Blue Rams Head Problem

[Godsend]

So, I got some blue rams for lfs a week ago or so. The were pritty much full grown when bought them. Now one of them, a male, has lost some coloration and has become increasingly aggressive to the other smaller rams in the tank. I have also noticed some strange scratching up against objects. Upon closer inspection I observed an anomaly in the forehead region of the fish. There is what looks like a white protrusion or abbrasion. It was practically unnoticeable at first. But now I think it is growing/intensifying. It looks sort of like a little pimple.
Here are some Updated pics of the fish. .. it is very hard to tell that anything is wrong but I know something isn't right. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Truck]

does it look like the fishes head is developing holes?
what temperature are they being kept at? as this would be a prime example of them being kept below 28oC and getting hexamita

are you using sand?

 

[Athena]

Have you done a check of your water stats recently? How often are you doing water changes?

When GBRs begin to discolour it is a sure sign that they are not happy with their tank conditions. First they lose the brilliance of their blue spots, then their bodies begin to darken slightly and go an almost charcoalish colour. It can also affect their temperament - some will sulk in a corner somewhere, whilst others will take their pain out on others and become quite aggressive.

They are quite prone to sickness as they are fairly sensitive little guys. The slightest stress can cause them to become ill.

The quicker you can remedy the problem, the better. I would begin with a water change and then once you have had a good diagnosis, begin treating with medications for it and hopefully the sick fish will recover.

I couldn't actually see the white pimple you mentioned, so I can't really say what it is as there are a few things it could be... LYMPHOCYSTIS, FLUKES, HOLE IN THE HEAD (Hexamita) etc.

Are there any other symptoms related to it? I know you mentioned flicking/scraping on objects (a sign of flukes or just bad water quality) - what about gill movement? Is the sick fish breathing very rapidly? Is he eating normally? Swimming ok? Any clamping of fins? Sunken belly?

Sorry for all the questions but it all helps in getting to the root cause.

Athena

 

[Godsend]

Well the problem looks to be getting worse. The reason why i am asking is because a friend of mine got a pair of Gold Rams form the same store(most likely from the same breeder), and he lost both rams to similar ailments. Now this is happening to the new one I got. I'm just kinda pissed off at the LFS(big al's), and am debating takeing the fish back (which i have had for longer then the return policy). I am going to take this guy back to the store and tell them they are selling bunk, kyboshed fish and I want my bloody money back. The little bugger cost $16CAD, and i am pissed off.

Thank you guys for the response.
-truckasauras123,
There does not appear to be any hole, but i guess it could be happening.
The temp is at 82°f
No, I am not using sand. I am using coarse gravel and slate rock.

-Athena
Yes i have done a water test. the results are: Nitrate=25ppm Nitrite=0ppm General Hardness=15ppm Chlorine=0ppm Alkalinity=75ppm PH=6.8 Ammonium=Unknow but i presume it is 0
I do 10-20% water change every two days
Other symptoms i noticed is a sort of red dot on his gill cover, and a gerneral lazy floating type swimming, near the surface.
His gill movement is only slightly more rapid then the others.
He is eating, but not with as strong of an appetite.
He seems to be swimming ok, just somewhat segregated from the group.
No clamping
No sunken belly
No labored breathing
Just looks further discolored and looks like the pimple thing might be getting bigger.

Thanks again for the response. Looking forward to hearing from you again.

 

[Truck]

if their are abrasions the gravel could be your problem as rams (mikrogeophagus sp) are mini earth eaters, and they need sand as they filter feed sometimes.

 

[Godsend]

if their are abrasions the gravel could be your problem as rams (mikrogeophagus sp) are mini earth eaters, and they need sand as they filter feed sometimes.

What? is that greek or something? I didn't know i was supposed to keep them with sand.. but i was going to get a piece of wood when i go to return him, so i'll pick up a bag of sand too i guess.

Just the normal white sand will do? or do i need anything special. Also i am trying to breed. is sand good for this?
And will plants root and grow ok in sand?

thanks

 

[Truck]

i doubt youll get them breeding without soft water, albeit it has been done, its just difficult. sand is better play sand will do

 

[keenonfish]

does it look like the fishes head is developing holes?
what temperature are they being kept at? as this would be a prime example of them being kept below 28oC and getting hexamita

are you using sand?

Do these fellas like things on the warm side then?

 

[Truck]

does it look like the fishes head is developing holes?
what temperature are they being kept at? as this would be a prime example of them being kept below 28oC and getting hexamita

are you using sand?

Do these fellas like things on the warm side then?

yes other wise you could face one of many problems;
hexamita
slowing of the metabolism
premature death etc

 

[Godsend]

i doubt youll get them breeding without soft water, albeit it has been done, its just difficult. sand is better play sand will do

No problem.As stated above my tank read at 15ppm for General Hardness. My tap water here(toronto) has a GH of 145ppm. my tank is very soft via softening pillow. I usually let it get a little harder and put the pillow in before i want to breed(to signify the rainy season)

 

[Godsend]

OK so i am getting more and more worried as time goes by.
Here are some pictures.

 

[TigerIssey]

Athena
Yes i have done a water test. the results are: Nitrate=25ppm Nitrite=0ppm General Hardness=15ppm Chlorine=0ppm Alkalinity=75ppm PH=6.8 Ammonium=Unknow but i presume it is 0

I am guessing by these test results you are using test strips, if so dump them in the bin and get a good quality liquid test kit. As truck has already said microgeophagus which is not greek it is latin (microgeophagus ramirezi) means little eartheater, so yes they do need sand. As truck already stated they also need higher temps, I keep mine at 28. If when you get (or get lfs to do but write numbers down)liquid test kits the nitrate reading it is over 20ppm you will need to do lots of water changes to get this down to 10-15ppm. Rams are very sensitive to water quality and the absolute maximum that nitrates should get up to is 20ppm.

The head problem could be what has already been mentioned but could also be columnaris which is a sign of bad water quality. Whilst this water may be ok for other fish as said rams are very sensitive. Does the white pimple look like cotton wool at all??

 

[Godsend]

Yea i am using test strips. I'll get rid of them and grab the good stuff. And i'll get some sand for them and some wood. I keep the temperature prtty high... around 82°-84°F. but a few days ago it fluctuated a bit. the heater is poor quality and i am just going to buy a new one to make sure the temp stays constant. I am fairly certain my nitrate stays below 25ppm at all times, but thats according to the strips so.. in any case i do 10% water change every 2 days, so its probably ok.

The head problem is realy pissing me off, because now the fish is acting very sick. ie. floating at the surface.. looks like he is drinking air.. not eating ect. The white pimple doesn't look fuzzy.. it prity much looks like a little pimple with what looks like mild swelling around it. He is almost certaily going to parish...

 

[TigerIssey]

Yea i am using test strips. I'll get rid of them and grab the good stuff. And i'll get some sand for them and some wood. I keep the temperature prtty high... around 82°-84°F. but a few days ago it fluctuated a bit. the heater is poor quality and i am just going to buy a new one to make sure the temp stays constant. I am fairly certain my nitrate stays below 25ppm at all times, but thats according to the strips so.. in any case i do 10% water change every 2 days, so its probably ok

I should reserve judgement on the Nitrates until you get the liquid test kit, the strips are notoriuosly bad for giving readings anywhere near. If you go for the API master liquid test kit, make sure you follow the instructions on vigourously shaking, it does need to be vigourous and it needs at least the time it says in the kit.
Nitrates really do have to stay below 20, the rams really are that sensitive to water quality unfortunately.

It does sound like this ram is on the way out, if you get another make sure to buy from a different supplier. You may want to wait at least a month just to make sure the other fish in the tank are ok. I would also take the body back to the shop you got it from, if your friend had problems too there is obviously a problem with the fish they were selling.

Just to let you know, I do 25% on a 55g weekly, my Nitrates stay between 10-15, IME this is the kind of range you need to aiming for in order for rams to thrive. When you get the liquid test kit, it is worth checking nitrates before every water change, there is a calculator on the PFK (Practical fish keeping) web site that will allow you to work out what percentage of water needs changing by the amount your nitrate level increases in a week, it also allows you to enter a value for the nitrates you want to keep the tank level at. I found it very useful.

 

[Godsend]

So i just went ahead and returned the fish. The manager at the fish store said all sorts of things. He didn't seem to think anything was wrong with the fish when he sold it to me but agreed that its head was kyboshed. He asked me about my tank. After i tell him how i run my tank he tells me that 83°F is too high and that it may be suffering from low oxygen. He also tells me to get some high quality food without even asking me what i feed... he also says some crap about how i am not softening my water properly and i need to buy water instead of using a pillow(somthing about the pillow not really softening my water. Lastly he said that me softening the water is going to mess with my pH, and he will need a water sample befor he will give me a refund.

Now, I don't know what you guys think, but i think this guy just fed me a bunch of bull and really didn't know anything about what i was talking about. The facts are that i have an air stone, i feed 5 different types of food(bloodworm, brineshrip, flake, sinking chiclid pellet,and peas), and my ph is never really lower then 6.5. The stuff about the pillow could be true but i don't see how it has anything to do with him giving me back my money. I don't use any salt so i don't see how the minuscule amount of salt from the pillow would be a problem

Is this guy full of crap??
i want my money back gad dangit~!