Biotechnology (aka Testing On Animals)

Joined
Oct 28, 2005
Messages
2,815
Reaction score
0
Location
Lincolnshire, United Kingdom
OK, so some of you may or may not know that I have a relation who works for the RSPCA (English version of the American's ASPCA). She works in particular with the biotechnology sector of their welfare work and recently brought home these figures showing how many animals where tested on in labs in the England Alone (stats do NOT include Wales, Scotland or Nothern Ireland).

Anyway, just wanted to share these facts and figures with you to see what you make of them.
The facts are for the year 2005.

Mice - 1,955,035
Rats - 414,225
Guinea Pigs - 28,894
Other Rodents - 11,962
Rabbits - 15,348
Dogs - 5,373
Cats - 308
Primates - 3,115
Ferrets - 952
Farm Animals - 17,467
Horses - 294
Amphibians - 13,318
Birds - 112,792
Fish - 230,315
Reptiles - 64

That's a total of 2,849,572 animals tested on in England in the year 2005.
 
Topics like these should perhaps not be started because they turn into nasty wars of opinion.
It evokes passion and emotion in people flaming and trolling in others.
This thread will almost certainly be closed in the near future :(
 
Personally I think the awareness a thread like this creates is a very good thing. However, I believe that they should be made in as least a "personalised" way as possible to avoid the passionate opinions and flaming bloo mentioned before. By adding comments like "All these animals suffered so you could wear lipstick? Hardly seems fair" is only asking for trouble IMO.

That aside, I am of the opinion that animal testing is completely immoral and try to avoid products that use it whenever and wherever possible. Kelly and I refuse to line the pockets of those who seek to make money from the suffering of animals in this way and always look for animal friendly products in everything we buy.
 
I'm sorry, but some, probably most, of those animals suffered to help cure cancer e.t.c., also, what about the millions of rats and mice killed in the sewers? No outcry there
 
Well, personally I hold the same view from a medical standpoint as well. I prefer to steer clear of medicines, etc whenever possible as well. I refuse to take antibiotics, etc when I have a cold, opting instead to eat a couple of lemons, keep my fluids up and sweat the cold away by staying as warm as possible and sleeping it off. On the other side of the coin I don't think I would pass up some lifesaving medication which was pioneered due to animal testing but I personally perfer to avoid using things I don't "need" to get better such as the aforementioned antibiotics.

Realistically I understand that animal testing is a long way away from being abolished from medicine completely and that alot of important discoveries have been made due to animal testing which has subsequently saved countless lives, however I also believe that more money should be poured into alternate testing methods such as tissue cultures, etc.
 
Topics like these should perhaps not be started because they turn into nasty wars of opinion.
It evokes passion and emotion in people flaming and trolling in others.
This thread will almost certainly be closed in the near future :(

No! I didn't mean it turn into a topic about the pros and cons of animal testing!! I was just putting these facts out there because I think it's interesting to know what type, and how many of an animal is used in testing :blush:
 
I'm not going to voice my opinion on that - so don't assume what mine is.
But when you made the remark about lipstick (true or otherwise) you were bound to entice some views.
Statistics are all good and well, but over time I've seen all these similar types of topics closed pretty promptly here on TFF. They are just not wanted - due to their very nature (of it getting entirely out of hand and turning into a flaming war).

Not having a dig at you :) - just saying "don't expect a rational & civil analysis of this topic".
 
I am just about to go into my 4th year at uni and I am studying Biotechnology. I would never personally test on an animal. I very much prefer the idea that humans are used to test new drugs as its for humans in the first place but then there will of course be a shortage of volunteers.

Also I would like to mention that yeah, you can buy products that are not tested on animals but the ingrediants in these products were originally tested on animals in the first place, years ago.

Looking at those figures is a sad state of affairs really. But if you want scientists to come up with cures then I say cut them some slack. I would never have the balls or even want to do anything horrible to animals but in the name of Science it's gotta be done until we find alternitives.
 
Timmy, only a few days ago I thought of starting a thread like this. :) I believe that ignorance isn't bliss and that if we put across our opinion in a civil way there is no need for the topic to be closed. I personally buy cruelty-free, it's easy once you have a quick look at the verified lists. For example, Caring Consumer is a great site which lists many hundreds of Cruelty-free brands.

I gave a presentation at school on animal testing last term for our self-directed assignment and got the message across to some of my classmates, which is good enough for me. But if TFF members are willing to listen then we can share the good news that there are in fact many alternatives to animal testing.

Check out Stop Animal Tests - great website that gives the facts and this is a page giving info on the many alternatives to animal testing.
 
Oh and biotechnology is not also known as testing on animals. It actually refers to recombinant DNA technology. And involves genetic engineering at a cellular level.
 
While I agree that often these threads turn into long thread wars, this one seems to be being discussed without any heated arguments, and the facts stand and need to be seen. I would hope it wouldn't be closed, as I see no reason for it.

My main problem with animal testing, putting the welfare aspect aside (which is huge and done to death) is that it is mostly inaccurate. Drugs that are safe or cats and dogs/rats/guinea pgs are often not safe for humans, and vice versa. However, like has been mentionned already, human volunteers are thin on the ground, especially after what happened last year with the TeGenero "scandal". I don't see the need for animal testing other than financially, as there are alternatives which are far more accurate.

Edited to add: I wonder if anyone can find the numbers of people involved in drugs trials for the same period? That would be interesting for a comparison.
 
I hate this subject, it hurts my soul on many different levels but I know that, due to medical conditions, my five closest relatives in the world, my mother and father, my sister, my husband and my son, would all be dead now if there had not been animal research in the past.

I hate and loath the idea of the pain and suffering of intelligent, gentle, sentient creatures, but then I would not give up my family, and had I been put in one of those fictitious "What if...?" situations, I would have done the tests myself if that was what was required of me, and were I able to, and in doing so it meant I could save their lives over again.

I have deeply exposed myself to this subject, from both sides, over the years, and have opted to put it away in a box now, with the other things I don't want to see again.
 
I am concerned by the misconception that most medical advances are due to animal testing. If you read up, you'll find that many modern medicines were discovered through sheer serendipity, and were only confirmed with animal testing to rule out any potential side-effects that would result in big, nasty lawsuits for pharmeceutical companies. Animal testing advocates fly the flag of being the cornerstone of medical progress, but many medicines that were perfectly safe for humans in clinical tests and other forms of testing were delayed in reaching the market because they had unforseen reactions in animals. Did you know that Penicillin's life-saving powers were put on hold for years because of its fatal effects in some animal species?
While physiologically, all animals are remarkably similar, biochemically, EVERYONE is different - not just by species, but on a person to person basis. A drug that could save one man's life could kill another in a violent allergic reaction. A drug that gives one person seizures could have not a single side effect on another. Thus it stands to reason that, since drug testing isn't even reliable from person to person, it certainly is not reliable from species to species. Thalidomide has NEVER caused birth defects in ANY other animal - including our closest relative, the chimpanzee. Yet countless babies were born with horrific birth defects because of this drug which passed safety testing with flying colors.
The more reading you do, the more sicked you'll be by the fact that this archaic and unscientific method has kept safe drugs off the market and put dangerous drugs on it. Add to that the high costs that pass to consumers, and the appaling corruption that often results in companies picking and choosing which species or results they want to rush a drug to market, and it is frankly a mircale that we have as many useful drugs as we do. Forget the "poor, tortured animals" - animal testing is harming humans and scientific progress even more! While animal testing often has a accuracy of only a little better than 50%, human cell cultures, computer models, and other newer but dramatically underfunded methods have accuracy ratings of well over 80%. The sad mix of corruption and traditionalist thinking in the medical field has hindered our progress in medicine greatly, the resulting loss of human and animal life is a tradgedy we should all be raging against.

THAT SAID - I am *not* some kind of PETA freak who thinks that killing a single dog to cure AIDs wouldn't be worth it or something of the like. Until proper funding is allocated to more accurate methods of testing, I'd rather have animal testing than nothing. However, I think that collectively, we need to start making our voices be heard about the human issue of animal testing, because we could kill two birds with one stone - eliminating an outdated, inefficient practice, and stopping a whole lot of senseless human and animal deaths.
 

Most reactions

Back
Top