Confronting Ignorant Shopkeepers?

[Kinui]

Ugh, the dreaded pet shops.

So, I recently found a pet store close to me that I was pretty excited to find at first.

The birds aren't crowded? Gasp! The guinea pigs and rabbits have nice open pens? *shock*...they don't sell small rodents in mass quantities?! Is this too good to be true?...of course it is.

I was happily wandering around the new store in gleeful awe until...I find the bettas. At first sight, I see them lined up in their own individual little shelf/cubicle thing, which I think, oh well that's nice, at least they have light and aren't crammed in the back of a dark shelf - then I take a closer look. Those sweet (ok, maybe not so much), majestic and beautiful creatures are in the obligatory (mandatory?) little plastic jars (to be expected, I suppose)...which whoever runs the store doesn't even have the decency to fill up to the nice little line. Instead, the poor darlings are sitting in a third to half filled cup, with no space to spread their fins out, most not even bothering to move. I spot several dead.

I'm ranting quietly to my dad about this, so he (who perhaps doesn't feel the same passion about it as me but agrees that it's ridiculous) un-confrontationally asks the shopkeeper "Is that enough water for the fish to live?" (he likes getting to the point in a roundabout way. "Oh, sure" the shopkeeper replies. "It just doesn't seem like much space to move, I mean, I understand it might be easier for display -- " my dad says. "Sure, and it's easier to clean out too," shopkeeper. The conversation dies down from there, with the shopkeeper calling over a few minutes later from the front. "See these ones here? Their in more water and they don't move around anymore than those."

...really? That's what you're going with?

So, please excuse my long explanation/rant. The point is (not that I feel it would do much good), I would like to go back one day and confront the shopkeeper about this. I don't believe that he means ill towards the fish, I just think he's completely oblivious. It's a small, privately owned shop (I think the man was the manager, but I can't be sure) and I would like to at least try to educate them. My problem is, I'm an extremely non-confrontational personality type. I go out of my way to avoid arguments, and when I do speak up, I tend to get very flustered and emotional. So I like to know what I'm going to say beforehand.

Do any of you have suggestions about how to go about this, without sounding rude or demeaning? Could anyone share similar stories?

 

[LeiLana80]

Ugh, I'm the same way when it comes to confrontation. Although as I get older (I'm only 28 lol) and as I progress in my motherhood of a 2 year old, I'm finding I'm getting bolder in speaking my mind.
I would give it a week or so and then go back to the shop and see if any changes were made. If not, I would politely ask to speak with who's in charge and say that you are concerned about the quality of care the bettas are receiving. I know you won't be able to change the tiny cup issue (total crap, btw), but at least encourage a FULL cup of water, clean or not! And I would tell them that no one is going to buy a betta when it's already half dead from the lack of care they "received" at the pet shop.
I have many times told employees that there was a problem with a particular fish at their store. Luckily, the store I frequent has a guy on staff who is AWESOME. He is extremely knowledgeable for allll kind of fish and he keeps their tanks super clean and healthy. And it's a Petsmart!!! lol

 

[Fishball7]

You could try to inform them of the right conditions to keep them but be prepared for many excuses.

I used to work in a pet shop, albeit a pretty bad one. It took me six months or more of badgering the owners and better sales from bettas before they agreed to buy half moons, deltas and keep them each in a 5gallon, 18litre ish barrack. Their reasons throughout was, they're just fish, they're fine, they take up too much room for little profit. You may find many shop keepers have the same reasons. It's why they can get away doing it to bettas.

Normally I pretend to be a first time fish keeper and question them to see what they know. If they're really ignorant or not.

Good luck.

 

[HannahBear77]

I would just provide them with information on how to be kept granted they might not even space for individual tanks for all the males but could keep up on the water changes a little bit,

Every time I go into one of my lfs I start complaining out loud and make sure ppl are close by to listen and that some of the ppl that work their are close by to here me that goes for fish and the puppies they get from puppie mills and I make sure to remind them that they come from bad breeding

I wouldnt be rude bout it I would just be like hey dude these fish are like any normal tropical fish and they deserve a little bit better living conditions

 

[Liquid skills]

Same I went to a pet shop and an employee was telling a customer that neons would be totally fine with a massive turtle it made me angry but my dad didn't won't me to say anything as he didn't wont me to get in trouble poor neons

 

[willowstwin]

There's a store near me that's part of "The Range" group, and they have 2+ large fancy goldfish in tanks 10 gallon and smaller, in murky water, with far too many ornaments in there. It makes me want to be sick. The worst thing is, the fish aren't for sale, so they'll never leave until they die.

I usually point out the problems very loudly to my partner in pet shops, especially when staff are within earshot and there are people looking in the tanks to buy fish. I remember being in a shop once (a regularly moaned about pet shop chain here in england), and I saw numerous dead fish in one tank, when I complained about it, the girl went to get a net, she watched me "leave" (I came straight back in) and she put the net down and left the fish. I then went to look at some other tanks, and found a dry, shrivelled up pleco stuck to the OUTSIDE of a tank... I had to leave very quickly and I vomited outside the store.

Go in and say you're concerned. That you keep Betta's yourself (whether you do or not is irrelevant), and that you know they're to be kept in better conditions. Print out species profile pages from reputable sites to show him. Explain that you understand the lack of space in store and so the need for the "tiny cups", but that these need to be full cups. People will want to see the fish is healthy, and that means them having enough water to fan out their fins. Also make the point that healthy looking fish will lead to increased sales.

 

[Liquid skills]

There's a store near me that's part of "The Range" group, and they have 2+ large fancy goldfish in tanks 10 gallon and smaller, in murky water, with far too many ornaments in there. It makes me want to be sick. The worst thing is, the fish aren't for sale, so they'll never leave until they die.

I usually point out the problems very loudly to my partner in pet shops, especially when staff are within earshot and there are people looking in the tanks to buy fish. I remember being in a shop once (a regularly moaned about pet shop chain here in england), and I saw numerous dead fish in one tank, when I complained about it, the girl went to get a net, she watched me "leave" (I came straight back in) and she put the net down and left the fish. I then went to look at some other tanks, and found a dry, shrivelled up pleco stuck to the OUTSIDE of a tank... I had to leave very quickly and I vomited outside the store.

Go in and say you're concerned. That you keep Betta's yourself (whether you do or not is irrelevant), and that you know they're to be kept in better conditions. Print out species profile pages from reputable sites to show him. Explain that you understand the lack of space in store and so the need for the "tiny cups", but that these need to be full cups. People will want to see the fish is healthy, and that means them having enough water to fan out their fins. Also make the point that healthy looking fish will lead to increased sales.

ya should of yaked inside the store and then told them why i would have and then gave them a great lecture on how to keep fish

 

[Keeper Of Cichlids]

So i've had a few confrontations like this, i've even had a few thump ups with lfs.
Once I went into a shop, the man who was working there was telling a fellow customer he could put a betta in a vase with no filter and heater.
Of course I politely told the customer the needs of a betta.
The shopkeeper was very ignorant and said it was a bunch of sugar, I then asked him if he knows anything about fish (yeah slightly rude I know)
He was very rude and told me to P off. The customer was clearly more interested in what I was saying.
I contained my anger and just carried on talking to the customer who listened to me and left the shop to go to a proper LFS that I recommended.
Okay now the man was peed, he started being very immature and was slightly nudging me and saying I've ruined his shop and he continued to nudge me til I tripped over the rack of fish nets.
Unfortunately for him I wasn't going to tolerate this, guess what happened next?

Anyway just thought I would share that.
Some people you just can't talk to, especially most lfs, their very stubborn.

 

[Liquid skills]

fortunatly the lfs i use is a family run business and they know what they are doing their bettas are kept in 4ft tanks each they are very good some of you will know this shop "kesgrave tropicals" in suffolk i live about 5 mins down the road by foot a few seconds by car lol but they deff know what they are talking about

its just a shame about the chain stores

 

[micko]

LMAO about having a fight with a LFS owner. What really was that going to do? Did you really believe he was going to change his mind after that?

Sometimes I just have to turn off a lot of my feelings when I walk into a pet shop/fish shop unless its one of my usual ones. All complaints to staff/managers seem to fall on deaf ears. Write an email to whoever gives them the licence or local animal welfare, add pictures if possible too and try and make sure the date and time is on the picture. If that doesn't change anything then not much else will.

 

[Keeper Of Cichlids]

Lol he was pushing me and when I fell over the rack that's when something inside me snapped.
He had it coming, maybe next time he will think about the care of a fish and remember what happened to him when he doesn't.

 

[Whisper]

First, I love your passion for these magnificant creatures of God. Your description of them comes very close to decribing just how wonderful and beautiful they are.

The problem isn't so much the store keeper who indeeed is adding to the problem and has the ability to correct it albeit at a small cost. The problem as I see it is from the suppliers who sell these bettas in these little cups in the first place. I have worked for a pet store and worked with the suppliers. I actually told a supplier I would not accept any more Bettas until he at least shipped them in the larger cups. That didn't work because he ran to the owner who said to ignore me. But I did manage to convince the owner to buy the larger cups to display all the bettas in. Using the excuse that it could increase sales by giving the Bettas more room to be active and display their beautiful fins finally won my argument. So every shipment my first task was to put each Betta into the bigger cups and give them a healthy feeding because the suppliers litteraly starve these fish.

I do understand your frustration and what we need is to get some animal protection society involved in addressing the unhumaine conditions these poor bettas are forced to live in.

Another problem is the price for Bettas is way too low. This happens because they are over bread and the supply is so much greater than the demand and that lends to a lack of concern by all involved in the chain regarding their health. What do they care if a 22 cent fish dies? They don't. Breading needs to be controlled to reduce supply to raise the price to increase to value of these fish and thereby increase the concern for their health. The average Betta by me costs about a $2.50 to $4.90 for the more extravagant fin configurations. Heck, I'd easily pay $30.00 for a Betta knowing what wonderfully amazing and loving fish they truely are.

Unlike a cute puppy, unfortunately, the pet stores and the supliers see these Bettas as an inexpensive asset and not for the wonderful living creatures all of us here know they are.

 

[jrcan]

There's a store near me that's part of "The Range" group, and they have 2+ large fancy goldfish in tanks 10 gallon and smaller, in murky water, with far too many ornaments in there. It makes me want to be sick. The worst thing is, the fish aren't for sale, so they'll never leave until they die.

The range near me did this when they first opened. They had a largish tank with ornaments and two fancy goldfish. The first time i saw it one goldfish was dead. The next week i went back and one was swimming round alone and the next time i went there were no fish, brown water, mould floating on the top and the ornaments covered in brownish sludge.not a good advert.after then the tank has gone and theyve put a dog food display there instead.

Our biggest live shop here sells bettas in tiny tanks. They have the usual wall displays with tanks on top of each other but the bettas are individual, around 5 imches wide, 7 inches high, cant tell how deep. The fish dont move much and look generally sad. They have plants in their pods which make even less rom for them. The shop we usually buy from have bettas but they keep them seperate from each other but with other fish so they have room to swim and look healthier.

 

[Samuran]

I might be totally wrong but couldnt you contact the RSPCA? or government vets (I'm not sure how you would do that but I know that when my dad worked in a wholesale fish importers a vet would come and inspect it every so often).
Ben

 

[Liquid skills]

Yes fish are governed my the welfare act but as long as the shop isn't breaking the five freedoms

1 freedom from hunger and thirst

2 freedom frOm fear and distress

3 freedome to behave naturally

4 freedom from discomfort

5 freedom from injury and illness

There's not much to be done obv the dried pleco one breaks all of these considering it's was stuck to the out side dried up but that's how shops get away with plunging so many ie goldfish in 50l tanks before sale most of the time the tanks are only 30l it's a shame tbh but not much can be done