Betta fish received critical hit

[Duckquarium]

Hi here’s my scape.
I have a betta, 1 bumblebee catfish, 1 panda Cory, 2 kuhli loach, and 5 ghost shrimp.
The betta and the lava rocks have coexisted with no issues for almost two weeks now but yesterday I woke up and noticed a large majority of the bettas anal fin was completely destroyed. I have since removed the lava rocks but I am wondering if the bumblebee catfish could potentially be the culprit since the betta DIDNT have any problems with chasing the shrimp around the rocks.
Now that I’ve added the kuhli loach and bumblebee cat he’s gotten damaged.
I’m not really sure

 

[Rocky998]

Hi! Welcome to the forum!
What is the tank size? What are the water parameters?

It could be fin rot but I am not saying that it IS fin rot... Is the tank cycled? And if so how was it cycled?

Kuhli loaches should always be kept in groups of 6 or more so depending on the tank size you should either get more or re-home them

 

[foxgirl158]

Bettas should also be kept by themselves. It’s very possible that he snapped and attacked someone, and they attacked him back. Can we have pictures and a video of the fish please?

 

[Duckquarium]

Hi! Welcome to the forum!
What is the tank size? What are the water parameters?

It could be fin rot but I am not saying that it IS fin rot... Is the tank cycled? And if so how was it cycled?

Kuhli loaches should always be kept in groups of 6 or more so depending on the tank size you should either get more or re-home them

I set it up using a 2.5 gallon tank that was already cycled, I put the betta in a cup while I transferred the water, aquasoil, plants, and filter with media to the 10 gallon tank.
Put the betta back in 2.5g fully bare while tank cycled for a week then introduced betta
Water parameters are as follows:
No2 3 ppm

No3 40ppm

Ph 6.8

Gh 30ppm
There’s definitely a nitrate/ammonia spike but is that enough to wreck his fins that badly over an 8 hour period?
Clearly not an ideal situation but if you read further you’ll see why I’m still a bit skeptical.

Bettas should also be kept by themselves. It’s very possible that he snapped and attacked someone, and they attacked him back. Can we have pictures and a video of the fish please?

So allow me to be very clear, he had the tank for two weeks, lava rocks for two weeks no issues.
Then I added the other fish, checked on him before bed no damage or issues, then the next morning (yesterday) I woke up and found him like this.

His right pectoral fin appears to have flesh removed to the bone (or what looks like bone anyway I’m no fish doctor) and his lower fins are almost completely destroyed.
Upon further inspection of the tank, only 3 out of 5 shrimp are left in the tank and one of them appears to have died, this could be to the water quality but again raises the question of what happened to the other two and where are their corpses.

 

[foxgirl158]

I set it up using a 2.5 gallon tank that was already cycled, I put the betta in a cup while I transferred the water, aquasoil, plants, and filter with media to the 10 gallon tank.
Put the betta back in 2.5g fully bare while tank cycled for a week then introduced betta
Water parameters are as follows:
No2 3 ppm

No3 40ppm

Ph 6.8

Gh 30ppm
There’s definitely a nitrate/ammonia spike but is that enough to wreck his fins that badly over an 8 hour period?
Clearly not an ideal situation but if you read further you’ll see why I’m still a bit skeptical.

So allow me to be very clear, he had the tank for two weeks, lava rocks for two weeks no issues.
Then I added the other fish, checked on him before bed no damage or issues, then the next morning (yesterday) I woke up and found him like this.
View attachment 157661View attachment 157662View attachment 157663
His right pectoral fin appears to have flesh removed to the bone (or what looks like bone anyway I’m no fish doctor) and his lower fins are almost completely destroyed.
Upon further inspection of the tank, only 3 out of 5 shrimp are left in the tank and one of them appears to have died, this could be to the water quality but again raises the question of what happened to the other two and where are their corpses.

If he had the rocks for two weeks with no issues, then you added more fish and he has issues, this leads me to believe that it was another fish.

 

[Duckquarium]

If he had the rocks for two weeks with no issues, then you added more fish and he has issues, this leads me to believe that it was another fish.

That’s what I was thinking but would a bumblebee catfish or kuhli loach be able to do that to a betta?

 

[foxgirl158]

That’s what I was thinking but would a bumblebee catfish or kuhli loach be able to do that to a betta?

I’m not very familiar with either of those species. Maybe @Colin_T @Slaphppy7 @Fishmanic could help?

 

[Duckquarium]

I’m not very familiar with either of those species. Maybe @Colin_T @Slaphppy7 @Fishmanic could help?

As far as I was aware all of the species I have are safe to keep with betta

 

[Colin_T]

Khuli loaches won't harm anything except small worms and insect larvae.

Bumblebee catfish are nocturnal predators that will eat anything small enough to fit in their mouth. This includes shrimp.

The catfish might have been out looking for food at night and felt the Betta's fin and bit it.

I can't see damage in the pictures, if you have some pictures that clearly show the injured area, I might be able to offer more.

At this stage, separating the Betta from the others would be the best course of action. You might want to move the shrimp into another tank too so the catfish doens't get them.

Poor water quality can kill fish or shrimp, and then the other fish and shrimp eat the bodies.

 

[GaryE]

My money's on the bumblebee as the culprit. Bettas can't defend the overgrown fins, and when fish accidentally take a bite and discover they are food, accidentally on purpose follows. You've put a predator, known to eat shrimp in there. It's not a mean fish - just a rough choice.

 

[FranciscoB]

I cant see any damage on the pics of betta. In fact, the opposite - nice fins, with new growing edges (still clear, not yet colored),

 

[Duckquarium]

Khuli loaches won't harm anything except small worms and insect larvae.

Bumblebee catfish are nocturnal predators that will eat anything small enough to fit in their mouth. This includes shrimp.

The catfish might have been out looking for food at night and felt the Betta's fin and bit it.

I can't see damage in the pictures, if you have some pictures that clearly show the injured area, I might be able to offer more.

At this stage, separating the Betta from the others would be the best course of action. You might want to move the shrimp into another tank too so the catfish doens't get them.

Poor water quality can kill fish or shrimp, and then the other fish and shrimp eat the bodies.

Yeah that makes sense, it’s more like I’m reading mixed things about the bumblebee online and it’s the only fish in there that I know nothing about.
Before the addition of the bumblebee he was fine, and I hear kuhli loach are fairly safe to keep with betta so I just got those at the same time.
I made the mistake of thinking that any (small) catfish would workout
I’m surprised about the water tho maybe too much fish?? I dunno I’m just gonna change water separate fish.

I cant see any damage on the pics of betta. In fact, the opposite - nice fins, with new growing edges (still clear, not yet colored),

I promise you both his fins were like a billboard before and now they’re like a sh*tty portland protest flag.

 

[betta4ever!]

I can't see damage in the pictures

cant see any damage on the pics of betta. In fact, the opposite - nice fins, with new growing edges (still clear, not yet colored),

I think the damage is in the circled areas. And I'm quite sure the bumblebee is the culprit. The best course of action is to move the betta to the 2.5 gallon tank, or even better, get him a 5 gallon. But the 2.5 gallon is just fine, if you can't go to bigger. I bet people will come and say 5 gallon bare minimum, but has there even been a research on whether bettas live longer in bigger tanks? No, as far as I know. So we're just guessing what the betta prefers. I know many people that keep bettas in 2 gallons for 5+ years with no issues. And please, in the 10 gallon, get 4 more kuhlis.

 

[Duckquarium]

View attachment 157693
I think the damage is in the circled areas. And I'm quite sure the bumblebee is the culprit. The best course of action is to move the betta to the 2.5 gallon tank, or even better, get him a 5 gallon. But the 2.5 gallon is just fine, if you can't go to bigger. I bet people will come and say 5 gallon bare minimum, but has there even been a research on whether bettas live longer in bigger tanks? No, as far as I know. So we're just guessing what the betta prefers. I know many people that keep bettas in 2 gallons for 5+ years with no issues. And please, in the 10 gallon, get 4 more kuhlis.

Youre quite correct, I didn’t notice there was any on top I’ll have to double check that. I’ll put him in a 2.5 for now until I figure out somewhere else to put the bumblebee.
I’m definitely a little worried about what to put with it though as I definitely wasn’t expecting such aggression from this fish.
I do have a 20 gallon tall sitting around doing nothing at the moment but I was hoping to save it for a pair of clownfish.

Unfortunately it would appear all of my shrimp have been eaten, the larger one is still being cleaned up by the kuhli loach..
I’m kind of surprised that such a small catfish is such an aggressive preadator.
What I’m now worried about is weather or not I have an Asian bumblebee or an African bumblebee.
We’re talking a 3 inch and the lives and safety of my fish difference here.

 

[Duckquarium]

Here he is fresh from the store, before introducing him to other fish.
As you can see there’s just minor stress breaks from the petco cup, most of which were almost all the way healed before the damage in question was done.