Betta is dying!! Please help! :-(

[tazmajazz]

okay, this is the first fish I've ever owned and I've become very attached to him. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I dont know what I can do. Here is the scenario:

Symptoms:
- loss of appetite for about 2.5 weeks. He ate a lot about 4 days ago but has barely eaten anything else in the last 2.5 weeks.
- he stays in his 'home' which is a plastic tree stump and only comes out every couple of hours or so to swim to the top and sip some air from the surface.
- he doesn't seem to recognize that I'm there, he used to swim up to me right away, not he either doesnt care or doesnt see me.
- He seems confused sometimes like he cant find his house. Sometimes after he swims up for air, he cant find the opening to his home.
- when he cant find the opening to his home, he just lays at the bottom of the tank partially on his side almost lifeless looking.
- I think he looks a little bloated around his gills but my girlfriend doesnt think so.
- His color is loosing brilliance

Tank conditions:
- He's the only fish in a 10 gallon tank
- the tank has an undergravel filter with air difusers and activated carbon
- I've tested for everything you can by a test kit for (amonia, chorine, cloramine, ph, hardness, etc) and the only thing that is a bit off is the hardness, the hardness is one notch too hard on the tested

What I've tried:
- I thought one of his fins was more scraggly looking that the other so I tried these fin-rot capsules. I used 2 of them and they turned the water real green which is what the package said they were supposed to. I waited 48 hours and used to more. Then I waited another 24 hours, did a 25% water change and replaced the activated carbon.
- a week ago, we did a full water change except for about a liter of his old water
- I've tried to feed him special betta food as well as freeze dried blood worms.

Additional:
The fin-rot medicin package said that the green in the water should go away after adding fresh activated carbon. I did this about 12 hours ago, and the water is still very green. He seems to have gotten worse since adding the fin-rot medicine. I cant really try any new foods cuz he wont even fome to the surface. If I go pick up his home, he seems to have plenty of energy to swim out but then just rests on the bottom. He looks very sad. I have a big bowl at home now with tap water that I've treated with ammo-lock and the stuff that makes tap water ok. I'm hoping to find out what I need to do to save him and I'll run home from work if need be and change him into the new bowl. I just wasnt sure if that would make things worse.

Any advice would be great, this is my first fish, I dont know what else to do, please help!!

Thank you very much in advance.

taz

 

[RandomWiktor]

Out of curiosity, do you know the fish's age? It is possible that he is simply old. However, if that is not the case:
I'm very sorry to hear this; sometimes out bettas get "mystery illnesses" that we don't know how to treat. The best answer is sometimes just using very basic treatment methods, and hoping for the best.
In general, the following is beneficial to the recovery of sick bettas:
- Higher temp - around 80-82 degrees
- Increased cover and hiding places
- The addition of aquarium salt
- Reduced stress outside of tank (think tank location)
- Indian Almond Leaf
- Small, frequent water changes as opposed to large, infrequent water changes, to ensure water condition remains favorable.
- In some cases, the addition of a broad-specutrum anti-biotic or anti-parasitic.
- Nutrient dense, varied diet (ie. live foods, frozen foods, quality pellets etc.)
- Decreased filter current
- Increased aeration (I know they are surface air breathers, but they also use thier gills for dissolved oxygen in the water; if the fish is spending a lot of time hanging out on the bottom, he isn't surfacing enough, and thus could use higher oxygen content in the water.)

Aside from that, all I can consider is that he perhaps has some kind of internal condition that is making him anorexic. Has he shown and previous symptoms of parasites or bacterial infection? Antibiotics can stress fish badly, but if he is doing so poor, it might be worth a shot; perhaps you could do a treatment using a broad-spectrum like tetracylene, followed by water changes, and an anti-parasitic? I haven't tried this in bettas, but I have in goldfish, and it has helped immensely.

The other possibility is a stomach tumor. Before he started refusing food, was he taking it into his mouth, "chewing" a bit, then spitting it out? Was he acting hungry but then refusing to eat? I've had two bettas that I dissected post-mortem who had large, hardened masses in thier bellies - def. not mere constipation. It seems to be common in some bettas, particularly from poor strains.

Good luck with treatment, and I'm sorry I couldn't be more helpful.

 

[tazmajazz]

Thank you for your reply!

Do you think that the green water is hurting him? could I have over medicated him? is it a good idea to put him in a fresh bowl with treated water or would that stress him too much?

I'm not sure how I would increase aeration but decrease filter current, could you please elaborate?

you're right about the hunger thing though, when he firsted started to show signs of sickness, he would swim up to the food, follow it around, stare at it and some times dart at it like he was going to eat it but then would just swim off, he did this for several days, now he doesnt even look at the food. I' prepared to call in a sick day and rush to the store to get whatever I need and run home to take care of him but I dont know what to do. Thank you for answering my post, any additional info would be great.

taz

Out of curiosity, do you know the fish's age? It is possible that he is simply old. However, if that is not the case:
I'm very sorry to hear this; sometimes out bettas get "mystery illnesses" that we don't know how to treat. The best answer is sometimes just using very basic treatment methods, and hoping for the best.
In general, the following is beneficial to the recovery of sick bettas:
- Higher temp - around 80-82 degrees
- Increased cover and hiding places
- The addition of aquarium salt
- Reduced stress outside of tank (think tank location)
- Indian Almond Leaf
- Small, frequent water changes as opposed to large, infrequent water changes, to ensure water condition remains favorable.
- In some cases, the addition of a broad-specutrum anti-biotic or anti-parasitic.
- Nutrient dense, varied diet (ie. live foods, frozen foods, quality pellets etc.)
- Decreased filter current
- Increased aeration (I know they are surface air breathers, but they also use thier gills for dissolved oxygen in the water; if the fish is spending a lot of time hanging out on the bottom, he isn't surfacing enough, and thus could use higher oxygen content in the water.)

Aside from that, all I can consider is that he perhaps has some kind of internal condition that is making him anorexic. Has he shown and previous symptoms of parasites or bacterial infection? Antibiotics can stress fish badly, but if he is doing so poor, it might be worth a shot; perhaps you could do a treatment using a broad-spectrum like tetracylene, followed by water changes, and an anti-parasitic? I haven't tried this in bettas, but I have in goldfish, and it has helped immensely.

The other possibility is a stomach tumor. Before he started refusing food, was he taking it into his mouth, "chewing" a bit, then spitting it out? Was he acting hungry but then refusing to eat? I've had two bettas that I dissected post-mortem who had large, hardened masses in thier bellies - def. not mere constipation. It seems to be common in some bettas, particularly from poor strains.

Good luck with treatment, and I'm sorry I couldn't be more helpful.

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[RandomWiktor]

I forgot that you have an undergravel; I have regular power filters, and use an airstone or air line/tube when I wish to increase aeration. I suppose a UGF doesn't produce much current? If not, then you could probably continue with normal filtration, and if you have a way to increade aeration, either via the filter or with a mild bubbler, it would be worth trying.

I honestly have never had experience with the medication you have described, though I do know that medications can be very rough on allready stressed animals. Figure, he hasn't been eating well or at all for over two weeks. This probably means he is compromised by malnourishment, and likely has developed some sluggishness to his metabolism. If he isn't metabolizing the drug correctly, it could be a problem.

I wouldn't change his environment so dramatically as to completely remove him from the tank; bettas are very territorial and become distressed when removed from familiar surroundings. I would suggest instead that you do several partial water changes until the hue of the water is less prominent. This would decrease the concentration of the drug significantly without the stress of being moved to another tank entirely.

 

[riogal_11]

I agree with the above. I would not change his environment so dramatically while he is already distressed. I would do the same and change some of his water out, it may have just been too much for him. I've found that sometimes, not treating with meds (especially if you don't know what it is) is the best thing to do.... Water changes, and salt could work wonders. Also a raised temperature. My boys get a bit sluggish if my water temp drops, so make sure his temp is at least 76-82. Have you tried feeding him anything other than his regular food and bloodworms. If you think he looks a little bloated (even if your g/f doesn't) try feeding him a shelled pea. It would be hard for him to refuse, as they normally love them. Also, you described a lot of things where you seem to think that he cannot see you or his home. Is it possible that something is wrong with his eyesight? I know this may not be the primary problem, but it could explain why he isn't reacting to you, or bumping into things while trying to get in his house. I assume bettas can become blind just like anything else, so it's worth a shot to see if anything looks abnormal. Or I could be totally off on all of this.... anyways... goodluck! keep us updated.....

 

[tazmajazz]

His temp is right around 82 degrees, I'm going to run home and do a water change, how much of water change should I change?

if he were going blind, what would I do to help him?

thanks again for the help!

I agree with the above. I would not change his environment so dramatically while he is already distressed. I would do the same and change some of his water out, it may have just been too much for him. I've found that sometimes, not treating with meds (especially if you don't know what it is) is the best thing to do.... Water changes, and salt could work wonders. Also a raised temperature. My boys get a bit sluggish if my water temp drops, so make sure his temp is at least 76-82. Have you tried feeding him anything other than his regular food and bloodworms. If you think he looks a little bloated (even if your g/f doesn't) try feeding him a shelled pea. It would be hard for him to refuse, as they normally love them. Also, you described a lot of things where you seem to think that he cannot see you or his home. Is it possible that something is wrong with his eyesight? I know this may not be the primary problem, but it could explain why he isn't reacting to you, or bumping into things while trying to get in his house. I assume bettas can become blind just like anything else, so it's worth a shot to see if anything looks abnormal. Or I could be totally off on all of this.... anyways... goodluck! keep us updated.....

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[riogal_11]

I would change about 20% of the water....... nothing as far as I know could prevent blindness...... if you have peas available try that when you go home.....

 

[RandomWiktor]

There have been members here with blind fish; perhaps they could offer advice? What ever happened to BettaMomma? She had a blind boy.

I currently have a male whose vision seems to be growing worse, and he too is having a great deal of trouble finding his food. I've now learned that I have to just be very slow and patient; he gets frustrated and leaves after a few missed pellets. I try to get in at least one pellet, at least 4 times a day. Sometimes if I shine a very bright light in the tank, he has better ease finding the food. He also has a better time with powerful smelling foods (from what I hear, fish have a very good sense of smell). So I suppose it is a possibility that your male could be blind or going blind, and simply can not find his food.

Wondering - could you use liquid fry food to keep him nourished? Shyboy used to be too frightened to eat, and became completely emacited in the store; he looked like a head on a stick with wilted fins, and laid on his side all day. I used to put liquid fry food in the tank, and I swear it was the only thing that got his strength up enough to start eating on his own.

 

[tazmajazz]

liquid fry food?!?! I've never heard of that! what is it and where can I get some of it? please explain further, thank you!

There have been members here with blind fish; perhaps they could offer advice? What ever happened to BettaMomma? She had a blind boy.

I currently have a male whose vision seems to be growing worse, and he too is having a great deal of trouble finding his food. I've now learned that I have to just be very slow and patient; he gets frustrated and leaves after a few missed pellets. I try to get in at least one pellet, at least 4 times a day. Sometimes if I shine a very bright light in the tank, he has better ease finding the food. He also has a better time with powerful smelling foods (from what I hear, fish have a very good sense of smell). So I suppose it is a possibility that your male could be blind or going blind, and simply can not find his food.

Wondering - could you use liquid fry food to keep him nourished? Shyboy used to be too frightened to eat, and became completely emacited in the store; he looked like a head on a stick with wilted fins, and laid on his side all day. I used to put liquid fry food in the tank, and I swear it was the only thing that got his strength up enough to start eating on his own.

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[xxSarahxx]

You should be able to get liquid fry food from your Local Fish shop or a large branch of pet store that sell fish stuff. I use Liquifry for my fish (made by Interpret)
I might have missed this but did we decide on how old he is? It really might be old age, it sounds like it might be age!

 

[tazmajazz]

You should be able to get liquid fry food from your Local Fish shop or a large branch of pet store that sell fish stuff. I use Liquifry for my fish (made by Interpret)
I might have missed this but did we decide on how old he is? It really might be old age, it sounds like it might be age!

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I'm not sure how to tell how old he is...
I have an update though that may help you guys provide me some advice!

I took the my betta friend to a fish doctor last night who said that he has either feces blockage, a tumor, or a parasite. Now, I dont know enough to tell how much this fish doctor knows so maybe you guys could help. She said that she suspects its more likely that its a tumor instead of blockage or a parasite because he is bulging out on one side. He was swollen on both sides about a week ago but now its only on one side. She also told me that my amonia level was real high. I have this amonia gauge in his tank that says the level is ok but apparently it doesnt work. I told I was using ammo-lock and stress-zyme and she told me that ammo-lock wasnt good because it just locked the ammo and them released it later...and she told me stress-zyme wasnt good because it put a bunch of extra crap in the water that wasnt necessary. I asked her what I should do about the ammonia and she told me not to worry about the amonia right now, and that I just need to make sure that the salt content of the water is high...
now that sounds odd to me, dont worry about the amonia right now? does that make any sense? isnt amonia the worst for my betta friend?

so her instructions were...and I'd like if someone could verify that this is an acceptable course of action, was since I already did a 30% water change yesterday, she told me to pour 10 gallons or so of tap water into a trash can lined with with a trash bag and let it sit there until wednesday night (which apparently lets the chlorine and chloramine dissapate, and then do a 75% water change on wednesday night. She said when I change the water, dont add any stress coat, ammo-lock, aquarium salt, or anything to the water. She also said to not let me eat at all. and then on thursday, bring in a sample of the water for her to test.

sorry this is such an essay but I'm lost and I'm real worried bout my little fish friend and want to make sure I do whatever possible to make him well...any thoughts? should I remove the ammonia? thanks for all your assistance!!

 

[tazmajazz]

Does anyone have any thoughts on what this lady has told me? or any thoughts on how to tell if he has blockage, a parasite, or tumor? any suggestions would great...thank you....

T

You should be able to get liquid fry food from your Local Fish shop or a large branch of pet store that sell fish stuff. I use Liquifry for my fish (made by Interpret)
I might have missed this but did we decide on how old he is? It really might be old age, it sounds like it might be age!

[snapback]904324[/snapback]​

I'm not sure how to tell how old he is...
I have an update though that may help you guys provide me some advice!

I took the my betta friend to a fish doctor last night who said that he has either feces blockage, a tumor, or a parasite. Now, I dont know enough to tell how much this fish doctor knows so maybe you guys could help. She said that she suspects its more likely that its a tumor instead of blockage or a parasite because he is bulging out on one side. He was swollen on both sides about a week ago but now its only on one side. She also told me that my amonia level was real high. I have this amonia gauge in his tank that says the level is ok but apparently it doesnt work. I told I was using ammo-lock and stress-zyme and she told me that ammo-lock wasnt good because it just locked the ammo and them released it later...and she told me stress-zyme wasnt good because it put a bunch of extra crap in the water that wasnt necessary. I asked her what I should do about the ammonia and she told me not to worry about the amonia right now, and that I just need to make sure that the salt content of the water is high...
now that sounds odd to me, dont worry about the amonia right now? does that make any sense? isnt amonia the worst for my betta friend?

so her instructions were...and I'd like if someone could verify that this is an acceptable course of action, was since I already did a 30% water change yesterday, she told me to pour 10 gallons or so of tap water into a trash can lined with with a trash bag and let it sit there until wednesday night (which apparently lets the chlorine and chloramine dissapate, and then do a 75% water change on wednesday night. She said when I change the water, dont add any stress coat, ammo-lock, aquarium salt, or anything to the water. She also said to not let me eat at all. and then on thursday, bring in a sample of the water for her to test.

sorry this is such an essay but I'm lost and I'm real worried bout my little fish friend and want to make sure I do whatever possible to make him well...any thoughts? should I remove the ammonia? thanks for all your assistance!!

[snapback]904931[/snapback]​

 

[riogal_11]

hmmmm...... that's some very interesting advice. I'm not familiar with anything such as bulges/blockages or anything.... Hopefully someoen more familiar with it can help. The only thing I will say is that the whole "don't worry about the ammonia" seems a bit odd to me... especially if it is HIGH???

 

[tazmajazz]

thats what I thought about the amonia...and she said it was really high too! if ammo-lock only temporarily locks thwe ammonia, what is the best thing to totally remove the ammonia? and how about the advice about leaving tap water out for two days and then doing a 75% water change with it without adding any chlorine remover, or ammonia remover, or sea salt or anything? I'm supposed to do the water change tonight and I dont want it to kill him. thanks for your help!

T

hmmmm...... that's some very interesting advice. I'm not familiar with anything such as bulges/blockages or anything.... Hopefully someoen more familiar with it can help. The only thing I will say is that the whole "don't worry about the ammonia" seems a bit odd to me... especially if it is HIGH???

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