(Need Help) Betta Fish still bloated after 3 days of fasting and daily Epsom salt baths.

He's currently in a 1.5 gal quarantine tank haven't added him into the 5G main tank which is fully cycled and currently just filled with a few shrimp. There is a heater and a filter for the hospital tank, at 77-78F, I only had my betta for 3-4 weeks and I been feeding him and fasting for one day per week in those weeks I had him. I fed my betta with a single hikari vibra bite, broken into smaller pieces since his mouth can't consume it entirely. I have tried a espom salt bath already on the first day I noticed the bloat, it didn't appear to help as well as of recent days I been doing daily once a day espom salt baths. I also been feeding him Hikari's freeze dried daphnia, but only in small amounts to help with fiber and every other day because I'm not sure if I should feed too often with this bloat. He hasn't pooped since the first day I noticed the bloating, and the pieces of poop I saw on the day of the bloating was that one was brown-gray and the other was red (most likely from food coloring from the pellets)
I'm not really sure what I'm doing wrong, since I am doing 1 teaspoon per gallon for the baths. I'm not sure if I want to try peas because I heard betta's can't digest them. He's still a bit active, just often hiding under things and staying near the heater. He's also still able to eat (as I just feed him a small amount of daphnia around 2 days ago of this post) and does follow my finger around sometimes when I come near. I haven't noticed any changes in his scales within the last 5-6 days he's been bloated, so he doesn't have dropsy. (I been actively observing from the top, I'll provide a recent screenshot of what he looks like below.
Also could anyone also suggest a diet I could do to prevent bloat from happening?

(Old picture 2 days after fasting to compare, please disregard the tape marks on the side, those are on the outside as I don't have any spare large tanks.)



As of Today (2/22/22) (Third image from the lighting looks like scales might be raised, but they are not. You can see that the bloating is a bit uneven (it was even before today), I noticed this during the espom salt bath I gave today. His belly size has been like this for the past 3 days now.)

I'm not sure what's wrong I'm afraid, but you're right, I see the uneven bloating...
Keep fasting, he'll be okay without food for a week or so even. Hopefully @Colin_T sees this and can help, he's the one who understands illness and disease, but I've also seen him say that he doesn't answer tags, so fingers crossed he sees this.

It's possible that he came to you carrying a worm burden, a parasite, or some kind of bacteria infection that has gotten much worse, since he's not responding to epsom baths and fasting. So whatever happens, remember that it may just be one of those things, that you were unlucky, but not at fault!

Other people who might be able to offer advice are @TwoTankAmin and @Naughts and @GaryE
I'm sorry I can't be any real help! He's a very beautiful betta

I'm a pessimist. I am going to guess a serious internal infection you can do nothing to remedy. Either he recovers on his own, about a 1 in 1000 chance, or he is, sadly, done for. His isn't in kidney failure because he shows no dropsy, but that may be a matter of "yet".
I wish I could be more helpful. I'm sorry.

I'm so sorry, but I've been thinking the same as @GaryE . Suspecting organ failure of some kind, and that dropsy (kidney failure) is likely on it's way... I'm so sorry.

I would stop the baths. They aren't helping, and only stress him out more. Let him rest in his own tank, keep the water clean with small water changes, and feed him his favourite foods - but not too much.

Please keep us updated. If he gets worse and seems to be suffering, there is a peaceful way to use clove oil to put them to sleep calmly, then overdose the clove oil, so they pass away in their sleep. A horrible thing to have to do, but I've done it a couple of times for fish that were beyond saving, and would have suffered longer without that. Can tell you how to do it humanely if it reaches that point.

Again, I'm so sorry that we don't have better news I'm putting out hopes that we're wrong, and he pulls through.

AdoraBelle Dearheart said:

I'm so sorry, but I've been thinking the same as @GaryE . Suspecting organ failure of some kind, and that dropsy (kidney failure) is likely on it's way... I'm so sorry.

I would stop the baths. They aren't helping, and only stress him out more. Let him rest in his own tank, keep the water clean with small water changes, and feed him his favourite foods - but not too much.

Please keep us updated. If he gets worse and seems to be suffering, there is a peaceful way to use clove oil to put them to sleep calmly, then overdose the clove oil, so they pass away in their sleep. A horrible thing to have to do, but I've done it a couple of times for fish that were beyond saving, and would have suffered longer without that. Can tell you how to do it humanely if it reaches that point.

Again, I'm so sorry that we don't have better news I'm putting out hopes that we're wrong, and he pulls through.

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Ah, well I'll try to give updates if I can. Hopefully he can pull through.

BloxcastJason said:

Ah, well I'll try to give updates if I can. Hopefully he can pull through.

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Sending out good vibes and hope for him and for you!

An update would be great if you can, whether it's good news or bad. It's nice to have closure to a thread. But mainly because it can help other people reading the forum, or people who search for the same symptoms and come across this thread.

Update:
I have added kanaplex yesterday, and he ate some of the powder as it came down. Gave him a little bit of Daphina as well. So far today, his bloating has shifted a little less I think, so I'm assuming the anti biotics are doing the job. I'll try to keep up the doses, though I feel like even then it won't be as effective. I'll be doing a water change tomorrow to redose.

Update: 2/27/22
2nd dosage is almost done, moving over to final 3rd dosage soon along side a resting period for the kanaplex.
My betta has a white stringy poop that's coming out of him I think, it's very very thin almost like a very thin piece of fiber or cloth. Doesn't appear to be a parasite. Could be something else though that's stuck on to his bottom front fins, but I suspect it is white poop.

3/5/22, gonna do a few more updates after this.
Betta is still bloated even after anti biotic treatment, though that was worth a shot. He's got a bit of fin rot from the stress. I'll be moving him into a 3.7 gallon tank now, so that'll hopefully help. Also while I was moving the decorations to the new 3.7 gallon I got, I found what appears to be white mostly clear poop on the bottom of the tank? (2nd image, sorry for the poor image quality this was the best I could get.)

Don't feed him (He can go around a week without any food). Continue with Epsom salt baths but do them upto 2 times everyday. DONT ADD ANY OTHER SALT, it could make it worse.. Epsom salt only.. What are his water parameters?

NearMeBettas said:

Don't feed him (He can go around a week without any food). Continue with Epsom salt baths but do them upto 2 times everyday. DONT ADD ANY OTHER SALT, it could make it worse.. Epsom salt only.. What are his water parameters?

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The espom salt baths that I tried before for a entire week didn't seem to do much, but I'll try again this week. Water parameters should be 0/0/0 since it's a uncycled new temporary tank, I don't have the time to wait for a tank to get cycled nor do I want to add my betta into my main cycled tank that I am still reworking. I already tried fasting before, but I'll give it a shot again I guess.

BloxcastJason said:

The espom salt baths that I tried before for a entire week didn't seem to do much, but I'll try again this week. Water parameters should be 0/0/0 since it's a uncycled new temporary tank, I don't have the time to wait for a tank to get cycled nor do I want to add my betta into my main cycled tank that I am still reworking. I already tried fasting before, but I'll give it a shot again I guess.

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Keep an eye on the parameters. He's basically in an in fish cycle right now.

NearMeBettas said:

Keep an eye on the parameters. He's basically in an in fish cycle right now.

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Thanks for the reminder, I'll keep a eye out for now.

Yeah this kind of sucks, 20 days later and not much of a improvement. It's not getting worse nor better, though from viewing from uptop, the sides are getting slimmer. Still decently active and can eat, swims normally as well but he rests a lot. I haven't seen much of any poop on the bottom of the tank either.
Salt baths ineffective, fasting 4-5 days then small feeding ineffective. Haven't tried kanaplex again either, don't really plan on doing so yet. I even tried getting him to flare at himself but it didn't seem to help either.
I'm starting to think this could be a tumor instead, since it has been slightly lopsided in the bloating this entire time.

Edit: Pictures below are from 3/25/22 (I apologize for the side way pictures, not sure what's causing it. His spine is not curving, it is just the way he is turning to face me.)

If the fish has been fat for a month or more and the scales are not sticking out, and the fish is still eating and doing normal coloured poop, then it's unlikely to be dropsey or an internal infection.

If the swollen belly occured overnight or within a 24 hour period (eg: the fish was slim one day but fat the next), that is fluid build up or an infection.

Tumours take weeks or months to grow and cause the fish to change shape.

Cysts can grow rapidly (a few days to a week) but normally take a few weeks to a month to cause that sort of shape.

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Anti-biotics haven't improved the situation so don't bother with anymore of them.

You could try leaving epsom salts in his tank for 12-24 hours and then doing a complete water change.

You could try feeding him every day with frozen or live foods and see if that helps. If he has a blockage in his intestine, the food might help push things through. You can use brineshrimp, daphnia and mushed up boiled peas with the skin.

If it doesn't improve and he stops eating, then I would euthanise him. But try more food and see if it helps.