Advice And Help For Newbie

[DrunkenMunky]

Hi Peeps,
hopefully someone can maybe give me some advise as i am currently in the process of upgrading my tank and eqiupment, i currently have a smallish tank with 2 fancy goldfish(black moor and a red oranda i think) and am upgrading to a roughly 90l tank with internal box filter.
Firstly should i do away with this for a filter pump as tbh i'm not sure if they can work as well as a filtration pump? secondly any advise on plants as i'm quite keen to create a healty environment for my fish and will be increasing the no of fish maybe one more fancy goldfish and maybe some smaller fish?
I know i'm asking a lot for anyone to advise me on these but help with filtration,plants and fish would be awesome as i have seen a lot of good things about moss but not sure if they would help also which fish would get on with my existing fish as i really want them to all get on but love the fancy goldfish.
Sorry to inconveniance any one but have heard that this is a really good place to get advise from avid fish lovers

Thanks for your help The Munky

 

[crazyforcordoras]

2 goldfish is the max for that tank.

 

[DrunkenMunky]

i tought it was 45l for first then 1 more every 10l larger at least thats what i was advised before pardon my ignorance?

 

[Essjay]

You'll find lots of info in the cold water fish section of the Other Pets forum.

Goldfish need 20 gallons (70 litres) for the first one, and 10 galls (38 litres) for every additional one. So 2 goldfish need around 110 litres.
Taken from here http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/43980-gold-fish-in-tanks/

 

[fluttermoth]

i tought it was 45l for first then 1 more every 10l larger at least thats what i was advised before pardon my ignorance?

I'm afraid that advice was wrong. Goldies really do need big tanks. You'd be ok with a standard three foot/100l tank, but really no smaller and preferably bigger. I guess this is a good place to put my customary 'big goldie' pics

As to filtration; again the bigger the better. Most goldie keepers recommend external filters, but something like the Fluval U3 would do the job for the moment, although you might need to upgrade as they grow.

Plants are a bit hit and miss with goldies as they do like to eat plants. Things like elodea and cabomba are great; think of them as salad for your fishies and don't get too upset if you have to replace them at intervals; they're cheap plants anyway
Other things you can try are Jave fern and anubias; they're both quite tough and (apparently; I haven't actually tried them myself ) taste bitter, so most goldies will leave them alone, but I can't promise! I have no idea whether they'll eat aquatic mosses; I've never tried it.

 

[crazyforcordoras]

Again, i am horrible with liters.

 

[DrunkenMunky]

awesome stuff peeps i think i underestimated my tank litrage as its a bit bigger than 3 ft long and did lots of research last night, still i'm not sure wether to take internal measurements or external to work out the ltr/gallons but hey ho. this is the fun part also there is a pond if they get big enough so i have some food for thought. but should i get rid of the internal filter it doesn't have a pump and i've had so much success so far with my internal filter pump and want the best for my fish and am not sure wether the internal filter will do anything much without a flow of water through it.
hope that makes sense and thanks for help

 

[fluttermoth]

If you post the dimensions of your tank we can work out the size. Or you can work it out yourself using the 'calculator' tab at the top of the page

Fantails and moors can't live outside all year (assuming you're in the UK).

Is it a Juwel tank with an internal filter? If so, then it won't do anything at all without a flow of water through it.

 

[DrunkenMunky]

If you post the dimensions of your tank we can work out the size. Or you can work it out yourself using the 'calculator' tab at the top of the page

Fantails and moors can't live outside all year (assuming you're in the UK).

Is it a Juwel tank with an internal filter? If so, then it won't do anything at all without a flow of water through it.

na it was custom made for someones tropical set up and the filter box is removable, and according to calculator 50gallon
also has anyone ever used marimo moss balls as have been looking at them and according to material i have read they outcompete algea not that i have a problem with algea but thought it could be cool but bit worried as they can grow to a foot in ideal conditions

 

[fluttermoth]

Well, that's a nice size then! Do post the dimensions so we can check for you, if it's only a three foot, as that must be a very odd shape!

Moss balls are great; very easy to look after, and (most) goldies leave them alone. I've never known them grow that big, but if they do, you can always pull them apart and re-roll them into two or three new ones

Filters will do good only if they have water moving through them and are full of some kind of media (sponges, ceramic rings, bioballs). If it's just the box you might as well take it out and have more room in the tank

 

[DrunkenMunky]

Well, that's a nice size then! Do post the dimensions so we can check for you, if it's only a three foot, as that must be a very odd shape!

Moss balls are great; very easy to look after, and (most) goldies leave them alone. I've never known them grow that big, but if they do, you can always pull them apart and re-roll them into two or three new ones

Filters will do good only if they have water moving through them and are full of some kind of media (sponges, ceramic rings, bioballs). If it's just the box you might as well take it out and have more room in the tank

tank dimensions not including lid are 3ft by 1.5ft wide by 1.5ft high and box on end will post photo once set up as tbh looks a bit bare atm and needs a deep clean and maybe some gravel insidentally (not sure thats how its spelled lol) its there any way to figure what sort of quantity of gravel to buy as looking at mo and no one advises tank sizes but can get various sizes from 2kg -20kg and don't wanna over killit but was thinkin 2-3cm coverage in most areas

 

[MBOU]

By my reckoning... the way we work it out (for ponds generally) would make it:

3 x 1.5 x 1.5 = 6.75

6.75 x 6.25 = 42.18 (gallons)

42.18 x 4.546 = 191.75 (liters)

Thats only roughly as the measurements werent exact but cant remember full formula off top of my head. And then minus a bit for the gravel (5kg of gravel would be 5 liters etc).

Tank might be bigger than we both thought!

Your gravel looks great in the photos! So long as it isn't too deep as thats when it starts building up dirt and turns the beautiful white gravel a less than delightful shade of brown and green. But you are gravel cleaning anyway so all seems good!

Both fish looked very happy and stunning in that tank! And have fun making new features for the tank!

Here is video of the slate features i was thinking of (because you can make it how you like it!)

http/www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8XYoUOpRsg

The only thing I didnt (i dont think?) say was that it might be worth getting some liquid plant food (i said not to worry with substrate with plants on wood) but the liquid might help as the tank is so clean and new, the plants wont get so much nutrients in terms of nitrates etc from fish waste. Even if just dosing once a week might be good.

Enjoy those fish!

EDIT: Just in case, your Oranda is a very bronzed 'black oranda' and if i remember rightly, a female one at that as the males were all a lot darker an had their white spots on the cheeks at that size.

 

[DrunkenMunky]

By my reckoning... the way we work it out (for ponds generally) would make it:

3 x 1.5 x 1.5 = 6.75

6.75 x 6.25 = 42.18 (gallons)

42.18 x 4.546 = 191.75 (liters)

Thats only roughly as the measurements werent exact but cant remember full formula off top of my head. And then minus a bit for the gravel (5kg of gravel would be 5 liters etc).

Tank might be bigger than we both thought!

Your gravel looks great in the photos! So long as it isn't too deep as thats when it starts building up dirt and turns the beautiful white gravel a less than delightful shade of brown and green. But you are gravel cleaning anyway so all seems good!

Both fish looked very happy and stunning in that tank! And have fun making new features for the tank!

Here is video of the slate features i was thinking of (because you can make it how you like it!)

http/www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8XYoUOpRsg

The only thing I didnt (i dont think?) say was that it might be worth getting some liquid plant food (i said not to worry with substrate with plants on wood) but the liquid might help as the tank is so clean and new, the plants wont get so much nutrients in terms of nitrates etc from fish waste. Even if just dosing once a week might be good.

Enjoy those fish!

EDIT: Just in case, your Oranda is a very bronzed 'black oranda' and if i remember rightly, a female one at that as the males were all a lot darker an had their white spots on the cheeks at that size.

got to be honest its nice to get some advise from someone who clearly has a passion for there work will definatly get some pf probably sunday or monday and have already tied off the anubius and have reset up the tank and changed a few bits, hopefully it takes up a bit of room at the end and draws the focus to the centre of tank now but the anubius definatly has a kinda nice viney/ivyish look to it which goes with what i envisage for the future of my aztecy style idea which i may go for, just need to figure a way of creating some bricks that look kinda the same as my head. tthanks again

oh and forgot to add it always strikes me as wierd that the tank never looks that deep until you look at it from the side maybe i need an upgrade to a much wider tank and maybe another oranda male? never know may get little oranda's swimming about