10g (us) Nano Diary (fowlr)

Dorkhedeos said:

jakeroberts said:

so wat fish are you thinking of getting for this tank also are u going to have any corals

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Its fowlr, that means no coral

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It's a FOWLR only for 1-2 months then I am going coral. This diary was mainly just to show how to do a cheap 10g FOWLR easily.

I plan on either just having a cleaner shrimp + snails and hermits or having this and a green clown goby. As for corals i'm just going with softies and some zoanthids.

If you get HQI instead of PCs, you can go sps. Watermelon chalice!!

Dorkhedeos said:

Watermelon chalice!!

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Second Morgatge

Day 10

My T5 HO lights should arrive at my LFS today. I'm not free all day so I may just have to get them tomorrow.

Here's some shots of my tank when I got out of class last night. The Yellow Coral Banded Shrimp has stayed in that spot since I got him. He needs to explore and clean that brown algae.




I just got him yesterday but it's been about 24hrs so I'm hoping he's fine. I acclimated him for an hour before releasing him.

More updates as they come.

Dorkhedeos said:

Musho3210 said:

mechanical filtration IMO is the best filtration you can have in saltwater tanks. The problem is they get so clogged with junk that the constant flow through the junk is causing bacteria to convert ammonia to nitrate faster than bacteria can convert nitrate to nitrogen gas or plants using it for growth.

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That is like 30% true. You forgot about the nitrite to nitrate. Its not about how fast ammonia is being converted into nitrite and how fast nitrite is being converted to nitrate, because you want that to happen as quickly as possible(which you already know from the brackish post). The main reason why they are called nitrate factories is because they just trap poo and they don't have ANY bacteria that converts nitrate to nitrogen gas. As long as you clean it out once every 2-3 days, it should be fine though. Just dont buy bioballs, they are useless if you have enough live rock, and you do have enough.

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thats pretty much exactly what i said..... you just went into more detail. In a perfect tank the ammonia will go to nitrite then to nitrate then to nitrogen gas with no buildup of any of them. With a mechanical filter once it gets full of junk it starts producing nitrates faster than bacteria can produce nitrogen gas. So the balance is ruined and there is nitrate build-up faster than there is a nitrogen gas outgassing.

Why are you pulling the brackish post in here, you are just trying to put something against me, what has the brackish post got anything to do with this? You might hate me from the thread and i dont care at all because i dont like you either for pulling something like that into here. Either you didnt read properly or you just hate my guts thats why you are saying im only 30% right even though you pretty much said everything i said except added nitrites and going into more detail.

What you said was not completely true, because you said converting it that fast was a problem. Unless you have a specific chamber just for the anaerobic bacteria or you stock pretty dang lightly, the nitrogen gassing will almost never match the nitrate build up.

I believe i pulled up the brackish post because i was a little frustrated that my paper was due the next morning and i wasnt getting much progress on it(up for 32 hours, go figure) and you like put so much emphasis on the cycling process, which is what this is all about anyways. I think most of the stuff i posted on that day had a negative feeling to it anyways, so dont think i was targeting you. Now that i think of it, it was a lot more than 30% true, probably in the high 60s to 70s.

I dont see why you make this like so dramatic by saying i hate you and all even though i only like argued with you like once before this. I know i wasnt supposed to call that out, but hey, i wasnt in such a good mood. I think this may be the first time ive called somebody out in 4 years, which isnt too bad is it?(if you want to check, look back in my history, im too lazy to do that ) Hating people is something that im really bad at since i dont really like harming myself. Hatred does not harm the hated, it only harms the hater. If you dont like me, fine with me, but it certainly doesnt mean i dislike you.

If you see this an as apology, see it as that if you wish. If you know me, then you would know that im only getting things straight. Thats how i roll.

i made it dramatic for one reason, i took it as a personal attack, not something that was informative, it was a personal attack. I take these things seriously and i do not like it when it is done. No one does a personal attack unless they dont like the person they do it to in my opinion and thats why i added the hate stuff. Even if you were in a bad, tired mood, it doesnt mean you can go on attacking people. If you were attacking me but didnt hate me, then im sorry i took it the wrong way. And yes, i do apologize.

Do you mind telling me why it is a nitrate factory, cause technically you are doing the same thing live rock is by converting ammonia to nitrite, and like you said there isnt much de-nitrifying gas in the sandbed and rocks, so it still makes it a nitrate factory.

I would love for my tank to have no nitrifying bacteria at all, this way my skimmer can take out DOC's. Plenty of people have no nitrate environment without any water changes done, i should have been more specific saying that not only denitrifying chambers in the sand bed and in the rocks but also protein skimming and refugium with loads of macro algae. These people dont do any water changes at all and they can go on for a few years like this. Of course they need to somehow deliver other nutritions into the tank by dosing but lets not get into that.

If my test kit is accurate my tank is a 0 nitrate environment for a full week since i do weekly water changes. This is most likely due to de-nitrifying bacteria in my rocks, my protein skimmer, and my macro algae, as well as my mechanical filtration which gets more gunk than my skimmer does.

The main reason is because they dont have any place for the anaerobic bacteria to grow, so you dont get the gas. Ive also heard it was like too efficient or something like that, but i cant explain this one because IMO, nothing can be too efficient. Live rock has crevices deep into the rock and little pores everywhere that have very little to no oxygen. The little crevices and pores dont seem like much, but if you combine them all, it actually does something.

Protein skimmers take the waste out before it can go through the process of turning into ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate, so it eliminates all 3 before they can even form, this is why you have close to 0 nitrate. What i am thinking right now is that your nitrate and gassing is pretty close to being balanced by the live rock because a lot of the waste is being taken out immediately. If you didnt have the skimmer, you would have a lot of nitrate.

If you dont mind trying this, take out your filter floss and see if it makes any difference in your nitrate. What i am thinking is that your foam or whatever you use is catching waste that the skimmer missed, but since its a closed system, the waste will end up in the skimmer anyhow. Sure the extra media is nice, but wouldnt it be nicer to just have to clean out the skimmer daily than cleaning both?


Edit: Just to let you know, i might not be 100% sure about all this stuff, i dont even have a saltwater tank myself, but i maintain 700+ gallon systems so i guess it balances out. Im going to plop together a pico tank tonight and see how my first tank goes.

Dorkhedeos said:

The main reason is because they dont have any place for the anaerobic bacteria to grow, so you dont get the gas. Ive also heard it was like too efficient or something like that, but i cant explain this one because IMO, nothing can be too efficient. Live rock has crevices deep into the rock and little pores everywhere that have very little to no oxygen. The little crevices and pores dont seem like much, but if you combine them all, it actually does something.

Protein skimmers take the waste out before it can go through the process of turning into ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate, so it eliminates all 3 before they can even form, this is why you have close to 0 nitrate. What i am thinking right now is that your nitrate and gassing is pretty close to being balanced by the live rock because a lot of the waste is being taken out immediately. If you didnt have the skimmer, you would have a lot of nitrate.

If you dont mind trying this, take out your filter floss and see if it makes any difference in your nitrate. What i am thinking is that your foam or whatever you use is catching waste that the skimmer missed, but since its a closed system, the waste will end up in the skimmer anyhow. Sure the extra media is nice, but wouldnt it be nicer to just have to clean out the skimmer daily than cleaning both?


Edit: Just to let you know, i might not be 100% sure about all this stuff, i dont even have a saltwater tank myself, but i maintain 700+ gallon systems so i guess it balances out. Im going to plop together a pico tank tonight and see how my first tank goes.

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no, i wont take out my floss, i clean it 1-3 days, my nitrate is at 0, and my tank is crystal clear. I cant believe how much better my tank is with it. I dont mind cleaning it all. I can take out my floss and look at a tank with quite a lot of particles flowing around in it, or put the floss on and look at a clear tank and provide a way of nutrient export.

Skimmer does its job great, i love it, but it doesnt clear my tank.

I start today (it's 9am here) with near assuredness that I will have my lights by this afternoon. The only way that this won't happen is that if the delivery truck does not get there until after 3:30pm. After that time I won't be able to pick it up so we'll have to chalk up another day.

I went to my LFS yesterday because they were supposed to get sometime in that they didn't so I was all pumped to leave with a big bag. This didn't happen so to feed my insatiable WESTERN CONSUMERISMMMMMM I just had to buy something. I planned on buying either a fish or my clean up crew with the lights so I picked one. I left the LFS with 6 snails and 4 hermits.

Hopefully a real update in 13~ hours when I'm home from work.