How many guppies recommended for 10 gallon fish tank

Colin_T · Jan 27, 2019

Before you add any more fish you need to know what the GH and pH are. Livebearers (platies, guppies, swordtails, mollies) need hard water with a GH above 200ppm (250ppm for mollies) and a pH above 7.0.
Neon tetras and most other tetras come from soft water with a GH below 150ppm and a pH below 7.0.

If you have hard water the livebearers will be fine but the neons won't. If you have soft water the neons will be fine but the livebearers won't.

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You should also monitor the ammonia and nitrite levels for the next few weeks to make sure the filter has settled in before you add more fish. And if you do get more fish, quarantine them in the old tank for 2-4 weeks (4 weeks is better) before adding them to the main tank.

Guppylover3x · Jan 28, 2019

Colin_T said:
Before you add any more fish you need to know what the GH and pH are. Livebearers (platies, guppies, swordtails, mollies) need hard water with a GH above 200ppm (250ppm for mollies) and a pH above 7.0.
Neon tetras and most other tetras come from soft water with a GH below 150ppm and a pH below 7.0.

If you have hard water the livebearers will be fine but the neons won't. If you have soft water the neons will be fine but the livebearers won't.

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You should also monitor the ammonia and nitrite levels for the next few weeks to make sure the filter has settled in before you add more fish. And if you do get more fish, quarantine them in the old tank for 2-4 weeks (4 weeks is better) before adding them to the main tank.

Many thanks for your reply. All my current fish come from the same supplier. I’m also quite surprised that neons wouldn’t be suitable as they are a recommended tank friend for guppies. Maybe I will just stick to adding a few platies instead. If I do add fish earlier would it be ok to do so as long as ammonia and nitrates are both 0? I’m addition to correct gh/ph levels of course. Thank you.

Colin_T · Jan 28, 2019

It's irrelevant where the fish come (eg: which shop) because each species of fish either originates from soft, medium or hard water. Putting fish in water that they did not evolve in can cause long term health issues. Most fish are in pet shops for a couple of weeks and are then sold to customers and spend the rest of their lives at the customer's house. Most fish can tolerate living in water that is different to what they evolved in for a short time, but for long term health, they should be kept in water that is similar to their wild habitat. For most tetras this is soft water with a GH below 150ppm and for livebearers this is hard water with a GH above 200ppm for guppies, platies & swordtails, and 250ppm for mollies.

Neons are a peaceful fish that will not harm the guppies, but they don't naturally occur in hard water. If your water has lots of minerals the guppies and platies should do really well, but the neons won't do that well. If you have soft water the neons will do well but the guppies and platies won't do as well.

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You can add more fish now if you like, but monitor the ammonia and nitrite levels and do water changes if you get any readings above 0. Having said that, you should quarantine all new fish before you add them to a display tank to reduce the chance of the new fish introducing a disease into your current tank.

The choice is entirely up to you if you want to quarantine new fish, but you could introduce a disease into the new tank and have to treat it, which will stress the fish out.

Guppylover3x · Jan 28, 2019

Colin_T said:
It's irrelevant where the fish come (eg: which shop) because each species of fish either originates from soft, medium or hard water. Putting fish in water that they did not evolve in can cause long term health issues. Most fish are in pet shops for a couple of weeks and are then sold to customers and spend the rest of their lives at the customer's house. Most fish can tolerate living in water that is different to what they evolved in for a short time, but for long term health, they should be kept in water that is similar to their wild habitat. For most tetras this is soft water with a GH below 150ppm and for livebearers this is hard water with a GH above 200ppm for guppies, platies & swordtails, and 250ppm for mollies.

Neons are a peaceful fish that will not harm the guppies, but they don't naturally occur in hard water. If your water has lots of minerals the guppies and platies should do really well, but the neons won't do that well. If you have soft water the neons will do well but the guppies and platies won't do as well.

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You can add more fish now if you like, but monitor the ammonia and nitrite levels and do water changes if you get any readings above 0. Having said that, you should quarantine all new fish before you add them to a display tank to reduce the chance of the new fish introducing a disease into your current tank.

The choice is entirely up to you if you want to quarantine new fish, but you could introduce a disease into the new tank and have to treat it, which will stress the fish out.

Many thanks for your help. My old fish tank will not make a very good Quranatine tank at the moment. I am still looking for another location to place this tank as I also wanted to set it up for a Betta fish. Due to it not being a small tank (as small as some anyway) a new location has been difficult to find. I will have to add them and see how I get along however I’m waiting at least a week to let my current fish settle. I agree with all your advice, excellent as always. I did not know neons wouldn’t be suitable. Many thanks.

Colin_T · Jan 28, 2019

Neons could be fine in your tank but it depends on the general hardness. If your water is soft then neons will be fine but guppies will struggle and vice versa if the water is hard.

Guppylover3x · Jan 28, 2019

From what I’ve gathered the general water quality in my area is soft anyway so if this is the case then neons would be fine in my tank. This being said I never have any problems with my GH PH KH. I know neons are better kept in shoals how many would you recommend? If I still wanted to add maybe 1/2 guppies. I think guppies are best kept in groups of at least 4+ to prevent bullying or pecking orders! I was hoping the platies would show the guppies how to behave better! How many of these would you recommend being kept together? Many thanks for your advice.

Byron · Jan 28, 2019

Guppylover3x said:
From what I’ve gathered the general water quality in my area is soft anyway so if this is the case then neons would be fine in my tank. This being said I never have any problems with my GH PH KH.

You cannot say you have never had problems with GH, pH or KH as you do not know the levels in your source water. If it really is soft (without the number we cannot know, as "soft" has been used on this forum for everything from very soft to moderately hard water, we need the number and unit of measurement) then fish like guppies and all livebearers will not be healthy. They may live for several months (depends just how soft the water is) but they will be under stress, their metabolism will not function properly, their physiology will be compromised, and they will die prematurely. This is guaranteed, again depending upon the actual GH and pH.

You should be able to find out the GH, pH and KH from your municipal water authority, check their website or call them. Be sure you get the number and their measurement unit so we will know.

Guppylover3x said:
I know neons are better kept in shoals how many would you recommend? If I still wanted to add maybe 1/2 guppies. I think guppies are best kept in groups of at least 4+ to prevent bullying or pecking orders! I was hoping the platies would show the guppies how to behave better! How many of these would you recommend being kept together?

This is only a 10g tank and you do not have room for any platies, they need at minimum a 24-inch 20 gallon tank. No other fish should be considered until we have the GH (especially) and pH pinned down.

Guppylover3x · Jan 28, 2019

Byron said:
You cannot say you have never had problems with GH, pH or KH as you do not know the levels in your source water. If it really is soft (without the number we cannot know, as "soft" has been used on this forum for everything from very soft to moderately hard water, we need the number and unit of measurement) then fish like guppies and all livebearers will not be healthy. They may live for several months (depends just how soft the water is) but they will be under stress, their metabolism will not function properly, their physiology will be compromised, and they will die prematurely. This is guaranteed, again depending upon the actual GH and pH.

You should be able to find out the GH, pH and KH from your municipal water authority, check their website or call them. Be sure you get the number and their measurement unit so we will know.

This is what I have found online for the water quality in my area.

This is only a 10g tank and you do not have room for any platies, they need at minimum a 24-inch 20 gallon tank. No other fish should be considered until we have the GH (especially) and pH pinned down.

Byron · Jan 28, 2019

Clark degrees (also called English degrees) at 1.68 equates to 1.35 dG or 24 ppm. That is very soft water.

Livebearers including guppies will not be healthy in this water, so look at soft water species. Most fish from South America and SE Asia will be fine, but keep the small tank size in mind. Neon tetras could work water wise, though they should be in at least a 20g. For a 10g soft water tank, the various nano species like Ember Tetras, the pygmy cories (if you have sand substrate), dwarf rasboras, and similar fish are ideal.

Guppylover3x · Jan 28, 2019

Byron said:
Clark degrees (also called English degrees) at 1.68 equates to 1.35 dG or 24 ppm. That is very soft water.

Livebearers including guppies will not be healthy in this water, so look at soft water species. Most fish from South America and SE Asia will be fine, but keep the small tank size in mind. Neon tetras could work water wise, though they should be in at least a 20g. For a 10g soft water tank, the various nano species like Ember Tetras, the pygmy cories (if you have sand substrate), dwarf rasboras, and similar fish are ideal.

Many thanks for clearing that up for me. Is there anything I could do to help my guppies currently as these are already in and I am looking to add more due to guppies working better when kept in groups. I will keep in mind that my water quality is soft now. I’ll make sure I don’t add platies in but will look at neons as these work well in soft water as you stated my current quality would be perfect even if they aren’t in a 20g. Many thanks for your help.

Byron · Jan 28, 2019

Guppylover3x said:
Many thanks for clearing that up for me. Is there anything I could do to help my guppies currently as these are already in and I am looking to add more due to guppies working better when kept in groups. I will keep in mind that my water quality is soft now. I’ll make sure I don’t add platies in but will look at neons as these work well in soft water as you stated my current quality would be perfect even if they aren’t in a 20g. Many thanks for your help.

Guppies do not need groups, so please do not get any more guppies or other livebearers, they will not be healthy in this water.

You have two options, or three actually. 1) Re-home the three guppies and then select soft water species, 2) leave the three guppies and add suitable soft water species knowing the guppies will weaken [I've no idea if this is "painful" to fish, I only know it weakens them as they cannot function properly], or 3) raise the GH and pH for harder water fish and then avoid any soft water species.

The soft water fish will be ideal in this water. While it is true that raising the GH and pH somewhat may still be manageable, this is not the way to go when fish health is at stake. You have ideal water for soft water species, so stay with that. It makes life much easier for you and your fish, as water changes are very easy, compared to having to adjust water each time. And there are two ways to raise hardness, either with a calcareous substrate or with additives. I have done this twice. There is no doubt I am much happier now with being able to use my tap water for my wild caught soft water fish.

If you decide on neons for the 10g, you will not want guppies or anything else, as a group of neons (8-10) will do it. I would not advise this in a 10g.

Guppylover3x · Jan 28, 2019

Byron said:
Guppies do not need groups, so please do not get any more guppies or other livebearers, they will not be healthy in this water.

You have two options, or three actually. 1) Re-home the three guppies and then select soft water species, 2) leave the three guppies and add suitable soft water species knowing the guppies will weaken [I've no idea if this is "painful" to fish, I only know it weakens them as they cannot function properly], or 3) raise the GH and pH for harder water fish and then avoid any soft water species.

The soft water fish will be ideal in this water. While it is true that raising the GH and pH somewhat may still be manageable, this is not the way to go when fish health is at stake. You have ideal water for soft water species, so stay with that. It makes life much easier for you and your fish, as water changes are very easy, compared to having to adjust water each time. And there are two ways to raise hardness, either with a calcareous substrate or with additives. I have done this twice. There is no doubt I am much happier now with being able to use my tap water for my wild caught soft water fish.

If you decide on neons for the 10g, you will not want guppies or anything else, as a group of neons (8-10) will do it. I would not advise this in a 10g.

Thanks for your reply. If the fish are already used to soft water could this make a difference? It’s difficult to say, but if the fish have been bred into this water already could it work? I have known many people use the same soft water I’ve used and had guppies live for years. Maybe they were just lucky. I know guppies don’t have to be kept in shoals like neons etc. However, in personal experience I have always found keeping more male guppies reduces aggression and they certainly get on better. I also want to add live food into their diet as I usually stick to flakes. I’ve purchased some dried red blood worms today. I must say I am disappointed that I won’t be able to purchase anymore guppies and there’s not much I can do to change this. Thank you.

Byron · Jan 28, 2019

Guppylover3x said:
Thanks for your reply. If the fish are already used to soft water could this make a difference? It’s difficult to say, but if the fish have been bred into this water already could it work? I have known many people use the same soft water I’ve used and had guppies live for years. Maybe they were just lucky.

This is a complicated issue to explain, but I will do my best.

First, no fish can get used to water that is outside the preference for that species. Every species of freshwater fish on this planet has evolved to function best in very specific parameters (the entire environment is also part of this). It takes thousands of years for fish physiology to change, and some species cannot at all; this is part of the issue of the extinction of species due to all the environmental changes we are causing. There is a limit to a species ability to adapt, and the degree to which it may adapt can vary a lot between species.

This takes us to the breeding water point. Some species can seem to adapt more than others. But even if they live through the process, there is still a general weakening of the fish that is internal and not outwardly obvious. Unless thee fish slowly weakening affects it health in various ways, like increased disease susceptibility, lethargy, increased aggression...and always a shorter than normal lifespan for that species. The minerals dissolved in hardish water are needed by the fish to function properly, and these cannot be supplemented in any way such as food, at least not that anyone has ever suggested; adding minerals to the water is what is needed.

We cannot know how the fish "feels" when we force it into an environment for which it is not designed nor intended. Fish swimming around the tank, even spawning, can occur regardless, unless the difference is very significant. Guppies are very weak fish to begin with, due to the generations of inbreeding. This makes them more susceptible to disease, but at the same time it may be the reason they can seem to manage in parameters that are not those for which they have evolved. Accepting nature's requirements seems the safest course. And our goal as aquarists should be to have fish thrive, not just survive.

Byron · Jan 28, 2019

Guppylover3x said:
I also want to add live food into their diet as I usually stick to flakes. I’ve purchased some dried red blood worms today.

Live foods are nice as treats, but unless you can provide an array of different live foods, they should not be considered as staple. The prepared foods available today by some manufacturers are more nutritious than anything else, unless one could provide a complete natural diet. And some would say the fish fed on prepared foods would be healthier even then.

Bloodworms should be fed no more often than once a week, as they do have issues for fish. And soak them first before adding them to the tank so the fish do not eat "dried" bloodworms which then expand in the fish's body and can cause problems.

Guppylover3x · Jan 28, 2019

Byron said:
This is a complicated issue to explain, but I will do my best.

First, no fish can get used to water that is outside the preference for that species. Every species of freshwater fish on this planet has evolved to function best in very specific parameters (the entire environment is also part of this). It takes thousands of years for fish physiology to change, and some species cannot at all; this is part of the issue of the extinction of species due to all the environmental changes we are causing. There is a limit to a species ability to adapt, and the degree to which it may adapt can vary a lot between species.

This takes us to the breeding water point. Some species can seem to adapt more than others. But even if they live through the process, there is still a general weakening of the fish that is internal and not outwardly obvious. Unless thee fish slowly weakening affects it health in various ways, like increased disease susceptibility, lethargy, increased aggression...and always a shorter than normal lifespan for that species. The minerals dissolved in hardish water are needed by the fish to function properly, and these cannot be supplemented in any way such as food, at least not that anyone has ever suggested; adding minerals to the water is what is needed.

We cannot know how the fish "feels" when we force it into an environment for which it is not designed nor intended. Fish swimming around the tank, even spawning, can occur regardless, unless the difference is very significant. Guppies are very weak fish to begin with, due to the generations of inbreeding. This makes them more susceptible to disease, but at the same time it may be the reason they can seem to manage in parameters that are not those for which they have evolved. Accepting nature's requirements seems the safest course. And our goal as aquarists should be to have fish thrive, not just survive.

Thank you for taking the time to explain this Byron. This all makes sense. It’s a shame a shame there is no way of adding these natural minerals from hardy water that the fish need. You mentioned not keeping neons with guppies in a 10 gallon. I know neons are best in large groups. I have heard the minimum is 6. Would 6 neons be ok in with the guppies? I think there’s a number of factors that can contribute to weakening a fishes immune system. Even netting a fish to take home can be a stressful process to which can weaken a fishes immune system. Thank for the advice.

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