Yes My First Crown

You weren't flamed at all. I've seen hellish flaming and that wasn't it.

Oscar Betta said:

Actually bettas may be more happy in 2.5 gallons because they don't like a bunch of empty space.

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I bought a 10-gallon for one of my female bettas and discovered she would have been fine in smaller tank. For her tank, I went crazy with decor, including three massive silk plants, two terra cotta pots, and some ancient "ruins," and she still swims around the front of the tank and up at the top because she's MORE interested in what's going on outside of her tank! Another of my bettas, in a 5-gallon, hides in the plants. Actually he LAYS in them, kicking back and relaxing.

Goes to show, it's more about what the betta's personality is like NOT what the "golden rule" of betta ownership & opinion dictates.

*waves at the logic floating by*

GuppyGoddess said:

Yep, I get flamed all the time for one of mine being in a 2-gallon.

Generally for smaller betta homes, I think aside from limiting the substrate to create more water space, it's important NOT to do 100% water changes daily because that causes little bubbles to appear on the inside of the tank and decor. Anyone notice that? It can cause gas bubble disease. I while back someone posted a photo of a betta with a bubble on it's tail and THAT was what caused it.

You have to create balance between low ammonia and other factors that keep the betta happy/healthy.

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What's gas bubble disease? Bubbles you see after water changes are just gas trapped in the water and will disppear fairly quickly 100% water changes aren't good though as it's like acclimatising the fish to new water every day which can only cause stress. So if they are the only way to keep your water clean, then the tank isn't suitable.

Sorry, I've just read through this thread and Oscar Betta is giving some f the worst advice I've had the misfortune to read on this forum. Honeythorn, Kizno and others are giving excellent advice, and Oscar Betta keeps contradicting them and misleading the poster, who needs to listen to the majority of advice, not what they want to here.

...

Rant over.

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What's gas bubble disease? Bubbles you see after water changes are just gas trapped in the water and will disppear fairly quickly 100% water changes aren't good though as it's like acclimatising the fish to new water every day which can only cause stress. So if they are the only way to keep your water clean, then the tank isn't suitable.
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I read about it in a tropical fish book NOT on an online website. The book is downstairs, so I quickly did a google and found this very long quote:



Gas Bubble Disease (Tropical Fishlopaedia - Bailey & Burgess)

Gas bubble disease results from gas (usually nitrogen) supersaturation of the aquarium water and is analogous to the ‘bends in human divers.
Signs: Lethargy, usually with no other signs of disease; microscopical examination of the gills may reveal small bubbles on the gill filaments. If there are gas bubbles on the glass and other surfaces in the aquarium and the fish appear unwell, then suspect gas bubble disease. In acute cases the fish may have bubbles adhering to their external surfaces. Death may ensue, and sub-lethal exposure can result in brain damage. In the case of breeding and rearing aquaria, affected eggs and fry may become buoyant, and fry yolk-sacs visibly distended with gas.
Cause: Gas (chiefly nitrogen) supersaturation of the water, usually occurring when cold gas-rich, water is heated quickly - as the temperature rises, its capacity for carrying gases decreases, leading to supersaturation and the formation of bubbles (the same phenomenon can be seen in saucepans of cold water put on to heat).
Gas supersaturation commonly occurs where freshly-drawn (and hence likely to be gas-rich) cold water has been used to fill a newly set up aquarium and rapidly heated to operating temperature; or if cold, or rapidly warmed, water is used to refill after a large partial change. Fish exposed to such conditions breathe in the excess concentrations of gas which may subsequently come out of solution in the blood and cause gas embolism (the obstruction of blood vessels by gas bubbles).
It is possible, but unlikely, that the use of high-turnover powerheads, with venturis, in too small an aquarium might also cause gas supersaturation. Sensible use of appropriate equipment will avoid any chance of this.
Prevention: Freshly-drawn cold water should be warmed and aerated (to drive off excess gases) before being used for water changes. Fish should not be placed in a newly set up aquarium until it is biologically mature, buy which time excess gases will have dissipated naturally.
Treatment: Move the fish to another, problem-free aquarium; otherwise drive off the excess gas by aerating vigorously or otherwise agitating the water.
Comment: Specialised (and expensive) equipment is needed to measure nitrogen levels in water, but the ‘finger test’ can be used to test for gas supersaturation: if numerous bubbles form on a dry finger immersed in the aquarium for about a minute, there may be a supersaturation problem. This test can also be used for checking recently-drawn water before it is added to the aquarium

Massively agree with jonty and Honeythorn.

Why would you buy 1 tetra, they are supposed to be kept in groups. Have you got a filter and heater?

Your tetra is going to be very nippy unless its kept with atleast 5 others. And no, dont get more because your tank size is not suitable for anything apart from snails. Lunar. my VT betta is kept in a community with 8 cardinal tetras, and as they are in a group they aint nippy. They keep themselves to themselves.

I dont see how a betta can swim and live in 3 litres permanently,

Treatment: Move the fish to another, problem-free aquarium; otherwise drive off the excess gas by aerating vigorously or otherwise agitating the water.

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Otherwise known as really blasting the water into the bucket to drive off gases, and then letting it sit for a few mins while stirring vigourously with a planting stick before adding to the tank. Nothing technical about it and as long as you don't pour water directly on top of swimming fish they should have no trouble whatsoever.

Honeythorn said:

Treatment: Move the fish to another, problem-free aquarium; otherwise drive off the excess gas by aerating vigorously or otherwise agitating the water.

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Otherwise known as really blasting the water into the bucket to drive off gases, and then letting it sit for a few mins while stirring vigourously with a planting stick before adding to the tank. Nothing technical about it and as long as you don't pour water directly on top of swimming fish they should have no trouble whatsoever.

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When someone is changing out 100% of water in a fish BOWL, they may not take the time to first blast water into a bucket and stir with a stick.

I posted to be helpful.

or you just get a 5g tank with heater and filter so theres no need to do 100% waterchanges

Not only should the fish not be in a bowl in the first place, if someone can't be bothered to take the time to gas off the nitrogen before adding it to anything containing fish, then they shouldn't be too amazed at finding bubbles on the sides and on their fish if they poured the water directly onto it.

Yet another downside to bowls, the fish has nowhere to escape to in order to get away from the flow of water being poured or tipped in. In a tank they can simply go into a corner while you pour the water into the opposite corner, or wherever the fish isn't swimming.

Cheers!

I definitely agree that a 5 gallon (that's UK gallons which is 4.5 litres per gallon) is a really good size for a betta. I'll annoy a few people by saying that I think as long as the tank is set up correctly, 14 litres (approx 3 UK gallons) is also a good size, but NO lower. I hate these 2.5 minibows that you get in the US. Most won't take a sensible heater or a decent filter and only experienced keepers who really know their fish should try small tanks, as they can use their knowledge to avert problems and make good use of the space.

So, OP, my advice is to see about getting a 14-28 litre (or BIGGER) tank per fish, or a larger tank and divide it. You'll be able to filter it more easily, have more space for plants and caves and generally make it a much better and more natural environment. Your bettas should reward you by being more active, behaving more naturally, having brighter colours and generally being healthier. If you wouldn't keep a kitten in a shoebox, please don't keep a betta in a small bowl.

HOWEVER - some of the people in this thread have been very aggressive and critical. It doesn't matter how good the advice is, if people feel attacked and heavily criticised, they are less likely to take the advice. Be polite, be nice and give the advice in a caring way, rather than ranting about how awful some people are or how badly they keep their fish. A smile goes a long way, even online.

Gas supersaturation commonly occurs where freshly-drawn (and hence likely to be gas-rich) cold water has been used to fill a newly set up aquarium and rapidly heated to operating temperature; or if cold, or rapidly warmed, water is used to refill after a large partial change.

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Who would do a 100% water change with cold water? Thanks for the quote. I think the way I do water changes means I won't have a problem with this

2.5 gal minimum...limited substrate (just enough to hold down plants), DIY sponge filter (you can make these so easily and are customizable for size...so you need to find the proper tub to make them out of(tall and thin so it fits in the corner), 15 watt heater from walmart( they are very small..about 1.5" diameter and around 5" long...guards on them so they dont melt plastic tanks. very very reliable/accurate as well). check stats daily for a month AFTER cycling to get a feel for waterchange regime. mine get 30% twice a week and a good clean once a week. small tanks require MORE care than larger tanks. (ask any nano reefer), so if possible, larger tanks are just easier to maintain.

and what do we equate "happiness" is for a fish? ive never seen a topic that brings it up?
if by "happy" you mean active and healthy, then a properly cared for 2.5 is JUST fine. dont go crazy with decor and get lots of easy plants instead. this is a subject that goes round and round. without ANY consensus. just a lot of bickering and opinions.
my bettas in smaller tanks are every bit as active and healthy as those in large tanks, bubblenests and all. so that must mean they are "happy". anthropomorphizing animals is not a good idea. behavior tells you that there is something wrong. "happiness" is something we use to make US feel better. health and vitality is what fishkeepers should be looking for to determine if a fish is "happy" or not.
again, my two cents on the matter.
cheers!