What The (xyz) Is Going On Here?

Okay, this is just weird. I've got two crowntail pairs, a red/blue and a metallic green. After much deliberation and hair tearing I decided to spawn the red/blue first, because they are the better matched pair and also the female of the other pair is bigger than the male (who is quite young), so I'd like to give him a bit more time to grow.

I just set up the spawning tank. Neither fish is conditioned yet, but I put the female in the chimney to see how he'd respond to her. And yeep! The male started swimming around the chimney flaring, which is exactly what I expected him to do. And then the 'female' started flaring back at him, with a beard, and attacking the glass the way I would expect a male to do. Then 'she' settled down a bit and is now floating away from him, almost sideways, swimming away from him as much as possible in the round chimney.

I was convinced that she was a female and this is why:
- I put her cup next to a male's at the shop and she barred up within seconds (but she isn't doing this now)
- She has horizontal lines on her sides that are there very faintly even when she is perfectly happy and not stressed, I have never seen this in a male.
- She is a crowntail and I've never seen a CTPK in Australia, and besides, the filaments on her fins are far, far too thin to be male.
- Her ventrals are shorter than her anal fin, her anal fin is not pointed, her fins just scream female.
- I've had her for close to three weeks, and if she was a young male she would have become visibly more 'male' in that time; she hasn't changed at all
- She has the white ovi spot

Her name is Nip, it's written on the photos. Raven is the male I want to use, and they match so well seeing them side by side... the pair is class embodied, I'm hoping I can get this to work. Does anybody think there is a chance that Nip could be a male? I just can't see it personally, but the behavior... weird!

One very confused Raven has vanished to the other end of the tank, and Nip is staring at him. She's barred up and put the beard away but she's still holding her fins fully erect.

dont ask me I think one of my boys could be a girl....sorry

I dont think nip is male - some females do flare and show off a bit when spawning I wouldnt worry, she may have felt threatened initially first day in a chimney with a big male. If it helps Ive had girls flare at the boys before and Mim my little PK girl flares at me when I go to feed her even. Maybe just Give Nip longer in the Chimney than you would normally. so a good few days or a week opposed to 2 days so she gets really used to him and doesnt feel frightened

Hmmm... should I condition in the chimney even?

LauraFrog said:

Hmmm... should I condition in the chimney even?

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Well it depends how clean you can keep her chimney really I think it could be difficult - Id say keep her tank next to his so she can see him whilst conditioning then try her in the chimney for 5 days rather than 2, or you could try a clear tank divider in his tank followed by chimney for 2-3 days

Nip definately looks like a female to me also, although not very eggy at present, perhaps this is why she hasn't been behaving as you thought she should she should egg up nicely in his presence though.

I would say female too, crowns are the easiest to sex, even with ctpk. You should see my HMPK female she's got a beard that out shines the male by far.

Female

I wouldn't personally condition in a chimney. It puts the female in constant stress, far better to condition away from the male

We had a CT female that behaved just like that....she had a beard that could outdo alot of males when she flared!!!!

I thought CT were more aggressive anyways which is why I've been afraid of keeping them... (is this a myth, am I wrong? ) Maybe that's why she's acting that way.

She looks female to me though. They're both lovely, good luck!

emeleeliggett said:

I thought CT were more aggressive anyways which is why I've been afraid of keeping them... (is this a myth, am I wrong? ) Maybe that's why she's acting that way.

She looks female to me though. They're both lovely, good luck!

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i believe they seem more aggressive and ctive because the reduced finnage.

They are certainly more active, it's part of the reason I like them so much... personally I prefer HMPK to HM as well, because even though a nice HM is beautiful the finnage they are breeding them with in Asia recently is just horrifying, the poor fish can barely swim. A HM/HMPK cross looks very nice.
But I don't think crowntails are more aggressive, I've never noticed it, and if you're keeping them alone or in divided tanks it shouldn't matter anyway. They won't attack you.

I'm a bit more confident now... Raven has built a nest in the 12-odd hours since Nip settled down and started acting female. I posted this thread at dusk and it's now midmorning, so not that much 'light time' and the nest is already fairly big, and hes' working on thickening it now. Nip has started to egg up. I think I will take her out of the chimney and condition for a few more days. I might put her back for an hour or two at a time though, because I don't want her to forget that she decided she liked Raven after all... I didn't think the pair was particularly well conditioned yet because all I've done so far is a week on increased feeding of Hikari pellets, with the plan being to introduce them and then go another week on bloodworms and live food.

I got some pretty good footage of Raven working on the nest and displaying to the female as well... I might put it on YouTube, but I would prefer to do the proper spawning process video once I have a VIDEO CAMERA and not video mode on a digital. (I'm planning to do a detailed video showing all the steps of breeding bettas, I can't believe nobody has done it yet. That will be for Best Fin Forward. It's not online yet because quotaless is playing up but I have written a few thousand words of content.)

I also got some photos of Raven's nest... and for good measure I'll chuck in one of Fiesta, I moved him to a different tank yesterday and apparently he likes it. He's the blue CT, looking ugly and lurking under the thick nest in tannin stained water. He's not usually this ugly. lol

Netty has a spawning video on Youtube There are breeding guide videos on there too.

Hi Laura

If you keep taking the female in and out, its just gonna stress her. Best to condition the male in the spawning tank, and the female in her own tank. Then put her in the chimney for a couple of days. We have found that if we do this, then release the female for an hour in the evening on the 2nd or 3rd day. Re-chimney her over night then release the following day and see what happens. If they dont look like they are going to spawn we put her back in the chimney for another day and then try again.