An Ick'y question

[goose]

Hi, I'm new here and pretty new fish owner. I have been treating Ick in my thirty gallon tank now for six days. Fish in the tank include: a platy, two female silver mollys, a black lyretail molly, three zebra danios, a female betta and a chinese algae eater. Fish that had Ick: all but the algae eater and the betta. I am treating them with Quick Cure and the only one that still has signs of Ick is the Black molly. I did a 25% water change 24 hours after the third treatment as instructed on the Quick cure bottle.
Questions: How long after all visible signs of Ick are gone do I need to continue treatment?

 

[Alien Anna]

It's generally recommended to continue the treatment for 10-14 days, longer than most cures recommend, since the ich can live in the gravel of your tank.

You also need to work out why your fish got ich in the first place, since it's generally a sign that their immune systems are working poorly. What is your ammonia and nitrite like in the tank? If you have either then your tank is not properly cycled, or the Quick Cure may have "crashed" your filter (i.e. killed off the beneficial bacteria). Follow the link in my sig for more information.

 

[goose]

Thanks, Alien Anna,
this is a really long response, but I am hoping it will give you some idea of the origin of my problem and maybe disclose something I did wrong that I haven't figured out already. Any more help/suggestions are welcome!

--I made the mistake of cycling the ten gallon tank with two bettas in it and ended up killing both of them, before I learned NOT to do that. My current parameters for both tanks are: Ph 8.0 (which is the Ph the water comes out of the faucet here and I was told not to adjust it becuase the fish here are used to it), Nitrates range 20-30, Nitrites 0, Ammonia 0, hardness and buffering are both about 120 maybe a little less. I've raised my tank temps to between 78-80 F. I was keeping it around 76 but heard that the Ick treatments work better if the T is higher--

I used "fishless cycling" when preparing my thirty gallon tank, by adding ammonia, checking parameters etc. It took almost 6 weeks for it to cycle.

I then quarrantined two silver mollys, two platys in the ten gallon tank for ten days. They looked fine but the day after I moved them to the thirty gallon tank, the Ick showed up on one of the platys skin, that one was dead before I could even start treating.

I had already put the three healthy zebra danios and a chinese algae eater in the thirty gallon tank that had been living in the ten gallon tank for a few weeks.

Unfortunately, the day I moved the platys and mollys to the thirty gallon tank, I bought six neons, a female betta and a black lyretail molly and put them in the ten gallon tank. Now, I had Ick in the thirty gallon tank, that was also probably present in the ten so I had to start treating both tanks.

I treated the ten gallon tank with half doses because of the neons. The neons have never shown a sign of Ick, and when the black molly got it, I immediately moved her to the thirty gallon tank so she'd get the full dose instead of the half-dose I was giving the ten gallon tank. ALL of the fish in the thirty gallon tank got Ick except for the Chinese algae eater so far.

The neons and two molly babies (that I saved from consumption when the black molly gave birth four nights ago) now are healthy in the ten gallon tank along with another small algae eater (I don't know what kind but resembles the Chinese but much smaller with solid stripe) now. I quit treating that tank two days ago. I had to move the female betta (she was disease free) because after I moved the platy and mollies, the betta started aggressively harassing the neons. Now she too has Ick, durn it!

What I think happened, and I'm learning not to do this either, is that first, I introduced new fish, or the water they were in, that were carrying Ick, to both tanks (either the platys or mollies probably had it already), I introduced too many fish at one time, and I didn't quarrantine long enough. So I think I stressed both tanks and now have a mess on my hands.

QUESTION: Also, I heard that mollies like a little salt and higher temps that other tropicals. The Ick seems to be harder to get rid of in them. The platy looked fine three days after I started the treatment, but the black and one silver molly still have signs of Ick and I'm on my eighth day now. The betta was fine until day before yesterday when she got the spots. Are you familiar with Mollys? Is the salt/heat thing true?

If so, I have ordered another ten gallon tank and will make it a special molly tank (I like them sort of) and prepare the water differently.

QUESTION: How would I know if I've killed off my beneficial bacteria? Would ammonia/nitrite levels climb again? If that's the case, my fish are doomed. I don't have another cycled tank (other than the ten gallon) to put them in.

WHAT I LEARNED:
1) Introduce only one or two fish at a time and quarrantine for two weeks first.
2) Study the fishes environmental needs and behavior traits BEFORE buying.
3) Have a backup, empty, cycled tank ready for sick fish/quarrantine.
4) Don't buy new fish to put in the quarrantine tank until quarrantined fish have been in their final tank and are healthy for at least one week.

Does this sound reasonable? I love this new hobby and I don't want to kill fish, or get burned out on it because of bad luck or ignorance. It's relaxing to sit back and watch the fish and I'd like to set up a couple of tanks at my workplace.

Oh, I went to your website on Autism, breastfeeding. I'd like to talk more about that. I'm a school nurse for kids ages 12-16 and have a couple of diagnosed autistic kids in the school. I'd like to know more, these kids are sometimes difficult to understand as far as their response to different situations, learning ability and response to their environment. I'm also interested in what you know about autism, I've seen so much speculation about cause, signs, treatment and it's all a confusing mess to me!
I also looked at your "avoiding new tank syndrome" site and will read that in more detail. Great sites!
Thanks for your help!

 

[CFC]

Mollies are actually a brackish fish (which means they preffer a little salt in their water, 2-3 tbls of salt to 2 1/2 gallons/10 litres of water) but unfortunately for them they are so hardy they can be kept in almost any water, some people even keep them in full marine conditions!

From what you wrote it seems you have a good idea of what went wrong and now know how to not do it again so i feel i have nothing to add on that note.

 

[Alien Anna]

I think with the fish you were spot on about the cause of the stress that precipitated the ich. I was surprised to read that you had to use a half-dose on your neons - I've used a fully dose (of Protazin) on my tetras and pencilfish and they're supposed to be "delicate". I consider that ich is to fish what headlice are to kids - yucky, always around but controllable. You're never going to have an ich-free tank (and you're never going to have a headlice free school).

I keep my mollies in a little salt, with my guppies and an SAE. Everyone seems happy as the salt is about half what mollies can happily tolerate, but it does keep ich at bay.

If you want to ask me questions about my website (autism etc. ) feel free to email me. I've also written the Autism FAQ which is held by a friend on his site. I have a form of autism (Asperger's Syndrome), one of my kids also has AS and another is autistic (with ADHD - oh bliss! ).