Help my fish keep dying!

itsjustmeuc · Nov 4, 2021

Hi guys,

I am relatively new to freshwater, I have kept salt water for 10 years now.

My tank is around 170L, I have had it running for around 6 months now. I'll be honest and admit my cleaning had been a bit lax recently so that is no doubt a contributing factor...

Last Saturday I woke to find my six rosy barbs and goldfish floating, they had been fine the day before. My 8 rummy nose tetras and 3 albino corydoras seemed fine, I also had 5 platys which I couldn't find. Given the sudden deaths I thought maybe something had gotten in the tank so I did a large water change. A little while after the change my platys started to come out. They seemed ok but I did notice a couple had tatty looking tails. The next morning there was a dead platy and they were hiding again. Worried that maybe there was still something still lingering I did another large water change. The hiding platys started to come out again but I noticed after a few hours they were hiding down under the rocks again.
There were no deaths for a couple days so I bought another goldfish as my boy was very upset his fish had died, it only lasted 24 hours! It's eyes looked a little cloudy and around it's face it kinda looked like it had a thing white covering.
The next day another platy died, it had more of the white on it's fins and eyes looked cloudy. Today two platy's have disappeared, the one I could find was looking slow, eyes cloudy and tail a little ragged. I tried a 5 min salt water dip which he seemed to take ok and perk up a bit but an hour later, he's died too.

Up until now the corys and tetras have seemed ok, active and eating fine. The tetras are still active and eating but I have noticed a couple have started to get white patches on their bodies. The corys have no marks on them but are kinda sitting around and not really eating, they will take off if you nudge them but other than that just site there.

I don't believe it's ich as it's more patchy. I did use some blue plant ich treatment though as I had some on hand and I know malachite green is also used for fungal infections.

I don't know what to do from here, do I keep up the malachite green treatment. I've got no hope of catching the tetras to treat in a quarantine tank, I think even the cordys would be hard to catch.

I was thinking maybe fin rot and I've read use pimafix, melafix or stresscoat I've also read don't use them as they are snake oil. I've read use salt but I have plants and corys so not sure how that would work.

It's heartbreaking to watch these guys dying one after the other. My son was very attached to his goldfish and is almost in tears with each additional death. I've had a ich outbrach in my marine tank oince which was devesating but I knew what it was, here I have no idea what is going on.

I don't have all the test kits but I did a PH which was 7.4 and nitrate which was 5. Temp is around 25c at the moment.

itsjustmeuc · Nov 4, 2021

I couldn’t really get a good photo… this is the guy from today that died

Animallover😍 · Nov 4, 2021

itsjustmeuc said:
Hi guys,

I am relatively new to freshwater, I have kept salt water for 10 years now.

My tank is around 170L, I have had it running for around 6 months now. I'll be honest and admit my cleaning had been a bit lax recently so that is no doubt a contributing factor...

Last Saturday I woke to find my six rosy barbs and goldfish floating, they had been fine the day before. My 8 rummy nose tetras and 3 albino corydoras seemed fine, I also had 5 platys which I couldn't find. Given the sudden deaths I thought maybe something had gotten in the tank so I did a large water change. A little while after the change my platys started to come out. They seemed ok but I did notice a couple had tatty looking tails. The next morning there was a dead platy and they were hiding again. Worried that maybe there was still something still lingering I did another large water change. The hiding platys started to come out again but I noticed after a few hours they were hiding down under the rocks again.
There were no deaths for a couple days so I bought another goldfish as my boy was very upset his fish had died, it only lasted 24 hours! It's eyes looked a little cloudy and around it's face it kinda looked like it had a thing white covering.
The next day another platy died, it had more of the white on it's fins and eyes looked cloudy. Today two platy's have disappeared, the one I could find was looking slow, eyes cloudy and tail a little ragged. I tried a 5 min salt water dip which he seemed to take ok and perk up a bit but an hour later, he's died too.

Up until now the corys and tetras have seemed ok, active and eating fine. The tetras are still active and eating but I have noticed a couple have started to get white patches on their bodies. The corys have no marks on them but are kinda sitting around and not really eating, they will take off if you nudge them but other than that just site there.

I don't believe it's ich as it's more patchy. I did use some blue plant ich treatment though as I had some on hand and I know malachite green is also used for fungal infections.

I don't know what to do from here, do I keep up the malachite green treatment. I've got no hope of catching the tetras to treat in a quarantine tank, I think even the cordys would be hard to catch.

I've ready use pimafix, melafix or stresscoat I've also read don't use them as they are snake oil. I've read use salt but I have plants and corys so not sure how that would work.

It's heartbreaking to watch these guys dying one after the other. My son was very attached to his goldfish and is almost in tears with each additional death. I've had a ich outbrach in my marine tank oince which was devesating but I knew what it was, here I have no idea what is going on.

I don't have all the test kits but I did a PH which was 7.4 and nitrate which was 5. Temp is around 25c at the moment.

Maybe the fish have cloud eye and fin rot? Maybe the new goldfish brought disease into the aquarium.
Cloud eye:

Fin rot:

Wait and see what other members say, because I'm only a beginner.

itsjustmeuc · Nov 4, 2021

Thanks!

I was thinking fin rot as well maybe just they all went down so quick. I should have mentioned that above that's why I was looking at the melafix ect

Bettaguy08 · Nov 4, 2021

itsjustmeuc said:
Hi guys,

I am relatively new to freshwater, I have kept salt water for 10 years now.

My tank is around 170L, I have had it running for around 6 months now. I'll be honest and admit my cleaning had been a bit lax recently so that is no doubt a contributing factor...

Last Saturday I woke to find my six rosy barbs and goldfish floating, they had been fine the day before. My 8 rummy nose tetras and 3 albino corydoras seemed fine, I also had 5 platys which I couldn't find. Given the sudden deaths I thought maybe something had gotten in the tank so I did a large water change. A little while after the change my platys started to come out. They seemed ok but I did notice a couple had tatty looking tails. The next morning there was a dead platy and they were hiding again. Worried that maybe there was still something still lingering I did another large water change. The hiding platys started to come out again but I noticed after a few hours they were hiding down under the rocks again.
There were no deaths for a couple days so I bought another goldfish as my boy was very upset his fish had died, it only lasted 24 hours! It's eyes looked a little cloudy and around it's face it kinda looked like it had a thing white covering.
The next day another platy died, it had more of the white on it's fins and eyes looked cloudy. Today two platy's have disappeared, the one I could find was looking slow, eyes cloudy and tail a little ragged. I tried a 5 min salt water dip which he seemed to take ok and perk up a bit but an hour later, he's died too.

Up until now the corys and tetras have seemed ok, active and eating fine. The tetras are still active and eating but I have noticed a couple have started to get white patches on their bodies. The corys have no marks on them but are kinda sitting around and not really eating, they will take off if you nudge them but other than that just site there.

I don't believe it's ich as it's more patchy. I did use some blue plant ich treatment though as I had some on hand and I know malachite green is also used for fungal infections.

I don't know what to do from here, do I keep up the malachite green treatment. I've got no hope of catching the tetras to treat in a quarantine tank, I think even the cordys would be hard to catch.

I was thinking maybe fin rot and I've read use pimafix, melafix or stresscoat I've also read don't use them as they are snake oil. I've read use salt but I have plants and corys so not sure how that would work.

It's heartbreaking to watch these guys dying one after the other. My son was very attached to his goldfish and is almost in tears with each additional death. I've had a ich outbrach in my marine tank oince which was devesating but I knew what it was, here I have no idea what is going on.

I don't have all the test kits but I did a PH which was 7.4 and nitrate which was 5. Temp is around 25c at the moment.

You should get nitrite and ammonia testers aswell. I have the same type of problem with my fish kept dying. 1 it was cause when I got them they were already unhealthy and, 2 sometimes it was cause of nitrites or ammonia. That’s just what I think though.

Bruce Leyland-Jones · Nov 4, 2021

You're probably correct in that your lax cleaning was responsible, with a bacterial build-up and a huge ammonia spike which killed the fish and weakened the rest.
A goldfish, being a strictly coldwater fish, should not have been in a tropical tank. It didn't bring a disease in, you killed it by sticking it in a tropical tank.
Besides changing water, what did you do with the rest of the tank and filter?
Looking at that photo, there's obviously something very nasty on the decor, which suggests a more thorough cleaning is required.

You need to get a freshwater 5-in-1 Test Kit and test your water.
You need to know your ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels.
Knowing your water hardness and pH are necessary when it comes to choosing fish for the tank.

Currently, what do you now have in the tank and what are its dimensions, please?

Bettaguy08 said:
You should get nitrite and ammonia testers aswell. I had the same type of problem with my fish kept dying. 1 it was cause when I got them they were already unhealthy and, 2 sometimes it was cause of nitrites or ammonia. That’s just what I think though.

Many, many people say this and genuinely believe it. Sadly, it is usually basic fishkeeping ignorance that kills the fish and not some inherited ill health.

Bruce Leyland-Jones · Nov 4, 2021

itsjustmeuc said:
Thanks!

I was thinking fin rot as well maybe just they all went down so quick. I should have mentioned that above that's why I was looking at the melafix ect

Please hold off lobbing random chemicals into the tank until you know exactly what it is you're treating.
Most so-called medicines are, as you suggest, snake-oils and many problems can be treated with something as simple as water changes, Aquarium Salt or temperature increases.

itsjustmeuc · Nov 4, 2021

Bruce Leyland-Jones said:
Please hold off lobbing random chemicals into the tank until you know exactly what it is you're treating.
Most so-called medicines are, as you suggest, snake-oils and many problems can be treated with something as simple as water changes, Aquarium Salt or temperature increases.

Thanks Bruce,

I agree if I can not use chemicals I would much rather that. I have no idea how to work out what I have though. I will need to treat in tank though as like I said there is no way to catch all the fish. I was going to try use salt I was just wary as I have plants in there and I have ready cordys and tetras can be sensitive to salt??

Here another picture of my tetras. Again not great but you can kinda see some have white marks on them.

itsjustmeuc · Nov 4, 2021

Bruce Leyland-Jones said:
Currently, what do you now have in the tank and what are its dimensions, please?

Sorry Bruce I totally missed this post. I did a full clean out of the canister filter and the two sponge filters I also have. There is nothing on the rocks that I can see, that must just be the picture quality. I did note that the base of one of my sponge filers had opened and was rusty so I have taken that out.

My tank is 120cm x 35cm x 40 cm

All that is left now are my three corys and 8 rummy nose.

I did have a goldfish in there originally and he was big fat and healthy until the mass death! I hear what you are saying though that going forward they are not compatible. When looking for fish though I started with the goldfish and chose other fish that were supposed to be ok with goldfish.

I have an ammonia checker thing that sits in the tank which never changed color, it might be too old though so maybe didn't work.

I know we have hard water here in Adelaide. I just released I do have a nitrite test as well I just don't have the ammonia

I guess I need to just keep the water clean now and hope the rest pull through?

CaptainBarnicles · Nov 4, 2021

I would salt the tank

itsjustmeuc · Nov 4, 2021

CaptainBarnicles said:
I would salt the tank

I'll give it a go. Trying to find dosage rates which are still ok for plants and cordys... I came across a post, which was for a betta, that noted the following rates, would this work?

FishGuest5123 said:
Best thing for fin Rot is 50% daily water changes for 14 days along with aquarium salt at 1 teaspoon (dissolved) for every 5 gallons of water in your 1st dose. After this add 1/2 the amount of salt after each 50% daily water change ( 1/2 teaspoon per every 5 gallons).

I read on another page though to use 1 tablespoon every three gallons which is significantly more...

Aquarium Salt: How to Use It Properly for Treating Sick Fish

Should aquarium salt be used in freshwater tanks? After years of testing, we believe salt is one of the best, all-encompassing fish medicines on the market

www.aquariumcoop.com

My tank is around 160L which is approx 42 gallons US liquid?? (I have three "gallon" options imperial, US dry and US liquid, on my convertor so not sure I've used the correct one)
On the first option that would be around 8 teaspoons but on the second option it would be 14 tablespoons!!

I'll also need to allow for the reduced water volume due to rocks etc.

Colin_T · Nov 4, 2021

Hi and welcome to the forum

Did you add anything to the tank in the 2 weeks before this started?
How did you clean the filters?

-------------------
The platy in the pictures is covered in excess mucous, which is caused by something in the water irritating the fish. This could be poor water quality (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate), wrong pH, GH & KH for the species, or chemicals in the water.

The best thing to do is big (75%) daily water changes for a week, gravel cleaning the substrate each time you water change, and cleaning the filter.
Make sure any new water is free of chlorine/ chloramine before it's added to the tank.

If there is no improvement after a week of daily water changes and gravel cleaning, then it is probably something in the tank causing the problem. Maybe rotten food under an ornament or some other chemical that has gotten into the tank.

Do you have buckets and hoses specifically for the tank?
Has anyone been to the house and possibly put something in it?
Has anyone used sprays, paint, smoke or anything else in the room recently?

-------------------
If a fish dies, wait a month before adding any new stock. If there is a water quality problem or chemicals in the water, it can kill the new fish.

Adding new fish to a tank that has sick fish can stress out and kill the remaining stock.

Adding new fish can introduce new diseases and put more pressure on the remaining stock.

-------------------
Malachite Green (aka Victoria Green) kills external protozoan parasites but does not affect fungus. Malachite Green is carcinogenic (causes cancer) so avoid getting it on your skin and wash hands and arms with soapy water after working in the tank.

Methylene Blue treats fungus but it also kills filter bacteria. Salt kills fungus, however this is not fungus.

-------------------
Goldfish are fine in warm water and live in warm water all over Australia. The water temperature did not kill the goldfish.

Colin_T · Nov 4, 2021

To work out the volume of water in the tank:
measure length x width x height in cm.
divide by 1000.
= volume in litres.

If you have big rocks or driftwood in the tank, remove these before measuring the height of the water level so you get a more accurate water volume.

When you measure the height, measure from the top of the substrate to the top of the water level.

You can use a permanent marker to draw a line on the tank at the water level and put down how many litres are in the tank at that level.

There is a calculator/ converter in the "FishForum.net Calculator" under "Useful Links" at the bottom of this page that will let you convert litres to gallons if you need it.

----------------------
Below are my instructions for using salt in aquariums. However, the fish should not need salt at this stage. Try doing daily water changes for a week and getting all the gunk out of the tank. Then see how they do.

SALT
You can add rock salt (often sold as aquarium salt) or swimming pool salt to the aquarium at the dose rate of 1 heaped tablespoon per 20 litres of water. If there is no improvement after 48 hours you can double that dose rate so there is 2 heaped tablespoons of salt per 20 litres.

If you only have livebearers (guppies, platies, swordtails, mollies), goldfish or rainbowfish in the tank you can double that dose rate, so you would add 2 heaped tablespoons per 20 litres and if there is no improvement after 48 hours, then increase it so there is a total of 4 heaped tablespoons of salt per 20 litres.

Keep the salt level like this for at least 2 weeks but no longer than 4 weeks otherwise kidney damage can occur. Kidney damage is more likely to occur in fish from soft water (tetras, Corydoras, angelfish, Bettas & gouramis, loaches) that are exposed to high levels of salt for an extended period of time, and is not an issue with livebearers, rainbowfish or other salt tolerant species.

The salt will not affect the beneficial filter bacteria but the higher dose rate (4 heaped tablespoons per 20 litres) will affect some plants and some snails. The lower dose rate (1-2 heaped tablespoons per 20 litres) will not affect fish, plants, shrimp or snails.

After you use salt and the fish have recovered, you do a 10% water change each day for a week using only fresh water that has been dechlorinated. Then do a 20% water change each day for a week. Then you can do bigger water changes after that. This dilutes the salt out of the tank slowly so it doesn't harm the fish.

If you do water changes while using salt, you need to treat the new water with salt before adding it to the tank. This will keep the salt level stable in the tank and minimise stress on the fish.

itsjustmeuc · Nov 5, 2021

Colin_T said:
Hi and welcome to the forum

Thanks for all the info Colin!

No I had not introduced anything new before they started dying but it was dirty....

I had sprayed some fly spray in the kitchen a few days earlier, I know fly spray is toxic to fish, its possible a small amount may have drifted over but that was days before???

Oh I did see the bloody dog drinking from the tank a couple times

After the first lot of deaths I would have changed probably 75% and cleaned the sponge filters. I turned off the canister filter at that point for a day or so to give me a chance to clean that as well. After the next death a couple days later I did another probably 75% change and this time I also cleaned out the canister and put in new filter floss.

I used slightly warm water for topping up from the bathroom, each bucket was de-chlorinated before I tipped it in. I only use this bucket for fish but it has been sitting around the house. The hose I use is only used for fish as well.

I didn't vacuum as I was using a long hose to siphon water outside, I will make sure vacuum as well! I did note the sponge filters already look dusty?? after cleaning them a week ago.

I did find one of my missing platys this afternoon still alive!!! I will keep up the water changes as noted and fingers cross he pulls through

I have had my hands in there with the malachite green without washing so I will not do that again.

my tank is around 170L just wasn't sure how to properly convert to gallons as there were to many options on my convertor, so thanks for the link on that too. I do have quite a few large rocks in there .

The tetras have white patches on them would that be the same issue as the platy?

Colin_T · Nov 5, 2021

The white patching on the tetras is excess mucous, the same as on the platy just not as bad.

-------------------
When you cleaned the filters, how did you do that?
Filter media/ materials should be washed in a bucket of tank water and re-used. The dirty water should be poured on the lawn.

If you turned the power filter off for 24 hours the beneficial filter bacteria might have died. However, if the internal sponge filters were cleaned in a bucket of tank water, they should have sufficient bacteria to keep the water clean.

-------------------
The dog drinking tank water won't affect the fish. But if you had Malachite Green in the tank water, that is not really good for the dog.

-------------------
If fly spray was going to affect the fish, it would happen within hours of spraying so that is unlikely to be the issue.

-------------------
Do you gravel clean the substrate when you do a water change, or do you just syphon the gunk off the top of the gravel?

-------------------
I kept my fish buckets, gravel cleaners and nets in a plastic storage container and made it off limits to everyone. It stops people accidentally using the buckets for cleaning and the lid of the storage container stops chemicals and dust getting onto the equipment. Just make sure the buckets and hoses are dry before storing them.

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Help my fish keep dying!

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