

Thanks for the response.

I understand that overcrowding is normally to keep down aggression but I guess what I'm really asking is whether it's bad for the fish? The old inch/gallon rule (which I know is inexact but I find it useful as a guesstimate when planning a tank) would give me maybe 55 inches of fish in a 55 gallon tank which is roughly 5 or 6 peacocks. That's enough but I'd prefer more if it's not bad for the fish. That's really what I'm asking.

I assume that as long as I dial up the aeration and filtration I should only really have to concern myself with frequency of water changes (I've always done weekly on previous tanks) and possible stress to the fish from the crowding.

 

[HoldenOn]

Thanks for the response.

I understand that overcrowding is normally to keep down aggression but I guess what I'm really asking is whether it's bad for the fish? The old inch/gallon rule (which I know is inexact but I find it useful as a guesstimate when planning a tank) would give me maybe 55 inches of fish in a 55 gallon tank which is roughly 5 or 6 peacocks. That's enough but I'd prefer more if it's not bad for the fish. That's really what I'm asking.

I assume that as long as I dial up the aeration and filtration I should only really have to concern myself with frequency of water changes (I've always done weekly on previous tanks) and possible stress to the fish from the crowding.

It wouldn't stress them if done right, but it requires a more significant amount of maintenance.

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

Bear in mind that I know nothing really about cichlids, never kept them, so take anything I say here with a pinch of salt. But I think if you could construct a decent height rock wall in there, safely, the height might not be the worst thing in the world, and might even replicate their natural environment more. Footprint is still very important to consider of course, for horizontal swimming space, the surface area, and even just in terms of maintenance and cleaning. A 55 tall can't be stocked in the same way as a regular 55. But if you could construct the right kind of rock formations, I bet you could create a stunning cichlid tank.

I'm basing that info on this article that talks about mbunas natural habitat, and also goes into depth about the reasoning behind overcrowding and how to select species and sexes to mix to try to balance aggression. I found it fascinating, and a good basis to start your research. Hope you share photos of your progress!

The mbuna keeper's survival guide

Mbuna are colourful, hardy cichlids that are easy to breed in the aquarium. But they’re also highly territorial fish, so get things wrong and you could have a blood bath. Here’s how to avoid a rocky horror…

www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk

 

[FunkyDexter]

Thank you, that's an excellent article.

The overcrowding thing is interesting and feels counter intuitive (I think that's why I keep coming back to it). That article is recommending a minimum of 20 fish which seems crazy in a 55 gallon tank... but maybe not.

 

[communityfluvalroma]

I have been researching African Cichlids for the last 3 months, in preparation for setting up my own tank. By no means do I have all the answers and I'm not experienced with cichlids in the slightest. But the information is still fresh in my memory.

Depending on the type of species you're keeping, for example males only Malawi Cichlids, from what I've read, overcrowding is recommended. However, as you're overcrowding, your filtration should also be increased. For instance, I have a 240 litre tank but I have upgraded the filter to the Fluval FX4, which has an output of 2650 litres per hour.

As you're limited with floor space, I would also recommend checking out Lake Tanganyika cichlids. Not as common as Malawi, but just as interesting if not more.

Lake Tanganyika cichlids are generally smaller than Malawi and you'll easily be able to find several different species that'll love different levels within your tank.

 

[itiwhetu]

Have just a few and let them do their thing, over crowding will have more issues than it's worth. These are spectacular even in small numbers.

 

[Metalhead88]

Ehhhh.... Mbuna are so aggressive that you really do need to over stock to disperse aggression.

Peacock are much less aggressive, but get larger. I think you'd benefit from more length for either. Especially peacocks.

 

[communityfluvalroma]

Take a look at Cyprichromis leptosoma.

Cyprichromis leptosoma (Sardine Cichlid) — Seriously Fish

www.seriouslyfish.com

From what I've read it fits your profile perfectly.

 

[FunkyDexter]

Thanks again for the continued replies, guys.

Unfortunately more length isn't an option, I wish it was. I took some more measurements and could increase the width (front to back) to 60/65 cm at a pinch which would help the surface area but the length is based on a recess it will sit in.

@communityfluvalroma, thanks for the Tanganyika suggestion. I'll take a look into that.

From my research I'm increasingly convinced that overcrowding is feasible as far as filtration and aeration is concerned which leaves me two main concerns:
1. Water changes. Does anyone have a rule of thumb as to how much water would need to be changed and how often. I'm used to weekly 10% water changes for my planted tank. What might an unplanted crowded tank require to keep the nitrates down.
2. How many fish. From research I think you kinda have to crowd the tank right from the start, before they've had a chance to grow. I'm used to keeping the numbers low and then slowly increasing as they start grow based on ammonia/nitrite/nitrate levels. It doesn't sound like that possible if overcrowding so you have to get it right first time. Is there any kind of guide for this?

 

[communityfluvalroma]

You'll certainly be looking to carry out 30%-50% water changes once a week to maintain good water quality. That's with very good filtration. If you're going for standard filtration for the size of the tank, then I'd recommend carrying out more frequent water changes.

It all depends on what fish you're going to stock. Until you've decided it's hard to give you stocking advice as they all have their likes, dislikes and quirks.

 

[HoldenOn]

You'll certainly be looking to carry out 30%-50% water changes once a week to maintain good water quality. That's with very good filtration. If you're going for standard filtration for the size of the tank, then I'd recommend carrying out more frequent water changes.

It all depends on what fish you're going to stock. Until you've decided it's hard to give you stocking advice as they all have their likes, dislikes and quirks.

I'd recommend 75%.