Cannister Filter Question

[mundrew]

I am setting up a sump for my 60 gallon fresh water tank. I am wondering if my cannister filter could be used in place of setting up a continuous overflow/siphon type thing. The cannister filter would draw from the main tank and the output would be in the sump. Will setting up the canister filther like this damage the pump for the filter?
I want to add the sump because I have had an old 30 gallon tank in my basement not being used for a year now and if all i needed was to buy a water pump i could hide my ugly heater and free up some space for more plants.

 

[bitteraspects]

if your pump gives out in the sump, your tank will overflow into the sump and onto the floor.

 

[rabbut]

Pumping water out of the display and into the sump ends only one way, with a wet floor, empty display, full sump and a brun out "overflow" pump...

Drill the back of the display and plumb it up properly, or you will have a wet floor sooner or later. This is not opinion, it is experience

Another option would be a Hydor in-line heater on the return pipe from the canister

All the best
Rabbut

 

[mundrew]

Thanks for the advice. The LSf said the same thing. I'm waiting for an inline heater to come in the mail as we speak.

 

[DJ ArKaDaRkA]

if you drill your tank for a sump its impossible to flood the tank or sump right as if the pump breaks it will simply stop pumping water and then stop overflowing , is this correct?

 

[bitteraspects]

it really depends on how your tank is set up. theoretically, you are correct, if its set up properly. but its not just drilled tanks. same goes with PVC or HOB box skimmers

 

[DJ ArKaDaRkA]

it really depends on how your tank is set up. theoretically, you are correct, if its set up properly. but its not just drilled tanks. same goes with PVC or HOB box skimmers

is a HOB overflow just as effective or would drilling be more effective

 

[bitteraspects]

HOB box overflows can be just as effective if not more so, especially in regards to surface skimming. it provides a lot more area coverage then a drilled hole or PVC style overflow. the only real downfall is that it sits inside the tank, and is visible. even a clear skimmer (which IMO, isnt bad at all) can be viewed in the display, and some people dont like that. besides the visual aspect, i dont see any other downfall to the box skimmer.

 

[rabbut]

^^The only other "problem" with overflow boxes is that if power goes out or flow drops, they have a habbit of breaking their syphen. If their syphen breaks, they don't take water over the rim of the tank. When this happens, the display overflows, the floor gets rather wet, the sump empties and the return pump burns out Realy, the only safe way of deploying a sump is to drill the tank. As for surface skimming, fit a weir and you suddenly gain that feature with a drilled tank

All the best
Rabbut

 

[bitteraspects]

If the power goes out, the return pump can not push water back into the display for it to overflow. Unless in your scenario above you are suggesting the return pump is somehow powered by something besides electricity.

So unless, like rabbut here, you have a pump that is solar powered, or maybe powered by a hamster running in a wheel, or even magic powered, then you have nothing to worry about.

 

[rabbut]

OK, lets keep it simple for our slower members

Power goes out
Overflow box syphen breaks
Power comes back on
Overflow box does not start "overflowing" again, due to it's syphen being lost
No water returns from the diplay to the sump, therefore;
Main tank overflows onto the floor
Sump empties and the floor gets wet
The sump pump runs dry untill finally...
The sump pump burns out.

I don't run overflow boxes (or a sump ATM for that matter at home, have many at work though...) for this reason (home marine tank is built from toughend glass and hence is not drillable, and the Discus tank + QT tank is on a canister(s)), but I know many whom have had a wet floor after a powercut, having had the overflow boxes syphen break

The overflow box is not electrically powered is it Bitter? So if I did have a Hampster/solar powered pump, shurley loosing power would not break the overflow box, as it does not need power to "overflow" just so long as there is water in the tank above where it's minimum waterline is

All the best
Rabbut

 

[bitteraspects]

Which goes back to my original post.
If set up PROPERLY, it will not have these problems.
No kiddin the skimmer isn't powered. I knew you weren't that bright, but apparently I misjudged how dim you can be.
Your skimmer does just that, skim. It should only be pulling water off the surface, so it would not keep draining after a power outage, as it should only be overflowing the excess water that the sump is putting into the tank.
No power-no pump-no excess water-no overflow.
And your overflow should not be anywhere close to the rim of the tank, which leaves more then enough space for whatever water is left in the sump to be held in the display.
So far the only thing you got right was that in the case that the water comes back on, you will likely lose your pump. Which through use of a good circuit breaker, is easily avoided.

 

[rabbut]

I'm not saying it will continue to overflow the sump in a power outage, I'm saying the main diplay will after the power comes back on You seam to admit this is a problem though, in the following section of your post;

So far the only thing you got right was that in the case that the water comes back on, you will likely lose your pump. Which through use of a good circuit breaker, is easily avoided.

So, basically, if you use a none-solid-state breaker that trips to off with the power being lost, such that the pump does not re-start with the power, you won't have these issues. Correct, but you create Ammonia issues in the display, as the tank is without power for longer, hence increasing the chance of livestock death. A least when the pump goes back on, the fish get a partical waterchange as the diplay overflows, so they can sustain for longer, while they await your rescue